Having a higher base price ($29.99 or whatever) leaves a bit more wiggle room for them to have specials without practically giving the game away. They can easily lower the price into "impulse buy" range temporarily if they want.
<!--quoteo(post=1779845:date=Jul 16 2010, 06:18 PM:name=peregrinus)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (peregrinus @ Jul 16 2010, 06:18 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1779845"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think the price is OK. After all many of us played NS1 for free!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And even more people made custom models and maps and gamemodes for NS1 to keep it alive, for free. NS Armslab, Stargate_xt9, Stargate_nsa, Supersiege_003, marine vs marine... the list goes on and on. It's like the devs started something and the community took it further.
<!--quoteo(post=1778993:date=Jul 15 2010, 04:36 AM:name=Jimyd)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jimyd @ Jul 15 2010, 04:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1778993"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And honestly, this game is easily a $40-$50 value once NS2 hits post release patch 2.0/3.0, as we all know from the experience of playing NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait a minute... you're saying NS got better after the death of 1.04, Heathen.
<!--quoteo(post=1780242:date=Jul 17 2010, 08:56 PM:name=n00b3h)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (n00b3h @ Jul 17 2010, 08:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780242"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Wait a minute... you're saying NS got better after the death of 1.04, Heathen.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Yeah, I loved 1.04, liked 2.x and didn't much care for 3.x. Don't know what to expect with NS2.
<!--quoteo(post=1780388:date=Jul 18 2010, 09:48 AM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Jul 18 2010, 09:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780388"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Yeah, I loved 1.04, liked 2.x and didn't much care for 3.x. Don't know what to expect with NS2.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I wasn't an NS player, so I'm curious about this. What changed in those versions that the community didn't like?
<!--quoteo(post=1780389:date=Jul 18 2010, 03:51 PM:name=ZimbuTheMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ZimbuTheMonkey @ Jul 18 2010, 03:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780389"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I wasn't an NS player, so I'm curious about this. What changed in those versions that the community didn't like?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Gameplay changed a bit, but the biggest change was the community. For some reason you got more and more tarts destroying games.
Thats btw why i preordered the SE to get into the Alpha: I expect the Alpha and Beta community to be much more fun, because those of us who spend the money for the Alpha/Beta are aware of what they doing. :)
<!--quoteo(post=1780390:date=Jul 18 2010, 10:03 AM:name=basti53)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (basti53 @ Jul 18 2010, 10:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780390"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Gameplay changed a bit, but the biggest change was the community. For some reason you got more and more tarts destroying games.
Thats btw why i preordered the SE to get into the Alpha: I expect the Alpha and Beta community to be much more fun, <b>because those of us who spend the money for the Alpha/Beta are aware of what they doing</b>. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll be playing the alpha and beta, so don't count on EVERYONE to be that aware.
<!--quoteo(post=1780389:date=Jul 18 2010, 09:51 AM:name=ZimbuTheMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ZimbuTheMonkey @ Jul 18 2010, 09:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780389"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I wasn't an NS player, so I'm curious about this. What changed in those versions that the community didn't like?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Virtually ever aspect of NS has been tweaked in some way through the versions but what disappointed me the most was the game was increasingly simplified and made more user friendly, good in theory but I think the game lost a lot of what made it special in the process. The way I see NS in its current version is that the game starts, the teams go with one of only a few viable strategies, one team gains the upper hand within the first 5 or 10 minutes which decides the rest of the round and it is over in 30 minutes. That seems to be the format of every round, with exception to the few successful rush attacks here and there.
I think older versions of NS left many more options for teams, making each round more unique and the game left more room for a last minute come back from the loosing team, adding much more interest. The greater use of turrets and OCs, considered by some to be detrimental to game play, I felt gave a sense of actually controlling territory and creating a front line, something hard to come by in a FPS.
I think that you should never pay more than 40$ for a game you play for less than a year. Take for instance, halo, COD and others. the game comes out, sell more than a million 1st day,everyone plays it strong for the 1st month, they slowly die, next game comes out, its a ghost town.
