<!--quoteo(post=1750297:date=Feb 2 2010, 05:03 PM:name=Wyked)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wyked @ Feb 2 2010, 05:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1750297"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->couple points.. there were no iron sites in MW2 but that was a great mech game (bit dated now though)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sup Modern Warfare 2.
You've totally been missing out on the point on half of these conversations, haven't you.
<!--quoteo(post=1748890:date=Jan 24 2010, 06:17 AM:name=Tha)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tha @ Jan 24 2010, 06:17 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1748890"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->lol... just seems like they're implying theirs more to just point and hold click.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->FFS! This threat should have ended with one reply...
They are not implying anything. Read this statement... "This mod doesn't use any of the Natural Selection 2 game code, so the actual NS2 rifle behaves a bit differently."
as... "This mod doesn't use any of the Natural Selection 2 game code, so <!--sizeo:2--><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo--><b>don't wine about the details (rate of fire, accuracy, animation, clip size)</b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->"
Sorry if this seems a bit harsh, but the super oversized text in your OP was super annoying. And your over-analyzing of an simple disclosure was annoying. So I'm writing this while a bit annoyed
Believe it or not folks, in reality pistols are significantly <i>less</i> accurate than Rifles, and typically fire weaker ammunition. Just because Halo gave you a rifle with the ballistics (and killing power) of a paintball gun and a zooming Pistol doesn't mean <i>every other game</i> needs to follow that tradition.
<!--quoteo(post=1748890:date=Jan 24 2010, 06:17 AM:name=Tha)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tha @ Jan 24 2010, 06:17 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1748890"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->lol... just seems like they're implying theirs more to just point and hold click.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ya maybe even iron sights... or maybe that's to complex a concept for people that still play NS1 actively...
<!--quoteo(post=1751492:date=Feb 6 2010, 05:48 PM:name=Voyager I)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Voyager I @ Feb 6 2010, 05:48 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1751492"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Believe it or not folks, in reality pistols are significantly <i>less</i> accurate than Rifles, and typically fire weaker ammunition. Just because Halo gave you a rifle with the ballistics of a paintball gun doesn't mean <i>every other game</i> needs to follow that tradition.
shorter barrel + shorter sights = less accurate<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and your missing something... pistol bullets are heavier then rifle bullets. That means at close range a pistol will do more damage (especially on that soft skinned tub of ###### gorge), and at the very least hit with more force. Even if the target is armored... and assuming LMG bullets are very poor at defeating this armor... then i'd still expect the pistol to in 1 magazine do the same thing that a full magazine of lmg will do at all ranges that this game offers.
The inaccuracy you speak of (although it varies from gun to gun and ammo type) is not <i>that</i> bad... in fact i'd imagine by now the devs have already nerfed the lmg and hmg accuracies to about what is realistic, and way past horrible, for a handgun lol.
Hmm i'd like a big revolver in this game... loaded with shotgun shells... or a shotshell ammo for the grenade launcher... no i want both.
It varies per weapon, but generally rifles with smaller bullets also have much higher muzzle velocities. Pistols may have good stopping power, but only at close range, while rifles remain deadly <i>and accurate</i> all the way out to hundreds of meters. There's a reason pistols are used as <i>sidearms</i>.
Of course, to be fair, for the kind of combat we're looking at in NS, the LMG is probably a closer analogue to a Submachine Gun than an Assault Rifle, in which case the rounds would be weaker and semi-accurate full-auto spraying would be appropriate. Of course, SMG's fire pistol rounds, so they're not weaker unless you're using a honking great pistol, and the longer barrels make them <i>more</i> accurate when fired semi-auto.
Basically, a long barrel makes the gun physically more precies, and long sights (that come from having a longer barrel) make <i>you</i> more accurate when lining up a shot.
<!--quoteo(post=1751528:date=Feb 6 2010, 09:27 PM:name=Voyager I)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Voyager I @ Feb 6 2010, 09:27 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1751528"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->you[/i] more accurate when lining up a shot.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> also... Nanites!
<!--quoteo(post=1751521:date=Feb 7 2010, 10:59 AM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Feb 7 2010, 10:59 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1751521"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Ya maybe even iron sights... or maybe that's to <b>dumb</b> a concept for people that <b>play good games</b>...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Fixed that for you.
Let it drop. It is and has always been a terrible idea, just like fully regenerating health.
