Strategic differentiation
teh_fatts
Join Date: 2004-06-21 Member: 29442Members
Join Date: 2004-06-21 Member: 29442Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Looks ain't everything</div>One of the things I enjoyed most about NS1 was the difference of leadership and teamwork structure between the two sides. Sure, it was a balance nightmare with public play often heavily favoring the marines due to how much more easily their model adapted to an environment with strangers, but I always liked seeing those times when the alien team really came together and took advantage of their decentralized features.
I will miss that dichotomy in NS2, but I am not hostile to the whole "alien commander" thing. Indeed, as a Gorge primary, I spent enough time essentially taking the reigns of the alien team because no one was working together to know how handy this will be.
That said, I think there's still a lot of potential for maintaining or introducing some strong strategic differences between the two sides above and beyond just the level of how the life-forms differ from marine equipment.
For example, aliens still have Gorges, and they still build our Offensive Chamber equivalent (love that the old meta-mod of allowing structure growth on walls/ceilings is now integrated, by the way). Are there plans for other tactical structures from the gorge?
The dynamic infestation is obviously going to be one of the stronger examples of this, but then the marines' power grid seems roughly analogous.
As for the obvious similarity between Drifters and the buildbots, I just don't see Drifters fitting into the overall Alien aesthetic as well as the bot does for the marines. The marines are definitely about escorting a welder into the unknown, protecting your advance while the structures get set up... the aliens have traditionally been "sneak out, expand where the marines aren't and slow them down where they are." I for one would cut them in favor of allowing structure placement either via Gorge, whether the Gorge places them himself or merely must be nearby for the alien commander to place, or better yet via "anywhere the dynamic infestation has reached."
What if one of the commander-roles was developed more with an eye towards non-combat development and environmental manipulation while the other was focused more on combat assistance and player organization?
...It's hard to make specific suggestions on this topic so early, but it's something I'd like the developers to keep in mind. The vast differences in even the most basic functions of the two sides in NS1 really added to its long-term play value; switching sides was almost like playing an entirely different game. Keep that resource if you possibly can.
I will miss that dichotomy in NS2, but I am not hostile to the whole "alien commander" thing. Indeed, as a Gorge primary, I spent enough time essentially taking the reigns of the alien team because no one was working together to know how handy this will be.
That said, I think there's still a lot of potential for maintaining or introducing some strong strategic differences between the two sides above and beyond just the level of how the life-forms differ from marine equipment.
For example, aliens still have Gorges, and they still build our Offensive Chamber equivalent (love that the old meta-mod of allowing structure growth on walls/ceilings is now integrated, by the way). Are there plans for other tactical structures from the gorge?
The dynamic infestation is obviously going to be one of the stronger examples of this, but then the marines' power grid seems roughly analogous.
As for the obvious similarity between Drifters and the buildbots, I just don't see Drifters fitting into the overall Alien aesthetic as well as the bot does for the marines. The marines are definitely about escorting a welder into the unknown, protecting your advance while the structures get set up... the aliens have traditionally been "sneak out, expand where the marines aren't and slow them down where they are." I for one would cut them in favor of allowing structure placement either via Gorge, whether the Gorge places them himself or merely must be nearby for the alien commander to place, or better yet via "anywhere the dynamic infestation has reached."
What if one of the commander-roles was developed more with an eye towards non-combat development and environmental manipulation while the other was focused more on combat assistance and player organization?
...It's hard to make specific suggestions on this topic so early, but it's something I'd like the developers to keep in mind. The vast differences in even the most basic functions of the two sides in NS1 really added to its long-term play value; switching sides was almost like playing an entirely different game. Keep that resource if you possibly can.
Comments
I would like to see the alien commander stay but take a different role to the marine commander.
I would like to see the marine commander continue as the "commander of the marines" whilst the alien commander I think would work better as a support role.
Sort of how gorges worked in NS1... They do alot of the economy building and upgrade unlocking but are not the ones leading the team.
I would like to see the alien commander stay but take a different role to the marine commander...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
...I'm not sure if you misread me, or are simply agreeing with me, but I never asked for the alien commander to be removed.
If anything, I suggested the exact same thing you just did, but without specifying which commander as "combat/organization" and which as "environment/development" focused.
Though, yes, at first glance the Marine commander would seem the logical pick for the former and the Alien commander the logical pick for the latter.
Unfortunately it seems in NS2 (at least at present) the gorge is relegated to being a second-stringer who just heals and drops OCs (and possibly other offensive structures?). In the community I played with what we weren't looking forward to was gorges that JUST dropped a Wall of Lame somewhere on the map to hopefully increase their kills (there are obvious exceptions, but still). I hope that the devs take this stuff under consideration, because the gorges being the main builders of the alien team was not only quite fun, but served to greatly differentiate the aliens from the marines.
I like your idea of the alien comm being more about organization than being the major mover of the team like the marine comm. I would even suggest taking it a step further and make the comm decentralized from the hive itself, so the hive isn't a direct analogy to the CC. If the alien comm is indeed supposed to be a hive consciousness, why not simply use the model for commanding interface than Battlefield 2 did and have the commander stay a skulk/gorge, etc. Have them not even need to be at a hive (maybe give some minor bonus for being at one) but allow them to stay in the field as gorges or skulks/lerks for first-hand recon. If necessary you could block comms from being onos/fade to dissuade glory hounds from trying to carry the team AND comm at the same time. Use capslock or something to have them bring up the command menu and assume an overhead view of the map and enter the commander interface (if the comm is indeed supposed to be a distributed consciousness of all of the aliens and hives, it shouldn't matter too much where the alien comm is. Maybe limit their ability to access the comm menu to areas that have infestation in them? This allows aliens to:
1. Have a centralized authority figure who can decide what chambers to drop (a source of contention frequently in ns1)
2. Keep their +1 effective player advantage as a similarity to ns1.
3. Keep themselves more 'distributed' than marines, and preserve the differences between the two sides.
4. Have someone to plan overall strategy for the team (waypoints, build orders, maybe squads?)
5. Other stuff that I can't think of at the moment.
In BF2, the comm could give orders/waypoints, and command the team, then if necessary actually help his men assault and capture a position (though he got no points for kills/assists while comm, to balance out and prevent point-hoarding). This wasn't always the smartest decision (couldn't comm/scan/drop supplies while dead), but was a valid tactic and one that could win games. If the alien comm is expected to not be in the chair the whole time anyways or at least have less to do than the marine comm (don't need to be constantly vigilant to drop meds/ammo), you may as well give them the ability to stay afield and not tie them to the hive room (which could get boring). As for choosing a comm, maybe an election system would work well at the start of a round, or simply have one skulk hop into the hive and become the comm, then they can leave the hive and comm from wherever.
this ended up being way too long. :/
Overall I'm inclined to agree on most points. However, I'm not 100% sure what the Gorge's abilities will be in the whole scheme of things and I haven't seen the Hydra in battle. It may be that they are very effective fighters now and not completely back-line useless. Pardon my ignorance but I haven't done much testing on the Gorge/Alien Comm yet.
Moving the Alien Commander to the playing ground would be a very interesting move and I think could work really, really well. Is there currently a requirement to become the Alien Commander besides go to Hive?
Hm, I'll have to play around and think more on this.