i never said aliens were too easy or too op.. simply a neat feature would be this...
the equivalent to this is having a marine stay near the wall where the fade would likely have his escape route and have the commander place a cc or armory press E to activate it and block the fades exit stratedgy.. is it really such a hard thing to understand?
I have played ns1, i stopped about half a year ago as the aussie servers are dying out and ausns pugs stopped being less common, i understand the core of the game and am actually a more devoted alien player then marine player,
oh btw big guns? big ###### guns? they did get rid of hmg you know.. right?You have no idea that motion trackings still in, so much your just guessing.
that in itself shows you that its almost a completly different game so stop shooting down ideas that might be cool to have in the newer game.
There's a reason why UWE implemented the mechanic where structures after being dropped and translucent disappear when an alien touches or attacks the structure in NS1.
<!--quoteo(post=1756668:date=Mar 3 2010, 02:42 AM:name=xmaine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xmaine @ Mar 3 2010, 02:42 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756668"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Fades are already weak. They only have 300hp 150ap, 250ap with carapace plus a +20hp initial regeneration.
By the time fades are out you should have lvl 1 damage so your lmg does 11dmg per bullet. An lmg clip can deal 550damage. More than enough to kill a fade.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No. Armor points count as 2 health points. Thus, paper fades have 600 hp equivalently, 300 from health and 2x150 from armor. One lmg magazine will not kill a fade. Add on some 20 damage pistol shots onto a perfect accuracy lmg magazine discharge and you can down a fade. Two or more good accuracy lmg discharges can kill a fade with less difficulty.
You're right about the shotgun, though.
<!--quoteo(post=1756865:date=Mar 3 2010, 08:29 PM:name=PSA)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PSA @ Mar 3 2010, 08:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756865"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->2) If Fade got dropped to 10 res (Ha!!) then he would be balanced accordingly and made extremely weak, so this wouldn't be a problem anyways. The scenario you proposed is basically saying "Well, What if the devs TOTALLY unbalance the game?!?! Did you think about that?!?!"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
HA and JP cost 15/10 res. 10 res Fade is not so unlikely considering Aliens are getting a team resource pool instead of their current crappy individual pools (Thanks, Unknown Worlds!). I'd peg it at equivalent cost to JP/HA or perhaps a bit more. Not really sure. So 15 or 20 if the resource expenditure scale is the same as NS1.
<!--quoteo(post=1756938:date=Mar 4 2010, 06:48 AM:name=yourbonesakin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (yourbonesakin @ Mar 4 2010, 06:48 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756938"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->HA and JP cost 15/10 res. 10 res Fade is not so unlikely considering Aliens are getting a team resource pool instead of their current crappy individual pools (Thanks, Unknown Worlds!). I'd peg it at equivalent cost to JP/HA or perhaps a bit more. Not really sure. So 15 or 20 if the resource expenditure scale is the same as NS1.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
My point is, is that if they were made "cheap" (whatever that means now in relation to NS2) it would be scaled to the Fade's strength, Marines strength, and speed of resource gain. So the argument was silly to begin with.
<!--quoteo(post=1756939:date=Mar 4 2010, 01:51 AM:name=PSA)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PSA @ Mar 4 2010, 01:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756939"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My point is, is that if they were made "cheap" (whatever that means now in relation to NS2) it would be scaled to the Fade's strength, Marines strength, and speed of resource gain. So the argument was silly to begin with.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Okay. I thought you were implying that Fades would be less combaty than Lerks. I was just pointing out that Fades are likely to cost much less than 50 resources, and also pointing out that the alien resource model is entirely revamped so our sense of scale needs to change (or we'll have silly arguments for nothing).
That line of thought makes me think Fades will be handed out like HMG's. That makes me think they will be less powerful than they are in NS1. Of course, Unknown Worlds could make a gigantic mistake and keep Fade cost at 50 resources and keep the insane pressure on one person to kill every single marine. I postulate that the pressure to use the resources well and the ability to kill a billion marines will both go down. "Surgical Striker" doesn't sound like the front line fighters NS1 Fades are. I'm guessing the NS2 will cost 20-30 res (it still has to be useful), but have less combat effectiveness somehow. 50 resources is way too much pressure on one person. It's also too expensive for multiple players to experience the class. 10 res would have to make the Fade as useful as a shotgun by comarison. I'd consider the Fade to be about as useful as a shotgun+JP or HMG+JP. So 20-30 res sounds about right.