Wouldnt fit in in my opinion. The marines have a hud, the HUD would probably have the ability to calculate where the bullets will hit for ease of use and kind of eliminate the need for iron sights. Just a stupid thought :P
This isnt red orchestra or something, iron sights work better in a slightly slower paced game setting and one with out aliens :P
I mean I guess it would be kind of cool if they were included as an option but i doubt many people would take advantage.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms. If you are aiming down a sight, the gun is resting against your upper-chest/shoulder area, which provides a more stable surface to absorb shock and recoil. It's not just predicting where the bullets go, it's making the spread smaller, so you get more for your shots.
On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.
And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.
<!--quoteo(post=1754354:date=Feb 20 2010, 09:49 PM:name=damonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (damonkey @ Feb 20 2010, 09:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754354"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> "Basic physics" rules out 99% of anything that happens in a game of NS, buddy.
<!--quoteo(post=1754354:date=Feb 20 2010, 08:49 PM:name=damonkey)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (damonkey @ Feb 20 2010, 08:49 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754354"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms. If you are aiming down a sight, the gun is resting against your upper-chest/shoulder area, which provides a more stable surface to absorb shock and recoil. It's not just predicting where the bullets go, it's making the spread smaller, so you get more for your shots.
On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.
And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
First, you're assuming that this is "hip firing" when not using sights. This is not necessarily so. It is an abstraction placed in more tactical games to explain why sights have more accuracy. In reality, no one trained to fight shoots from hips anyways. It's always holstered onto your shoulder. It's a question of if you take the tie to line up your crosshair, which indeed has higher accuracy, but takes time, limits visibility, and limits mobility.
It's a gameplay element choice to include ADS. More tactical games like CoD have incorporated it to give players a choice of mobility vs accuracy. Do you want to run and shoot or be able to snipe down the halls? The style of NS1 was much more in line with an arcade feel. Fixed accuracy, mobility to stay alive, close quarters so who would be sniping down the halls anyways, no headshots. This is carried into the expectations of NS2, and since it appears to remain a quick reflex highly mobile game most feel that ADS isn't needed.
Plus, it's quite immature and unfair to claim <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Allow me to name the #1 FPS game on the market: Counter-Strike. I see no ADS here.... Next would be CoD:MW2. A game where typically only campers and snipers use sights, the rest run around knifing and shotgunning and gren cannoning. So.... at most 25% of the FPS community uses ADS? TF2 comes in a distant 3rd. (Source: Steam Server Stats, combined values for CS and CS:S since it's effectively the same game) EDIT: weapons with "scope" are a different matter. NS2 will almost definitely not have a sniper rifle, so this is a non-issue.
Finally, saying <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> is perhaps the stupidest thing yet. If it's a core gameplay element, you're forcing players to use it. This isn't like visual upgrades where those who don't want it just turn it off. If it forces distinct advantages, you're forcing players to utilize it.
<!--quoteo(post=1754390:date=Feb 20 2010, 11:10 PM:name=spellman23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (spellman23 @ Feb 20 2010, 11:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754390"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> If it's a core gameplay element, you're forcing players to use it. This isn't like visual upgrades where those who don't want it just turn it off. If it forces distinct advantages, you're forcing players to utilize it. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed. <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>NS2 is a sci fi shooter. Anyone who's played NS1 should know why iron sites wouldn't fit. It would slow down the pace of the game pace of the game. If they have to make using iron sites effective for the marine team, they would have to balance it out but severely slowly down aliens and/or weakening them.
Typical in games with ADS(as you're suggesting NS2 should try to be more like), using ADS slows down movement. In NS2, that would also likely mean you can't run, bunny hop, or jetpack while using aiming down the sight, <i>thus handicapping the marines if they have to use it to be effective.</i>
Therefore, to balance it, aliens will have to be slowed down severely and/or weakened.</b>
<b>Also as for using ADS or iron sites just for long range shots, the problem with that is that not all huge distanced areas are just hall ways. You also have to account for large rooms, etc.
If they only made it so shots are less accurate longer ranges(thus forcing you to use an iron site or any ADS), then they'd still underpower the marines because there are large rooms where the distance is big enough(as big as a distanced hallway. For example, ns_machina in NS1, the rooms are huge) for aliens to maneuver all over the place in.