<!--quoteo(post=1780392:date=Jul 18 2010, 03:21 PM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Jul 18 2010, 03:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780392"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Virtually ever aspect of NS has been tweaked in some way through the versions but what disappointed me the most was the game was increasingly simplified and made more user friendly, good in theory but I think the game lost a lot of what made it special in the process. The way I see NS in its current version is that the game starts, the teams go with one of only a few viable strategies, one team gains the upper hand within the first 5 or 10 minutes which decides the rest of the round and it is over in 30 minutes. That seems to be the format of every round, with exception to the few successful rush attacks here and there.
I think older versions of NS left many more options for teams, making each round more unique and the game left more room for a last minute come back from the loosing team, adding much more interest. The greater use of turrets and OCs, considered by some to be detrimental to game play, I felt gave a sense of actually controlling territory and creating a front line, something hard to come by in a FPS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I think you're confusing the gameplay changes with the natural progress of gameplay. 1.04 was still extremely limited compared to the present one, it was just a new game back then. People had no clue how to play the game, thus every round was full of extremely random unexplored stuff. I remember playing some rounds that felt extremely epic back then when I had no clue about the actual game mechanics. Nowadays I just end up thinking what on earth the oppositing team was doing to let us back to the game.
If you take a look at late 1.04 EU vs USA match, you can see how the gameplay was already shifting to its limits. Both teams controlled the game totally as marines, because the alien model was ridiculously limited with only lerks and skulks avaible before the 2nd hive. Meanwhile marines teched up to jetpacks and finished the game unless aliens did something totally off the wall. It was far less creative and probably would've been far more repetetive in the long run than the games nowadays. The most interesting thing was to see what kind of cheesy moves aliens tried, but most were easily countered and fended off even without much pratise against the specific strategy.
What NS did with 2.0 transition was necessary for the survival of the game in my opinion. The 1.0 structure was starting to reach most of its limits on organised play and it was only a matter of time before the public games would follow.
As for the long endgame, it's all up to players and the server. I'd much rather play rounds to the point where they are interesting for the both teams, but a lot of people and servers seem to prefer prolonging the rounds and huge imbalanced marine teams instead of allowing quick forfeits and balanced gameplay. 1.0 era wasn't much better on that, except maybe for having an imbalanced jetpack setup against totally helpless 1 hive aliens, which helped in finishing the game.
<!--quoteo(post=1781150:date=Jul 20 2010, 04:53 PM:name=DigitalFirefly)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DigitalFirefly @ Jul 20 2010, 04:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1781150"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I could have sworn I read that the regular version is going to $39.95 once the special edition goes away.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Never read or heard of that.
This is a team of people with 'professional' skills within their industry, and expect to be making a fairly good living.
How much do you think it costs for the salary's of 4/5 permanent members of staff, plus the freelancing they hire out and all the equipment/website/licensing for adobe packages etc, and everything involved in producing a stand alone game. I'm telling you that they for sure work longer than your standard 8 hour shifts, sacrificing their time for something they are passionate about.
Not only that, but it is priced at a very low cost compared to any new game on the market. In the UK Modern Warfare 2 was £40 (£50 for consoles in some places) on steam, that is $60. Plus due to a massive advertisement budget, a lot more units can be bought which generally means more return.
Clue up.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nice, you just said the working people don't work as much as these developers. So we earn money and spend it, just to see a guy say we don't work as hard as the people we gave money to.
<!--quoteo(post=1780986:date=Jul 20 2010, 05:44 AM:name=Bacillus)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bacillus @ Jul 20 2010, 05:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780986"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->A bit of thread revival, but whatever...
I think you're confusing the gameplay changes with the natural progress of gameplay. 1.04 was still extremely limited compared to the present one, it was just a new game back then. People had no clue how to play the game, thus every round was full of extremely random unexplored stuff. I remember playing some rounds that felt extremely epic back then when I had no clue about the actual game mechanics. Nowadays I just end up thinking what on earth the oppositing team was doing to let us back to the game.
