Jericho Layout

DarkATiDarkATi Revelation 22:17 Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17532Members, Reinforced - Shadow
in NS2 General Discussion
<div class="IPBDescription">Flow-Chart Concept</div>Hey everyone,

Well, since the Spark Editor won't run on my laptop and my Desktop PC is undergoing massive "surgery" right now I haven't been able to do anything other than a few flow-charts and simple layouts.

Here's what I am calling a "Jericho" style map layout. (I have dibs on ns2_jericho!!!) Anyone is welcome to use this flow-chart, however.

Here's the basic layout:

<img src="http://www.youngentrepreneurblog.com/av/jericho_basic.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Here's the idea behind the layout:

Firstly, each team gets an immediate choice between a node or a tech point, this should allow for a diverse playing experience.

If a team chooses the node then you will see that they get the exact same option once again. Node or tech point.

If a team chooses the tech point route they can either move on to the node or skip passed it and head right for the next tech point which isn't very far away.

The middle tech point provides the option for an epic struggle, or if the team would like to, "rush" they can move straight through the map to the other team's spawn.

Now, I have also proposed some weldable doors to make the layout a little more dynamic.

<img src="http://www.youngentrepreneurblog.com/av/jericho_weldables.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Even if all four doors are welded every area is accessible to the player, and no player would get trapped anywhere after the weld took place. If a team suspects a "rush" they can weld the door in front of the center tech point. If a team would like to secure a tech point more completely they can weld the door leading into the outermost tech points.

Now, lastly I have proposed some vents. These vents would accomodate either crouching marines, marine jetpackers, or small aliens such as the skulk. (Exact vent type has not been determined yet. (Floor vent, ceiling vent, high vent, low vent, etc.)

<img src="http://www.youngentrepreneurblog.com/av/jericho_weldablesplusvents.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

Obviously these vents are just straight lines drawn to show you how the connections are made.

Here's a happy little pencil sketching I made for ns2_jericho with rooms and better vents drawn in:

<img src="http://youngentrepreneurblog.com/av/jericho_art.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

I know, I'm an artist, please, save your applause for the UWE team once they unleash the beast that will be NS2, though!

Thoughts?

Cheers,
Cody
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Comments

  • TrCTrC Join Date: 2008-11-30 Member: 65612Members
    Interesting, is the weldable thing on the inside of mid box or outside? I think it would be more interesting "inside" and make sure you cant siege from that room it would be too good :). Concept and idea works well but need to see how the game functions :). Keep up the good work
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  • Draco_2kDraco_2k Evil Genius Join Date: 2009-12-09 Member: 69546Members
    That's pretty damn clever.

    The only problem I can think of is that this might be more inclined to forming "ideal" structure placements, depending on how the game balance plays out.
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  • Glenn Fetty 3Glenn Fetty 3 Join Date: 2010-03-06 Member: 70852Members
    Looks awesome, keep updating the thread so we can see how the progress goes.


    /Glenn Fetty 3.
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  • SwiftspearSwiftspear Custim tital Join Date: 2003-10-29 Member: 22097Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1760815:date=Mar 23 2010, 12:56 PM:name=Draco_2k)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Draco_2k @ Mar 23 2010, 12:56 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760815"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->That's pretty damn clever.

    The only problem I can think of is that this might be more inclined to forming "ideal" structure placements, depending on how the game balance plays out.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Every map does that. It's just a matter of putting the time in to figure out where those placements are. You especially notice it as marine in NS1, but it's even true for alien, but OC's are so rare in high end play that standardizations haven't formed.
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  • Draco_2kDraco_2k Evil Genius Join Date: 2009-12-09 Member: 69546Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1760843:date=Mar 23 2010, 10:31 PM:name=Swiftspear)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Swiftspear @ Mar 23 2010, 10:31 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1760843"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Every map does that. It's just a matter of putting the time in to figure out where those placements are. You especially notice it as marine in NS1, but it's even true for alien, but OC's are so rare in high end play that standardizations haven't formed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Quite right. I mean, <i>more so</i> inclined to forming ideal strategies, because it's very simplistic and symmetrical.
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  • JimydJimyd Join Date: 2003-02-08 Member: 13289Members
    I assume the Kharaa spawn on the North side of the Map? It is the side that has more vents, would make sense.

    Looks good, as long as the room proportions are made correctly.
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  • marksmarks Join Date: 2008-07-28 Member: 64720Members
    Symmetrical maps are much easier to balance, but quite boring. I mean, if ns_veil got any more symmetrical it would possibly be the most lame map to play. Asymmetry gives each location a unique identity, with often unique advantages and disadvantages. Symmetrical map layouts get the thumbs-down from me.
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  • Tom HoenTom Hoen Join Date: 2009-07-02 Member: 68004Members
    Some critique:
    Mapping guide says you never should have vents going to marine spawn, so lose some vents.
    Too straight line on the middle, you can clearly see from side to side of the map. Also running straight line towards something is never fun, make some 90 degree turns.

    I understand your main pc is in repairs, but you should make photoshop version of your map layout with rooms. Just make few simple room boxes and few corridor lines, and start placing them. It is much easier to see problems (and fix them) in this way than on paper.
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  • ItalianmagicItalianmagic Join Date: 2008-12-13 Member: 65755Members
    Another Critique.

    in your drawn version of your map, the vent system in the upper right corner... seems very unnatural that it connects like a box. if it were above rooms, that wouldn't be the issue. but off to the side, it is strange.
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  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    Wait just one minute, is that DarkATi? It can't be, I heard he got stolen...