So as for using ADS just for long ranged, that's also just a way to underpower the marine team and slow down the pace of the game.</b>
While it may seem to require "more skillz" to use an iron site just because you click an extra button then aim, NS isn't that type of game.
You'd have to worry about fades moving 80 miles per hour, skulks leaping all over the place, etc.
Holding a steady aim and locking onto an alien who is zooming all over the place is quite a bit of a challenge.
Also arguing that "all the other FPS has it" is like arguing to add Heroes and Creeps in Starcraft II just because the more popular WoW, WC3(Also DotA) has heroes(levelable characters in WoW) and creeps(mobs for WoW), it just doesn't mix well.
NS2 is not CoD in space or is NS2 BF in space. NS2 is an FPS but a a completely different FPS compared to CoD or BF series.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment,<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's not it. It's just that NS isn't that type of game(realistic shooter) which is why it shouldn't be in NS(same as why Heroes and Creeps shouldn't be in the regular ladder game of Starcraft 2 for example).
Anyway that's why iron sites(even for just long ranges) wouldn't fit in NS.
<!--quoteo(post=1750297:date=Feb 2 2010, 10:03 AM:name=Wyked)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wyked @ Feb 2 2010, 10:03 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1750297"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->couple points.. there were no iron sites in MW2 but that was a great mech game (bit dated now though)<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--quoteo(post=1750431:date=Feb 2 2010, 07:59 PM:name=PSA)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PSA @ Feb 2 2010, 07:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1750431"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You've totally been missing out on the point on half of these conversations, haven't you.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> <img src="http://www.juegomania.org/MechWarrior%202/foto/pc/4/4277/4277_c.jpg/Foto%20MechWarrior%202.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /> <!--quoteo(post=1749589:date=Jan 28 2010, 12:32 PM:name=spellman23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (spellman23 @ Jan 28 2010, 12:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1749589"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Your sarcasm detector just failed. Horribly.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's like people completely fail to realize that shooters are not inherently meant to be "realistic" and we had entire generations of games where run-and-gun was the norm. Hell, <i>reloading</i> was something of a late-comer.
Iron Sights =/= better, just different. NS isn't that kind of game.
<!--quoteo(post=1748857:date=Jan 23 2010, 11:33 PM:name=Tha)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tha @ Jan 23 2010, 11:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1748857"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"This mod doesn't use any of the Natural Selection 2 game code, so the actual NS2 rifle behaves a bit differently."
<!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->so the actual NS2 rifle behaves a bit differently.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
now, what exactly could that mean? to me it sounds like something is there maybe recoil or spread /overheating
EDIT: That is what the blog said<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's simply a safe way to say to all viewers <!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->DON'T JUDGE THE RIFLE, THIS ISN'T FINISHED, WE DON'T WANT TO HEAR YOUR WHINING OR INCESSANT THREADS CONCERNING THIS RIFLE. WE DON'T WANT TO DISCUSS, OR HINT AT, THE NS RIFLE. IGNORE THIS RIFLE. ANY TALK CONCERNING THE RIFLE WOULD BE IGNORING EVERYTHING WE INTENDED THIS VIDEO TO SHOW.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Hope this clears up the issues presented by the op. ;)
btw, it's usually bad forum etiquette to type in a larger then default font size. It only annoys, and upsets people.
<!--quoteo(post=1754958:date=Feb 24 2010, 08:34 PM:name=lwf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lwf @ Feb 24 2010, 08:34 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754958"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What does it matter if something is not realistic? This is a game about aliens if anyone did not notice.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Aliens against Marines (Humans)... That would force a bit of realism to the game if its to be taken serius. They could f*** the realism all they want if it were Aliens against Space Dogs or something ;)
Comments
Sup Modern Warfare 2.
You've totally been missing out on the point on half of these conversations, haven't you.
There was some statement that the secondary gun will not be as powerful as in ns1 so the pistol won't be a sniper rifle again ;)
They are not implying anything. Read this statement...
"This mod doesn't use any of the Natural Selection 2 game code, so the actual NS2 rifle behaves a bit differently."
as...