If you take a look at late 1.04 EU vs USA match, you can see how the gameplay was already shifting to its limits. Both teams controlled the game totally as marines, because the alien model was ridiculously limited with only lerks and skulks avaible before the 2nd hive. Meanwhile marines teched up to jetpacks and finished the game unless aliens did something totally off the wall. It was far less creative and probably would've been far more repetetive in the long run than the games nowadays. The most interesting thing was to see what kind of cheesy moves aliens tried, but most were easily countered and fended off even without much pratise against the specific strategy.
What NS did with 2.0 transition was necessary for the survival of the game in my opinion. The 1.0 structure was starting to reach most of its limits on organised play and it was only a matter of time before the public games would follow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
While I do agree with your organised play answer,I disagree with the public. In 1.04 from what I remeber the public barely tried organized play strats maybe 1 in 10 games. I mostly remeber relocating, locking down hives, controling double and strategic areas of the map. I hate the build limits and the fact your cant make walls of lame or block off elevators. Teams used to listen and band together to keep marines away from hive areas. Alot of interesting/exploitable strats disappeared with 2.0 and with the induction of rez for kills it went from mapcontrol/strategic placement to getting kills and ramboing. A more combat focus you could say.
Thats the part that bothers me, was ns being balanced for "organized play" or "public play". It kinda split the community I mean there are poeple who still state 1.04 was the best while other agrue it isnt.
Kouji_SanSr. Hινε UÏкεεÏεг - EUPT DeputyThe NetherlandsJoin Date: 2003-05-13Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited July 2010
1.04 was a nice version, but the engine couldn't really handle all the stress without building limits among other things like runtime entities over 275 in a map and hitbox bugs :P
But at least it had more RTS in it then the later versions, which in the end even turned into "oh we need these hey buildings for our upgrades". Electrifying stuff kinda struck another blow to the epic turret farms. And the aliens stacking buildings had been halted with the halo of nobuild around all buildings.
Buildings without meaningful map control value suck... At least NS2, with dynamic infestation, seems to lean towards the RTS genre once more... We shall see ay :P
<!--quoteo(post=1780663:date=Jul 19 2010, 03:24 AM:name=ctoon6)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ctoon6 @ Jul 19 2010, 03:24 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780663"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think that you should never pay more than 40$ for a game you play for less than a year. Take for instance, halo, COD and others. the game comes out, sell more than a million 1st day,everyone plays it strong for the 1st month, they slowly die, next game comes out, its a ghost town.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
By that logic we should be paying pennies to attend movies and maybe a few bucks at most for concerts.
I think we should be paying twice what we do for games.
I suppose though that you think mcdonalds is a great place to eat on a regular basis...
Games are extremely good value for entertainment. If NS2 ends up being the quality that I imagined it to be, the 40 dollars I have spent will bring me a lot of value.
<!--quoteo(post=1781456:date=Jul 21 2010, 02:14 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Jul 21 2010, 02:14 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1781456"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->1.04 was a nice version, but the engine couldn't really handle all the stress without building limits among other things like runtime entities over 275 in a map and hitbox bugs :P<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yea, not to mention placing to many laser mines would crash a server. It still sucks with the building limits, I would rather take an unstable version with larger building limits then a stable with. Hell at the end of the game I remeber being a commander and recycle some of our turret farms for fear of the server crashing. Also the shotgun cocking animation was so perfect.... I know it more of a comestic thing but it really was perfect. It made the shotgun out to have some omph.
<!--quoteo(post=1778864:date=Jul 14 2010, 10:59 PM:name=ZimbuTheMonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ZimbuTheMonkey @ Jul 14 2010, 10:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1778864"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I have an inherent problem with committing and putting down cash for a game I haven't even tried. This is why I generally despise preorder incentives.
I'm getting the special edition, but I feel dirty about it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me make it easier for you:
You cannot quantify eternal, hence your gain/money spent ratio is infinite :)
My partner and I got 2 SE copies of NS2 for $111 NZD. This is cheap to us considering we're used to forking out $70-100 each for the standard version of other games, most of which were bought on impulse and didn't get replayed after the six month mark. We're both longtime fans of NS1 and have followed NS2's development on and off over the years so we're confident that we've made a good investment.
