That's what I keep saying: My original idea refers to some sort of limited haz-mat suit, thats soaking up special damage for a while, be it spores or other toxic substances or even vaccuum or the ability to survive under water.
Ok.... new idea.... A leaf blower to blow the spores away or to douse them with some kind of pesticide. This way, we don't have to do any filtering, have any breathing apparatus, or have any kind of hazmat suit. We just deal with the spores before we enter their location.
<!--quoteo(post=1754324:date=Feb 20 2010, 05:22 PM:name=ehsho)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ehsho @ Feb 20 2010, 05:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754324"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->This leaf blower sounds like a single purpose hard counter to spore. It's bad game design.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Don't forget umbra :)
If it were a pesticide that kills spores, it might also have an effect on infestation.
<!--quoteo(post=1754335:date=Feb 20 2010, 06:58 PM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Feb 20 2010, 06:58 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754335"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Do you live under a bridge Mr. Battle-bug? Do you like the taste of goats?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> I apologize for the bluntness, but you obviously made that post to invoke a negative reaction in myself. (that's what trolling is)
If you're going to insinuate that I'm a troll, you must provide the evidence that I am one. It is also preferred that you not thread jack and pm me instead. This is what I normally do to inform others about trolling. So, I encourage you to privately provide me with the evidence (quotes) that I'm misconducting myself so that I can correct my behavior :)
Now, lets continue on topic and see if we can exhaust all options and opinions.
Well, it was a genuine question posed humorously because I couldn't honestly believe that you were suggesting a "leaf blower". It's unquestionably a hard counter, if not to spores then to lerks in general. Proposing that it <i>may</i> affect infestation is also radical and warrants it's own thread. You jack threads in your own naive way by steering moderate and thought-through ideas to your own fantastical ones which you say yourself are just to 'stimulate discussion'. When you bomb a thread with "How about a leaf-blower?" or "What about some special whatchyamacallit thingymajig?", you detract from the spirit of the post and force people to counter your point in order to progress back on track. It's all the more frustrating because it sounds like your heart is in the right place.
Just so you know, your attempts to distinguish yourself as 'reasonable' by using formal language is obvious. Keep it real, yo!
<!--quoteo(post=1754421:date=Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754421"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You jack threads...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Thank you for keeping this private :(
btw, this is how I normally write.
<!--quoteo(post=1754421:date=Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754421"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well, it was a genuine question posed humorously because I couldn't honestly believe that you were suggesting a "leaf blower". It's unquestionably a hard counter, if not to spores then to lerks in general. Proposing that it <i>may</i> affect infestation is also radical and warrants it's own thread.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I could have used some kind of technical term, but "leaf blower" sums it up. It is a device that uses concentrated air to disperse the spores. The pesticide idea could kill the spores and is what affects the infestation.
I'm trying to provide an alternative to the gas mask. If people like the idea, maybe I'll start a separate thread specifically for it.
As for the "whatchyamacallit thingymajigs," you're speaking of nanites and space germs. Now, lets please keep it professional.
I don't like the idea of a piece of marine equipment that can render alien abilities useless.
(Like how one observatory could un-cloak lots of sensory chambers. I always wanted there should be an equal number of observatories to the number of sensory chambers it is un-cloaking. For instance one observatory to two sensory chambers would be useless but two observatories to two sensory chambers would un-cloak. But that doesn't apply to gas masks, so it's pretty off topic).
<!--quoteo(post=1754429:date=Feb 21 2010, 07:58 AM:name=Hybridclaw)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hybridclaw @ Feb 21 2010, 07:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754429"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't like the idea of a piece of marine equipment that can render alien abilities useless.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> It's not main abilities its interfering with, so I don't think we should consider it to be powerful. It actually just preserves hp and not ap, so it doesn't render the alien ability useless in the first place.