"This mod doesn't use any of the Natural Selection 2 game code, so <!--sizeo:2--><span style="font-size:10pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo--><b>don't wine about the details (rate of fire, accuracy, animation, clip size)</b><!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->"
Sorry if this seems a bit harsh, but the super oversized text in your OP was super annoying. And your over-analyzing of an simple disclosure was annoying. So I'm writing this while a bit annoyed
shorter barrel + shorter sights = less accurate
Ya maybe even iron sights... or maybe that's to complex a concept for people that still play NS1 actively...
shorter barrel + shorter sights = less accurate<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes and your missing something... pistol bullets are heavier then rifle bullets. That means at close range a pistol will do more damage (especially on that soft skinned tub of ###### gorge), and at the very least hit with more force. Even if the target is armored... and assuming LMG bullets are very poor at defeating this armor... then i'd still expect the pistol to in 1 magazine do the same thing that a full magazine of lmg will do at all ranges that this game offers.
The inaccuracy you speak of (although it varies from gun to gun and ammo type) is not <i>that</i> bad... in fact i'd imagine by now the devs have already nerfed the lmg and hmg accuracies to about what is realistic, and way past horrible, for a handgun lol.
Hmm i'd like a big revolver in this game... loaded with shotgun shells... or a shotshell ammo for the grenade launcher... no i want both.
Of course, to be fair, for the kind of combat we're looking at in NS, the LMG is probably a closer analogue to a Submachine Gun than an Assault Rifle, in which case the rounds would be weaker and semi-accurate full-auto spraying would be appropriate. Of course, SMG's fire pistol rounds, so they're not weaker unless you're using a honking great pistol, and the longer barrels make them <i>more</i> accurate when fired semi-auto.
Basically, a long barrel makes the gun physically more precies, and long sights (that come from having a longer barrel) make <i>you</i> more accurate when lining up a shot.
also... Nanites!
Fixed that for you.
Let it drop. It is and has always been a terrible idea, just like fully regenerating health.
Wouldnt fit in in my opinion. The marines have a hud, the HUD would probably have the ability to calculate where the bullets will hit for ease of use and kind of eliminate the need for iron sights. Just a stupid thought :P
This isnt red orchestra or something, iron sights work better in a slightly slower paced game setting and one with out aliens :P
I mean I guess it would be kind of cool if they were included as an option but i doubt many people would take advantage.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms. If you are aiming down a sight, the gun is resting against your upper-chest/shoulder area, which provides a more stable surface to absorb shock and recoil. It's not just predicting where the bullets go, it's making the spread smaller, so you get more for your shots.
On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.
And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.
"Basic physics" rules out 99% of anything that happens in a game of NS, buddy.
On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.
And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
First, you're assuming that this is "hip firing" when not using sights. This is not necessarily so. It is an abstraction placed in more tactical games to explain why sights have more accuracy. In reality, no one trained to fight shoots from hips anyways. It's always holstered onto your shoulder. It's a question of if you take the tie to line up your crosshair, which indeed has higher accuracy, but takes time, limits visibility, and limits mobility.
It's a gameplay element choice to include ADS. More tactical games like CoD have incorporated it to give players a choice of mobility vs accuracy. Do you want to run and shoot or be able to snipe down the halls? The style of NS1 was much more in line with an arcade feel. Fixed accuracy, mobility to stay alive, close quarters so who would be sniping down the halls anyways, no headshots. This is carried into the expectations of NS2, and since it appears to remain a quick reflex highly mobile game most feel that ADS isn't needed.
Plus, it's quite immature and unfair to claim <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Allow me to name the #1 FPS game on the market: Counter-Strike. I see no ADS here.... Next would be CoD:MW2. A game where typically only campers and snipers use sights, the rest run around knifing and shotgunning and gren cannoning. So.... at most 25% of the FPS community uses ADS? TF2 comes in a distant 3rd. (Source: Steam Server Stats, combined values for CS and CS:S since it's effectively the same game)
EDIT: weapons with "scope" are a different matter. NS2 will almost definitely not have a sniper rifle, so this is a non-issue.
Finally, saying <!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> is perhaps the stupidest thing yet. If it's a core gameplay element, you're forcing players to use it. This isn't like visual upgrades where those who don't want it just turn it off. If it forces distinct advantages, you're forcing players to utilize it.