Comments
And even more people made custom models and maps and gamemodes for NS1 to keep it alive, for free. NS Armslab, Stargate_xt9, Stargate_nsa, Supersiege_003, marine vs marine... the list goes on and on. It's like the devs started something and the community took it further.
Wait a minute... you're saying NS got better after the death of 1.04, Heathen.
It's shrewd, it shows positive business acumen and as an interested party in Indie Dev I applaud it.
Yeah, I loved 1.04, liked 2.x and didn't much care for 3.x. Don't know what to expect with NS2.
I wasn't an NS player, so I'm curious about this. What changed in those versions that the community didn't like?
Gameplay changed a bit, but the biggest change was the community. For some reason you got more and more tarts destroying games.
Thats btw why i preordered the SE to get into the Alpha: I expect the Alpha and Beta community to be much more fun, because those of us who spend the money for the Alpha/Beta are aware of what they doing. :)
Thats btw why i preordered the SE to get into the Alpha: I expect the Alpha and Beta community to be much more fun, <b>because those of us who spend the money for the Alpha/Beta are aware of what they doing</b>. :)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'll be playing the alpha and beta, so don't count on EVERYONE to be that aware.
Virtually ever aspect of NS has been tweaked in some way through the versions but what disappointed me the most was the game was increasingly simplified and made more user friendly, good in theory but I think the game lost a lot of what made it special in the process. The way I see NS in its current version is that the game starts, the teams go with one of only a few viable strategies, one team gains the upper hand within the first 5 or 10 minutes which decides the rest of the round and it is over in 30 minutes. That seems to be the format of every round, with exception to the few successful rush attacks here and there.
I think older versions of NS left many more options for teams, making each round more unique and the game left more room for a last minute come back from the loosing team, adding much more interest. The greater use of turrets and OCs, considered by some to be detrimental to game play, I felt gave a sense of actually controlling territory and creating a front line, something hard to come by in a FPS.
<!--quoteo(post=1780392:date=Jul 18 2010, 03:21 PM:name=Sops)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Sops @ Jul 18 2010, 03:21 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1780392"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Virtually ever aspect of NS has been tweaked in some way through the versions but what disappointed me the most was the game was increasingly simplified and made more user friendly, good in theory but I think the game lost a lot of what made it special in the process. The way I see NS in its current version is that the game starts, the teams go with one of only a few viable strategies, one team gains the upper hand within the first 5 or 10 minutes which decides the rest of the round and it is over in 30 minutes. That seems to be the format of every round, with exception to the few successful rush attacks here and there.
I think older versions of NS left many more options for teams, making each round more unique and the game left more room for a last minute come back from the loosing team, adding much more interest. The greater use of turrets and OCs, considered by some to be detrimental to game play, I felt gave a sense of actually controlling territory and creating a front line, something hard to come by in a FPS.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I think you're confusing the gameplay changes with the natural progress of gameplay. 1.04 was still extremely limited compared to the present one, it was just a new game back then. People had no clue how to play the game, thus every round was full of extremely random unexplored stuff. I remember playing some rounds that felt extremely epic back then when I had no clue about the actual game mechanics. Nowadays I just end up thinking what on earth the oppositing team was doing to let us back to the game.
If you take a look at late 1.04 EU vs USA match, you can see how the gameplay was already shifting to its limits. Both teams controlled the game totally as marines, because the alien model was ridiculously limited with only lerks and skulks avaible before the 2nd hive. Meanwhile marines teched up to jetpacks and finished the game unless aliens did something totally off the wall. It was far less creative and probably would've been far more repetetive in the long run than the games nowadays. The most interesting thing was to see what kind of cheesy moves aliens tried, but most were easily countered and fended off even without much pratise against the specific strategy.
What NS did with 2.0 transition was necessary for the survival of the game in my opinion. The 1.0 structure was starting to reach most of its limits on organised play and it was only a matter of time before the public games would follow.