<!--quoteo(post=1754429:date=Feb 21 2010, 03:58 PM:name=Hybridclaw)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hybridclaw @ Feb 21 2010, 03:58 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754429"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't like the idea of a piece of marine equipment that can render alien abilities useless.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The mask won't make you invincible to spores, your armor still is burned and the mask wears out over time as your air reserve depletes.
It will regenerate if the atmosphere is breathable again and spores still retain their role of harassment.
<!--quoteo(post=1754429:date=Feb 21 2010, 08:58 AM:name=Hybridclaw)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Hybridclaw @ Feb 21 2010, 08:58 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754429"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I don't like the idea of a piece of marine equipment that can render alien abilities useless.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I guess you don't like the idea of how a NS1 heavy could make the alien gas useless... Or how a jetpack permits a marine to fly high up which makes the onos useless... Or how a mine can make a skulk useless... Or how a welder can make a gorges webs useless by easily slicing through. You've already stated you don't like how an obs can make cloak useless... And i bet you don't like how a lmg impact can make a cloak useless... or how a wimpy ns1 hand grenade can decloak a whole forest of structures.... You really don't like NS?
The reason marines need the gas mask is because it represents a milestone in protection between a level 1 marine and heavies. The key limiting factor is it will cost something (btw i'm against this... i would rather see some sort of default equipment... for example a map where the whole thing is a hazardous environment, like the planet Pandora, and you play the whole round in gas masks, which adds to the immersion factor of the game. The added benefit is a jetpacker could definitely use the added protection (just like the heavies get from gas).
The gas mask can add a fishbowl effect or something to the outer edges of the screen... and maybe cut some of the peripheral vision. Personally i don't think it should loose it's effectiveness because given the fast-dying rate of marines... it really wouldn't make a difference. However, it wouldn't be a problem if marines could go to an armory and get new filters (or recharge air supply).
<!--quoteo(post=1754534:date=Feb 21 2010, 08:35 PM:name=xmaine)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (xmaine @ Feb 21 2010, 08:35 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754534"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->FocusedWolf, just stop posting. All posts that i read from makes everyone facepalm.
Gasmask is a hard counter to alien spores. The mask is meant specifically for spores. Spores only. Bad gameplay design.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Way to just ignore not just mine, but several others attempts to find ways to suggest why gasmasks are acceptable in NS2. You just fall back to the same old brainless "hard counter for the weakest alien weapon" bull######.
Your post is obviously trolling btw. I much liked your previous version before you quickly edited it where all you said was "your reasons and logic fail hard". You posted it <b>6 seconds</b> after my post. <b>Blatant trolling</b>. My post, #46, was at 8:29 and yours, #47, was 8:35 as everyone can see by reading the posting times.
Yes, the game has counters. It's an RTS; they're supposed to happen. What he's arguing against is pieces of equipment that have literally no purpose other than working against one specific ability.
I fear I'm on Wolf's side here, which is terrifying enough in itself. I guess I'll try to suggest an agreement: The tech is lost when a marine dies and he has to purchase it from his own pool. It's still a soft counter not only aiming at spores more than any other hazard.
Also, stop calling names. It makes <b>you</b> look stupid.
<!--quoteo(post=1754646:date=Feb 22 2010, 07:39 PM:name=RobB)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (RobB @ Feb 22 2010, 07:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754646"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I fear I'm on Wolf's side here, which is terrifying enough in itself. I guess I'll try to suggest an agreement: The tech is lost when a marine dies and he has to purchase it from his own pool. It's still a soft counter not only aiming at spores more than any other hazard.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This sounds like a solution looking for a problem. We had an idea for gas masks, then realized that a piece of equipment that exists only to counter one ability was bad, so we started making up other ways it could be useful. Yeah, EVA environments would be cool, but considering the number of gameplay additions they would need to work properly and the fact that that this game almost cut HA's due to budget limitations, lets not start adding things just for the sake of one idea.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Also, stop calling names. It makes <b>you</b> look stupid.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm more worried that he actually is. I'd feel bad then.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->the fact that that this game almost cut HA's due to budget limitations<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> they wanted to replace heavies with exos.