Fades will probably have to be researched like Advanced Armory or Prototype upgrades. That way we don't have them running around at the start of the match.
That still means that a mere 3 seconds of immobilization would be enough for two Marines with LMGs and no weapon upgrades to take out a Fade without even having to aim.
<!--quoteo(post=1756942:date=Mar 4 2010, 01:05 AM:name=Voyager I)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Voyager I @ Mar 4 2010, 01:05 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756942"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That still means that a mere 3 seconds of immobilization would be enough for two Marines with LMGs and no weapon upgrades to take out a Fade without even having to aim.
Doesn't smell like balance to me.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> 3 seconds is long. 2 seconds is the max I would consider and 0.5-1 second would be my preference.
<!--quoteo(post=1756659:date=Mar 3 2010, 01:00 AM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Mar 3 2010, 01:00 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756659"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You're just mad that no ones suggesting ways to make the alien team more overpowered then they already are.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Are you talking about small games or large games. Last I heard they weren't overpowered in 6v6, basically the smallest decent games you'll play( competitive anyway ). But maybe you're talking about 15v15. No wait, marines are pretty well known to be overpowered in 15v15.
When you say they are overpowered do you play 2v2 ns games while hoping you can camp your way to victory on marines? Or perhaps you're a co player getting rolled by lawlerhungerfocus fade while you never upgrade armor so that you can get that early gl to shoot at the onos.
Although you don't seem to know it, you can kill a fade with one full lmg/one full pistol at w0. What that does mean however is 2 light marines can kill it very easily/quickly assuming they can 1. Aim 2. Realize the enemy team has a fade before it has swiped him twice. Of course I'm not saying you WILL kill it, because they will hopefully run if they are getting rocked. But even then you have time to push while he goes to heal. Not to mention if you have a sg out( who can do the 2 things listed above ), then the fade will die in 3-4 shots even if he's rambo with nobody else to shoot the fade.
Apart from ambushing skulks(I'm assuming if you play this game at all its on bot servers or 32 player servers) a decent marines can kill 3-5 skulks without reloading with lmg and pistol(yes, i am talking about w0, not the w3 hmg where you still can't pull this off).
Not gonna go into lerk(the amount they take to die is somewhere between fade & skulk if you need a hint) or onos( they generally come up after the game has been decided ). But truly, just because you never hit more than 2 bullets of a full lmg clip into a fade doesn't mean it is overpowered. If at least 2 marines on the team aren't focusedwolves then aliens will not have free reign over the map/marine team.
<!--quoteo(post=1756924:date=Mar 4 2010, 12:44 AM:name=Tha)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tha @ Mar 4 2010, 12:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756924"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->the equivalent to this is having a marine stay near the wall where the fade would likely have his escape route and have the commander place a cc or armory press E to activate it and block the fades exit stratedgy.. is it really such a hard thing to understand?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The equivalent to this is having a marine team that cooperates as a team, has a sense of timing and listens to their commander... is it really such a hard thing to understand? I mean it's the same thing as having a gun that can be launched by a single base-camping marine that will essentially turn a fade into a walking target right?
<!--quoteo(post=1756848:date=Mar 3 2010, 03:47 PM:name=Battle-Bug)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Battle-Bug @ Mar 3 2010, 03:47 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756848"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The problem with devour is that it was a one hit kill that punished the marine for getting too close to a hard-to-kill alien that can run faster than a jetpack and immobilize multiple marines (little defense against devour besides elevation). The devs have learned some lessons from NS1 and I'm confident that NS2 will be great.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The problem is that you have zero perspective because you're a dedicated combat player who doesn't understand concepts like relative cost in NS.
Make the damn noob weapons and make server decide if they're alowed or not xD<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> You have us misunderstood. Most of the ideas we see posted are biased toward the marines as if the aliens are bots.
<!--quoteo(post=1757123:date=Mar 4 2010, 10:37 PM:name=xmaine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xmaine @ Mar 4 2010, 10:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757123"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You have us misunderstood. Most of the ideas we see posted are biased toward the marines as if the aliens are bots.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This.