As for the long endgame, it's all up to players and the server. I'd much rather play rounds to the point where they are interesting for the both teams, but a lot of people and servers seem to prefer prolonging the rounds and huge imbalanced marine teams instead of allowing quick forfeits and balanced gameplay. 1.0 era wasn't much better on that, except maybe for having an imbalanced jetpack setup against totally helpless 1 hive aliens, which helped in finishing the game.
Never read or heard of that.
This is a team of people with 'professional' skills within their industry, and expect to be making a fairly good living.
How much do you think it costs for the salary's of 4/5 permanent members of staff, plus the freelancing they hire out and all the equipment/website/licensing for adobe packages etc, and everything involved in producing a stand alone game. I'm telling you that they for sure work longer than your standard 8 hour shifts, sacrificing their time for something they are passionate about.
Not only that, but it is priced at a very low cost compared to any new game on the market. In the UK Modern Warfare 2 was £40 (£50 for consoles in some places) on steam, that is $60. Plus due to a massive advertisement budget, a lot more units can be bought which generally means more return.
Clue up.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nice, you just said the working people don't work as much as these developers. So we earn money and spend it, just to see a guy say we don't work as hard as the people we gave money to.
I think you're confusing the gameplay changes with the natural progress of gameplay. 1.04 was still extremely limited compared to the present one, it was just a new game back then. People had no clue how to play the game, thus every round was full of extremely random unexplored stuff. I remember playing some rounds that felt extremely epic back then when I had no clue about the actual game mechanics. Nowadays I just end up thinking what on earth the oppositing team was doing to let us back to the game.
If you take a look at late 1.04 EU vs USA match, you can see how the gameplay was already shifting to its limits. Both teams controlled the game totally as marines, because the alien model was ridiculously limited with only lerks and skulks avaible before the 2nd hive. Meanwhile marines teched up to jetpacks and finished the game unless aliens did something totally off the wall. It was far less creative and probably would've been far more repetetive in the long run than the games nowadays. The most interesting thing was to see what kind of cheesy moves aliens tried, but most were easily countered and fended off even without much pratise against the specific strategy.
What NS did with 2.0 transition was necessary for the survival of the game in my opinion. The 1.0 structure was starting to reach most of its limits on organised play and it was only a matter of time before the public games would follow.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
While I do agree with your organised play answer,I disagree with the public. In 1.04 from what I remeber the public barely tried organized play strats maybe 1 in 10 games. I mostly remeber relocating, locking down hives, controling double and strategic areas of the map. I hate the build limits and the fact your cant make walls of lame or block off elevators. Teams used to listen and band together to keep marines away from hive areas. Alot of interesting/exploitable strats disappeared with 2.0 and with the induction of rez for kills it went from mapcontrol/strategic placement to getting kills and ramboing. A more combat focus you could say.
Thats the part that bothers me, was ns being balanced for "organized play" or "public play". It kinda split the community I mean there are poeple who still state 1.04 was the best while other agrue it isnt.
But at least it had more RTS in it then the later versions, which in the end even turned into "oh we need these hey buildings for our upgrades". Electrifying stuff kinda struck another blow to the epic turret farms. And the aliens stacking buildings had been halted with the halo of nobuild around all buildings.
Buildings without meaningful map control value suck... At least NS2, with dynamic infestation, seems to lean towards the RTS genre once more... We shall see ay :P
By that logic we should be paying pennies to attend movies and maybe a few bucks at most for concerts.
I think we should be paying twice what we do for games.
I suppose though that you think mcdonalds is a great place to eat on a regular basis...
Yea, not to mention placing to many laser mines would crash a server. It still sucks with the building limits, I would rather take an unstable version with larger building limits then a stable with. Hell at the end of the game I remeber being a commander and recycle some of our turret farms for fear of the server crashing. Also the shotgun cocking animation was so perfect.... I know it more of a comestic thing but it really was perfect. It made the shotgun out to have some omph.
I'm getting the special edition, but I feel dirty about it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me make it easier for you:
You cannot quantify eternal, hence your gain/money spent ratio is infinite :)