<!--quoteo(post=1773164:date=Jun 3 2010, 09:14 AM:name=Mahmutti)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mahmutti @ Jun 3 2010, 09:14 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1773164"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->How about making the flame thrower sorta "kill" the spores? Would that be too overpowered?
But then again, I dunno if spores need any kind of a counter.. They're annoying, but I don't think that they need serious nerfing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Damn, I read whole thread and in page 2 I got same idea :P.
But yeah, seconded, it kills enemies, it kills infestation, why would it not be able to kill spores? It would be great as a support weapon, while maybe not as good when it comes to burning a slimey enemy (they look slimey to me, atleast on the inside).
@xmaine I did not see anything wrong with focuswolf post, he had a very valid point if you ask me. ns1 is full of stuff that is not usefull for much more then maybe countering damage to structures (welder, the anti web is a very rare used part, atleast as far as I noticed), or anti-jetpack (webs, how often is it used for slowing normal enemies compared to make a jetpacker unable to fly).
And yet those parts played out well, so just because this particular idea is very limited, it does not mean it must be bad. And yes the stuff from ns1 I mentioned do have secondary uses, but the gas mask have been suggested some aswell, such as protection from certain map-environments, or other splash damage the aliens use (bile bomb?, healing spray, more).
Altough I have to agree that gas-masks is not really that usefull, atleast not enough to be somethign you need to buy. Maybe if it was built into the marine and was quite limited, but still sounds like it would be more of an annoyance (when should I activate it? Will it be enough to go past this place? Is it even worth the cost of armor?) then good balancing..
Comments
Don't forget umbra :)
If it were a pesticide that kills spores, it might also have an effect on infestation.
I apologize for the bluntness, but you obviously made that post to invoke a negative reaction in myself. (that's what trolling is)
If you're going to insinuate that I'm a troll, you must provide the evidence that I am one. It is also preferred that you not thread jack and pm me instead. This is what I normally do to inform others about trolling. So, I encourage you to privately provide me with the evidence (quotes) that I'm misconducting myself so that I can correct my behavior :)
Now, lets continue on topic and see if we can exhaust all options and opinions.
Just so you know, your attempts to distinguish yourself as 'reasonable' by using formal language is obvious. Keep it real, yo!
Thank you for keeping this private :(
btw, this is how I normally write.
<!--quoteo(post=1754421:date=Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM:name=Tweadle)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Tweadle @ Feb 21 2010, 06:50 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1754421"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Well, it was a genuine question posed humorously because I couldn't honestly believe that you were suggesting a "leaf blower". It's unquestionably a hard counter, if not to spores then to lerks in general. Proposing that it <i>may</i> affect infestation is also radical and warrants it's own thread.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I could have used some kind of technical term, but "leaf blower" sums it up. It is a device that uses concentrated air to disperse the spores. The pesticide idea could kill the spores and is what affects the infestation.
I'm trying to provide an alternative to the gas mask. If people like the idea, maybe I'll start a separate thread specifically for it.
As for the "whatchyamacallit thingymajigs," you're speaking of nanites and space germs. Now, lets please keep it professional.
(Like how one observatory could un-cloak lots of sensory chambers. I always wanted there should be an equal number of observatories to the number of sensory chambers it is un-cloaking. For instance one observatory to two sensory chambers would be useless but two observatories to two sensory chambers would un-cloak. But that doesn't apply to gas masks, so it's pretty off topic).
are you my mummy?
It's not main abilities its interfering with, so I don't think we should consider it to be powerful. It actually just preserves hp and not ap, so it doesn't render the alien ability useless in the first place.
The mask won't make you invincible to spores, your armor still is burned and the mask wears out over time as your air reserve depletes.
It will regenerate if the atmosphere is breathable again and spores still retain their role of harassment.