Some people need to realize that the Aliens are other players who also want to have fun, not NPCs whose sole purpose is to be killed.
<!--quoteo(post=1757123:date=Mar 4 2010, 04:37 PM:name=xmaine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xmaine @ Mar 4 2010, 04:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757123"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Most of the ideas we see posted are biased toward the marines as if the aliens are bots.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Those of you who want NS2 to be like NS1 and play a lot of alien should like this. There's less changes being suggested for the alien team.
Don't forget that the devs pick and choose. If 80% of ideas are to help marines, the devs won't give 80% of new features to marines.
If i were going to go elefant or rinocerous hunting in africa i would bring an eleophant gun <a href="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Rifle_cartridge_comparison_w_scale.png" target="_blank">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...son_w_scale.png</a> id take the f^#$ing huge BFG cartrage on the far left
I don't know if this has already been suggested or implementet, but you could make more spots on the map where you could close a vent or hallway with a welder, to give the marines a little more control over the area they occupy... Then you could give the gorge (and the marines for that sake) the ability to open up these vents again, and perhaps open and close some other vents, so the aliens can control their area...
I don't know whether this would result in too many stalemates, but it could make some interesting interactions and gamestates... Alternately these vents (and hallways) could be made only on a handful of maps, to make sure that all maps doesn't play the same way, and to enforce the need for different strategies...
pSyk0mAnNerdish by NatureGermanyJoin Date: 2003-08-07Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
<!--quoteo(post=1757123:date=Mar 5 2010, 12:37 AM:name=xmaine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xmaine @ Mar 5 2010, 12:37 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1757123"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You have us misunderstood. Most of the ideas we see posted are biased toward the marines as if the aliens are bots.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's because the first thing noobs learn these days when playing on terribly huge public servers is that you stack marines.
<!--quoteo(post=1759568:date=Mar 16 2010, 02:26 AM:name=pSyk0mAn)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pSyk0mAn @ Mar 16 2010, 02:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1759568"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's because the first thing noobs learn these days when playing on terribly huge public servers is that you stack marines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> These days? It's been a problem since NS 1.0.
<!--quoteo(post=1759567:date=Mar 16 2010, 09:14 AM:name=HrBanan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (HrBanan @ Mar 16 2010, 09:14 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1759567"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't know if this has already been suggested or implementet, but you could make more spots on the map where you could close a vent or hallway with a welder, to give the marines a little more control over the area they occupy... Then you could give the gorge (and the marines for that sake) the ability to open up these vents again, and perhaps open and close some other vents, so the aliens can control their area...
I don't know whether this would result in too many stalemates, but it could make some interesting interactions and gamestates... Alternately these vents (and hallways) could be made only on a handful of maps, to make sure that all maps doesn't play the same way, and to enforce the need for different strategies...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> strategies are dictated by the map layout. also, the use of weldspots depends on the maper.
Its impractical and cheap in my opinion. I know everyone here is trying to think of an idea of giving an edge to marines. A better solution might be to give more explosive power to trip mines. Or maybe even invent a mine that can reduce alien speed by 30%.
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)
<!--quoteo(post=1761606:date=Mar 29 2010, 09:47 AM:name=Onionknight)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Onionknight @ Mar 29 2010, 09:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Its impractical and cheap in my opinion. I know everyone here is trying to think of an idea of giving an edge to marines. A better solution might be to give more explosive power to trip mines. Or maybe even invent a mine that can reduce alien speed by 30%.
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What.
What 90% of the people in this thread are saying is that Marines are op and don't need a buff.
<!--quoteo(post=1761606:date=Mar 29 2010, 09:47 AM:name=Onionknight)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Onionknight @ Mar 29 2010, 09:47 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761606"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Its impractical and cheap in my opinion. I know everyone here is trying to think of an idea of giving an edge to marines. A better solution might be to give more explosive power to trip mines. Or maybe even invent a mine that can reduce alien speed by 30%.
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The moment i read 187, i lmfao. Everyone on that server is horrible.
Instead of movement speed or concussion, what if you had a weapon or trap that did scaling percentile damage to armor on a single target, but did little (or even no) damage to health?