    Also Flowcharts are a good basis to work from, just don't oversimplify them ;)
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  • ThaldarinThaldarin Alonzi&#33; Join Date: 2003-07-15 Member: 18173Members, Constellation
    Jericho style layout? That's the diamond power grid from the Spark mapping guidelines.
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  • UncleRayUncleRay Join Date: 2010-03-08 Member: 70881Members
    We, the veteran mappers should pull together and do a project! This should be fun seeing all of you guys :D
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  • DarkATiDarkATi Revelation 22:17 Join Date: 2003-06-20 Member: 17532Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1761171:date=Mar 25 2010, 12:25 PM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Mar 25 2010, 12:25 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761171"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Jericho style layout? That's the diamond power grid from the Spark mapping guidelines.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Pretty much. I added a connection to the outside tech points, though.

    Cheers,
    Cody
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  • ThaldarinThaldarin Alonzi&#33; Join Date: 2003-07-15 Member: 18173Members, Constellation
    edited March 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1761172:date=Mar 25 2010, 05:29 PM:name=UncleRay)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (UncleRay @ Mar 25 2010, 05:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761172"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->We, the veteran mappers should pull together and do a project! This should be fun seeing all of you guys :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Show me some of your previous work and consistent spark design and I'll think about it.

    EDIT: On a side note I love your restyled avatar DarkATI ;)

    And I've seen quite a few people put a room like a crossroads, 4 exits/entrances across the map. I'd like to see something different from a center point, I think it opens up access to the 4 nodes way too easily with a power grid in this 'diamond'.
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  • KhazModanKhazModan Join Date: 2003-04-14 Member: 15500Members, Constellation
    clearly your some sort of programmer or mathematician. very logical.

    and i think that the map would work with different levels, shapes, themes to the rooms,

    i reckon its probably easy for people who can map to take that design, make a symetrical map and have a player not even feel like its symetrical.
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  • Katana-Katana- Join Date: 2008-11-25 Member: 65575Members
    Another problem: It seems to me that the tech points which are not in the center, would be nearly impossible to attack. The starting team should always push the node, because holding that node which is just north or south of your base makes it even easier to hold the tech point, because you can attack that room on two fronts. If you push the tech point first, you open your self up because the other team will have an easier time pushing the node room which seems much more difficult to defend.

    Or I could be completely wrong, haven't played ns2. :-D
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  • FocusedWolfFocusedWolf Join Date: 2005-01-09 Member: 34258Members
    This looks very similar to many many maps in NS1. I'd call it the standard "3-corners-of-the-map-with-3-separate-hives" layout.
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  • HeymanHeyman Join Date: 2005-03-29 Member: 46895Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1761975:date=Mar 31 2010, 03:42 PM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Mar 31 2010, 03:42 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761975"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This looks very similar to many many maps in NS1. I'd call it the standard "3-corners-of-the-map-with-3-separate-hives" layout.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You're looking at it wrong. There are 4 corners of the map with 2 separate hives/tech points for the respective team, where the third for either is contested.
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  • Cereal_KillRCereal_KillR Join Date: 2002-10-31 Member: 1837Members
    You're looking at NS1 maps wrong as well. With three hives and 1 marine start, it's hard not to see a 4-point structure.
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  • Donner & BlitzenDonner & Blitzen Join Date: 2010-03-08 Member: 70879Members
    edited March 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1761994:date=Mar 31 2010, 08:32 PM:name=Heyman)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Heyman @ Mar 31 2010, 08:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761994"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You're looking at it wrong. There are 4 corners of the map with 2 separate hives/tech points for the respective team, where the third for either is contested.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Wouldn't we want an odd number of hives/tech points? That is, either team always has more tech points then the other, thereby giving the disadvantaged team an incentive for action, and preventing games from turning into a stalemate.
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  • HeymanHeyman Join Date: 2005-03-29 Member: 46895Members
    edited April 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1761998:date=Mar 31 2010, 08:36 PM:name=Donner & Blitzen)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Donner & Blitzen @ Mar 31 2010, 08:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761998"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Wouldn't we want an odd number of hives/tech points? That is, either team always has more tech points then the other, thereby giving the disadvantaged team an incentive for action, and preventing games from turning into a stalemate.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Oh no, I have no beef with the Jericho Layout. I just wanted to take the opportunity to tell FocusedWolf he was wrong. :P

    I'm not as picky with maps as a lot of the competitive culture. I get rather tired of playing the origin/veil/eclipse rotation, and if people get bored they'll play metal or nothing or lost.

    Tanith got so overplayed that people are specifically avoiding that map, making it underplayed. :P
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  • FocusedWolfFocusedWolf Join Date: 2005-01-09 Member: 34258Members
    edited April 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1761995:date=Mar 31 2010, 08:49 PM:name=Cereal_KillR)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Cereal_KillR @ Mar 31 2010, 08:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1761995"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You're looking at NS1 maps wrong as well. With three hives and 1 marine start, it's hard not to see a 4-point structure.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    xD
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  • TgaudTgaud Join Date: 2009-05-01 Member: 67323Members
    just remember that alien move faster than rines.
    So to be faire, res node have to be closer frop MS than hives.
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