If it's a core gameplay element, you're forcing players to use it. This isn't like visual upgrades where those who don't want it just turn it off. If it forces distinct advantages, you're forcing players to utilize it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Agreed.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Having a sight on a gun allows you to be more tactical, giving you greater pin-point accuracy. It's basic physics, if the gun is hip-fired, all the recoil goes to your hands and forearms.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And another thing, if every single other popular fps game is incorporating ADS (aim-down-sight) and NS2 doesn't have it, then many people won't like adjusting to the gameplay. Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment, if you really want the devs to be rewarded for their work, you should let them cater to the FPS-playing populous. To go against the grain when you have so many other worthy titles is just nonsense. I'm compiling this into another suggestion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>NS2 is a sci fi shooter. Anyone who's played NS1 should know why iron sites wouldn't fit. It would slow down the pace of the game pace of the game. If they have to make using iron sites effective for the marine team, they would have to balance it out but severely slowly down aliens and/or weakening them.
Typical in games with ADS(as you're suggesting NS2 should try to be more like), using ADS slows down movement. In NS2, that would also likely mean you can't run, bunny hop, or jetpack while using aiming down the sight, <i>thus handicapping the marines if they have to use it to be effective.</i>
Therefore, to balance it, aliens will have to be slowed down severely and/or weakened.</b>
<b>Also as for using ADS or iron sites just for long range shots, the problem with that is that not all huge distanced areas are just hall ways. You also have to account for large rooms, etc.
If they only made it so shots are less accurate longer ranges(thus forcing you to use an iron site or any ADS), then they'd still underpower the marines because there are large rooms where the distance is big enough(as big as a distanced hallway. For example, ns_machina in NS1, the rooms are huge) for aliens to maneuver all over the place in.
So as for using ADS just for long ranged, that's also just a way to underpower the marine team and slow down the pace of the game.</b>
While it may seem to require "more skillz" to use an iron site just because you click an extra button then aim, NS isn't that type of game.
You'd have to worry about fades moving 80 miles per hour, skulks leaping all over the place, etc.
Holding a steady aim and locking onto an alien who is zooming all over the place is quite a bit of a challenge.
Also arguing that "all the other FPS has it" is like arguing to add Heroes and Creeps in Starcraft II just because the more popular WoW, WC3(Also DotA) has heroes(levelable characters in WoW) and creeps(mobs for WoW), it just doesn't mix well.
NS2 is not CoD in space or is NS2 BF in space. NS2 is an FPS but a a completely different FPS compared to CoD or BF series.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->On a side note, I really don't understand all the QQ about this. If they don't want to use iron sights on their guns then don't press the f****** button to go into aiming mode, or even more simply unbind the key.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Stop thinking about your "pseudo-exclusive elitist NS2 society" for a moment,<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's not it. It's just that NS isn't that type of game(realistic shooter) which is why it shouldn't be in NS(same as why Heroes and Creeps shouldn't be in the regular ladder game of Starcraft 2 for example).
Anyway that's why iron sites(even for just long ranges) wouldn't fit in NS.
<!--quoteo(post=1750431:date=Feb 2 2010, 07:59 PM:name=PSA)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (PSA @ Feb 2 2010, 07:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1750431"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You've totally been missing out on the point on half of these conversations, haven't you.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<img src="http://www.juegomania.org/MechWarrior%202/foto/pc/4/4277/4277_c.jpg/Foto%20MechWarrior%202.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
<!--quoteo(post=1749589:date=Jan 28 2010, 12:32 PM:name=spellman23)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (spellman23 @ Jan 28 2010, 12:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1749589"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Your sarcasm detector just failed. Horribly.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Iron Sights =/= better, just different. NS isn't that kind of game.
<!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->so the actual NS2 rifle behaves a bit differently.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
now, what exactly could that mean? to me it sounds like something is there maybe recoil or spread /overheating
EDIT: That is what the blog said<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
It's simply a safe way to say to all viewers <!--sizeo:7--><span style="font-size:36pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->DON'T JUDGE THE RIFLE, THIS ISN'T FINISHED, WE DON'T WANT TO HEAR YOUR WHINING OR INCESSANT THREADS CONCERNING THIS RIFLE. WE DON'T WANT TO DISCUSS, OR HINT AT, THE NS RIFLE. IGNORE THIS RIFLE. ANY TALK CONCERNING THE RIFLE WOULD BE IGNORING EVERYTHING WE INTENDED THIS VIDEO TO SHOW.<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Hope this clears up the issues presented by the op.
;)
btw, it's usually bad forum etiquette to type in a larger then default font size. It only annoys, and upsets people.
Aliens against Marines (Humans)... That would force a bit of realism to the game if its to be taken serius.
They could f*** the realism all they want if it were Aliens against Space Dogs or something ;)