Combined with team backup, this would be effective on high-tier aliens but would be ineffective against low-tier aliens. Design weapon mechanices so any noob could do stuff against idiot Onos, but would take a skilled player to do things against a Fade or a smart Onos. Plus, it would create a target of opportunity for lesser alien life forms and encourage marines to stick together.
This is just random thoughts below:
1: some sort of non-hitscan canister filled with green (acid)/(plasma)/(nanites)/(liquefied leprechauns). Issuable by commanders, or buyable by marines, I don't care which. Fired using grenade launcher, requires direct hit to actually do something. Destroys X percent armor over Y seconds if it hits a target.
2: A laser-like weapon that fires a beam of concentrated light/radiation/nanities/leprechauns when the trigger is depressed. Weapon has armor % damage ramp-up depending on how long the beam is focused on the target; 5 seconds of continual targeting will deal vastly more armor damage than two seconds of continual targeting. Buyable by marines. If target slips out of the beam, damage ramp-up resets.
fades and onoses are supposed to be hard to take down by low numbers of marines. its designed that way so the marines have to actually think and realize they need to WORK TOGETHER and concentrate their fire on the higher life form if its really messing with the team.
we dont need nub guns, we need those useless nubs to realize this aint their kind of game and leave. ns1/2 requires teamwork, that the whole idea. if youre having trouble killing something, get some help from your team
<!--quoteo(post=1761915:date=Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM:name=Drummer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Drummer @ Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761915"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->fades and onoses are supposed to be hard to take down by low numbers of marines. its designed that way so the marines have to actually think and realize they need to WORK TOGETHER and concentrate their fire on the higher life form if its really messing with the team.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That would kinda be the point of a weapon that targets a single alien, deals armor damage, and deals no health damage...so people would have to work together to take an alien down. Small groups would only work if the alien was not working as part of a team; marines would effectively be one man down against weaker, more agile life forms. So it would promote more teamplay.
Incidentally, it would help make smaller lifeforms more useful in the endgame. Which isn't always a bad thing.
<!--quoteo(post=1761915:date=Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM:name=Drummer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Drummer @ Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761915"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->we dont need nub guns, we need those useless nubs to realize this aint their kind of game and leave. ns1/2 requires teamwork, that the whole idea. if youre having trouble killing something, get some help from your team<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because clearly, you can solo aliens with a gun that deals damage to only armor. Obviously, any noob could use a gun that requires constant targeting or nonhitscan projectiles to do something. It's just as clear that, like the HMG, this gun can devastate skulks, gorges, and lerks without any help whatsoever.
On a off comment, it's wrong to pander to noobs, but it's pretty idiotic not to accommodate them or help them out; a game without noobs is a step away from a dead game. That's not good for anyone, especially UWE.
Comments
the equivalent to this is having a marine stay near the wall where the fade would likely have his escape route and have the commander place a cc or armory press E to activate it and block the fades exit stratedgy.. is it really such a hard thing to understand?
I have played ns1, i stopped about half a year ago as the aussie servers are dying out and ausns pugs stopped being less common, i understand the core of the game and am actually a more devoted alien player then marine player,
oh btw big guns? big ###### guns? they did get rid of hmg you know.. right?You have no idea that motion trackings still in, so much your just guessing.
that in itself shows you that its almost a completly different game so stop shooting down ideas that might be cool to have in the newer game.
By the time fades are out you should have lvl 1 damage so your lmg does 11dmg per bullet. An lmg clip can deal 550damage. More than enough to kill a fade.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No. Armor points count as 2 health points. Thus, paper fades have 600 hp equivalently, 300 from health and 2x150 from armor. One lmg magazine will not kill a fade. Add on some 20 damage pistol shots onto a perfect accuracy lmg magazine discharge and you can down a fade. Two or more good accuracy lmg discharges can kill a fade with less difficulty.
You're right about the shotgun, though.
<!--quoteo(post=1756865:date=Mar 3 2010, 08:29 PM:name=PSA)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PSA @ Mar 3 2010, 08:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1756865"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->2) If Fade got dropped to 10 res (Ha!!) then he would be balanced accordingly and made extremely weak, so this wouldn't be a problem anyways. The scenario you proposed is basically saying "Well, What if the devs TOTALLY unbalance the game?!?! Did you think about that?!?!"<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
HA and JP cost 15/10 res. 10 res Fade is not so unlikely considering Aliens are getting a team resource pool instead of their current crappy individual pools (Thanks, Unknown Worlds!). I'd peg it at equivalent cost to JP/HA or perhaps a bit more. Not really sure. So 15 or 20 if the resource expenditure scale is the same as NS1.
My point is, is that if they were made "cheap" (whatever that means now in relation to NS2) it would be scaled to the Fade's strength, Marines strength, and speed of resource gain. So the argument was silly to begin with.
Okay. I thought you were implying that Fades would be less combaty than Lerks. I was just pointing out that Fades are likely to cost much less than 50 resources, and also pointing out that the alien resource model is entirely revamped so our sense of scale needs to change (or we'll have silly arguments for nothing).
That line of thought makes me think Fades will be handed out like HMG's. That makes me think they will be less powerful than they are in NS1. Of course, Unknown Worlds could make a gigantic mistake and keep Fade cost at 50 resources and keep the insane pressure on one person to kill every single marine. I postulate that the pressure to use the resources well and the ability to kill a billion marines will both go down. "Surgical Striker" doesn't sound like the front line fighters NS1 Fades are. I'm guessing the NS2 will cost 20-30 res (it still has to be useful), but have less combat effectiveness somehow. 50 resources is way too much pressure on one person. It's also too expensive for multiple players to experience the class. 10 res would have to make the Fade as useful as a shotgun by comarison. I'd consider the Fade to be about as useful as a shotgun+JP or HMG+JP. So 20-30 res sounds about right.
Fades will probably have to be researched like Advanced Armory or Prototype upgrades. That way we don't have them running around at the start of the match.
Doesn't smell like balance to me.
Doesn't smell like balance to me.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
3 seconds is long. 2 seconds is the max I would consider and 0.5-1 second would be my preference.
Are you talking about small games or large games. Last I heard they weren't overpowered in 6v6, basically the smallest decent games you'll play( competitive anyway ). But maybe you're talking about 15v15. No wait, marines are pretty well known to be overpowered in 15v15.
When you say they are overpowered do you play 2v2 ns games while hoping you can camp your way to victory on marines?
Or perhaps you're a co player getting rolled by lawlerhungerfocus fade while you never upgrade armor so that you can get that early gl to shoot at the onos.
Although you don't seem to know it, you can kill a fade with one full lmg/one full pistol at w0. What that does mean however is 2 light marines can kill it very easily/quickly assuming they can 1. Aim 2. Realize the enemy team has a fade before it has swiped him twice. Of course I'm not saying you WILL kill it, because they will hopefully run if they are getting rocked. But even then you have time to push while he goes to heal. Not to mention if you have a sg out( who can do the 2 things listed above ), then the fade will die in 3-4 shots even if he's rambo with nobody else to shoot the fade.
Apart from ambushing skulks(I'm assuming if you play this game at all its on bot servers or 32 player servers) a decent marines can kill 3-5 skulks without reloading with lmg and pistol(yes, i am talking about w0, not the w3 hmg where you still can't pull this off).
Not gonna go into lerk(the amount they take to die is somewhere between fade & skulk if you need a hint) or onos( they generally come up after the game has been decided ). But truly, just because you never hit more than 2 bullets of a full lmg clip into a fade doesn't mean it is overpowered. If at least 2 marines on the team aren't focusedwolves then aliens will not have free reign over the map/marine team.
The equivalent to this is having a marine team that cooperates as a team, has a sense of timing and listens to their commander... is it really such a hard thing to understand? I mean it's the same thing as having a gun that can be launched by a single base-camping marine that will essentially turn a fade into a walking target right?
faulty logic is faulty.
The problem is that you have zero perspective because you're a dedicated combat player who doesn't understand concepts like relative cost in NS.
Make the damn noob weapons and make server decide if they're alowed or not xD
Make the damn noob weapons and make server decide if they're alowed or not xD<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
How is that bad? NS1 was awesome.
Make the damn noob weapons and make server decide if they're alowed or not xD<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
You have us misunderstood. Most of the ideas we see posted are biased toward the marines as if the aliens are bots.
This.
Some people need to realize that the Aliens are other players who also want to have fun, not NPCs whose sole purpose is to be killed.
Those of you who want NS2 to be like NS1 and play a lot of alien should like this. There's less changes being suggested for the alien team.
Don't forget that the devs pick and choose. If 80% of ideas are to help marines, the devs won't give 80% of new features to marines.
<a href="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/84/Rifle_cartridge_comparison_w_scale.png" target="_blank">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/comm...son_w_scale.png</a>
id take the f^#$ing huge BFG cartrage on the far left
I don't know whether this would result in too many stalemates, but it could make some interesting interactions and gamestates... Alternately these vents (and hallways) could be made only on a handful of maps, to make sure that all maps doesn't play the same way, and to enforce the need for different strategies...
That's because the first thing noobs learn these days when playing on terribly huge public servers is that you stack marines.
These days? It's been a problem since NS 1.0.
I don't know whether this would result in too many stalemates, but it could make some interesting interactions and gamestates... Alternately these vents (and hallways) could be made only on a handful of maps, to make sure that all maps doesn't play the same way, and to enforce the need for different strategies...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
strategies are dictated by the map layout.
also, the use of weldspots depends on the maper.
Of course, but open/close weldspots give you the opportunity to alter the map layout as the game progresses and thus opening up for new strategies...
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What.
What 90% of the people in this thread are saying is that Marines are op and don't need a buff.
Also with all this talk about stacking marines, generally marines are always the losing team (which maybe why people want to change something to balance it). But the truth is it doesn't need to be balanced. It is just the way people are playing the game.
I remember a while back playing on 187combat or something server, and marines constantly rushed in the beginning and ended the game in 5 mins (and did it continuously for 6 maps). In the beginning marines have a definite advantage but if you wait too long, more aliens will have higher lvl lifeforms and then you'll be screwed.
Also gorges can use an improved web and spitting attack. Maybe one that actually looks more like a spiders web ? Possibly have the spitting attack create splash damage (like splashing after impact)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The moment i read 187, i lmfao. Everyone on that server is horrible.
Combined with team backup, this would be effective on high-tier aliens but would be ineffective against low-tier aliens. Design weapon mechanices so any noob could do stuff against idiot Onos, but would take a skilled player to do things against a Fade or a smart Onos. Plus, it would create a target of opportunity for lesser alien life forms and encourage marines to stick together.
This is just random thoughts below:
1: some sort of non-hitscan canister filled with green (acid)/(plasma)/(nanites)/(liquefied leprechauns). Issuable by commanders, or buyable by marines, I don't care which. Fired using grenade launcher, requires direct hit to actually do something. Destroys X percent armor over Y seconds if it hits a target.
2: A laser-like weapon that fires a beam of concentrated light/radiation/nanities/leprechauns when the trigger is depressed. Weapon has armor % damage ramp-up depending on how long the beam is focused on the target; 5 seconds of continual targeting will deal vastly more armor damage than two seconds of continual targeting. Buyable by marines. If target slips out of the beam, damage ramp-up resets.
we dont need nub guns, we need those useless nubs to realize this aint their kind of game and leave. ns1/2 requires teamwork, that the whole idea. if youre having trouble killing something, get some help from your team
That would kinda be the point of a weapon that targets a single alien, deals armor damage, and deals no health damage...so people would have to work together to take an alien down. Small groups would only work if the alien was not working as part of a team; marines would effectively be one man down against weaker, more agile life forms. So it would promote more teamplay.
Incidentally, it would help make smaller lifeforms more useful in the endgame. Which isn't always a bad thing.
<!--quoteo(post=1761915:date=Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM:name=Drummer)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Drummer @ Mar 31 2010, 06:16 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761915"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->we dont need nub guns, we need those useless nubs to realize this aint their kind of game and leave. ns1/2 requires teamwork, that the whole idea. if youre having trouble killing something, get some help from your team<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Because clearly, you can solo aliens with a gun that deals damage to only armor. Obviously, any noob could use a gun that requires constant targeting or nonhitscan projectiles to do something. It's just as clear that, like the HMG, this gun can devastate skulks, gorges, and lerks without any help whatsoever.
On a off comment, it's wrong to pander to noobs, but it's pretty idiotic not to accommodate them or help them out; a game without noobs is a step away from a dead game. That's not good for anyone, especially UWE.