I guess you don't like the idea of how a NS1 heavy could make the alien gas useless... Or how a jetpack permits a marine to fly high up which makes the onos useless... Or how a mine can make a skulk useless... Or how a welder can make a gorges webs useless by easily slicing through. You've already stated you don't like how an obs can make cloak useless... And i bet you don't like how a lmg impact can make a cloak useless... or how a wimpy ns1 hand grenade can decloak a whole forest of structures.... You really don't like NS?
The reason marines need the gas mask is because it represents a milestone in protection between a level 1 marine and heavies. The key limiting factor is it will cost something (btw i'm against this... i would rather see some sort of default equipment... for example a map where the whole thing is a hazardous environment, like the planet Pandora, and you play the whole round in gas masks, which adds to the immersion factor of the game. The added benefit is a jetpacker could definitely use the added protection (just like the heavies get from gas).
The gas mask can add a fishbowl effect or something to the outer edges of the screen... and maybe cut some of the peripheral vision. Personally i don't think it should loose it's effectiveness because given the fast-dying rate of marines... it really wouldn't make a difference. However, it wouldn't be a problem if marines could go to an armory and get new filters (or recharge air supply).
<a href="http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5275/exopack.jpg" target="_blank">http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5275/exopack.jpg</a>
<a href="http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/9355/avatar1st.jpg" target="_blank">http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/9355/avatar1st.jpg</a>
<a href="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v625/lostncybr/Avatar/8ac4e8fc.jpg" target="_blank">http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v625/los...ar/8ac4e8fc.jpg</a>
gasmasks are cool and marines need to look cool (er then the alien team :P).
Gasmask is a hard counter to alien spores. The mask is meant specifically for spores. Spores only. Bad gameplay design.
Gasmask is a hard counter to alien spores. The mask is meant specifically for spores. Spores only. Bad gameplay design.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Way to just ignore not just mine, but several others attempts to find ways to suggest why gasmasks are acceptable in NS2. You just fall back to the same old brainless "hard counter for the weakest alien weapon" bull######.
Your post is obviously trolling btw. I much liked your previous version before you quickly edited it where all you said was "your reasons and logic fail hard". You posted it <b>6 seconds</b> after my post. <b>Blatant trolling</b>. My post, #46, was at 8:29 and yours, #47, was 8:35 as everyone can see by reading the posting times.
Also, FocusedWolf, are you literally retarded?
I guess I'll try to suggest an agreement: The tech is lost when a marine dies and he has to purchase it from his own pool.
It's still a soft counter not only aiming at spores more than any other hazard.
Also, stop calling names. It makes <b>you</b> look stupid.
I guess I'll try to suggest an agreement: The tech is lost when a marine dies and he has to purchase it from his own pool.
It's still a soft counter not only aiming at spores more than any other hazard.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This sounds like a solution looking for a problem. We had an idea for gas masks, then realized that a piece of equipment that exists only to counter one ability was bad, so we started making up other ways it could be useful. Yeah, EVA environments would be cool, but considering the number of gameplay additions they would need to work properly and the fact that that this game almost cut HA's due to budget limitations, lets not start adding things just for the sake of one idea.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Also, stop calling names. It makes <b>you</b> look stupid.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm more worried that he actually is. I'd feel bad then.
they wanted to replace heavies with exos.
As I understand it, Heavy/Exo is the same thing, and it was nearly cut due to budget limitation along with Dynamic Infestation.
Safe to say that UWE is not in "Hey, wouldn't it be cool if..." mode.
>.>
Anywho, I like.
Wait... nope. Still on ignore list.
But then again, I dunno if spores need any kind of a counter.. They're annoying, but I don't think that they need serious nerfing.
But then again, I dunno if spores need any kind of a counter.. They're annoying, but I don't think that they need serious nerfing.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Damn, I read whole thread and in page 2 I got same idea :P.
But yeah, seconded, it kills enemies, it kills infestation, why would it not be able to kill spores? It would be great as a support weapon, while maybe not as good when it comes to burning a slimey enemy (they look slimey to me, atleast on the inside).
@xmaine
I did not see anything wrong with focuswolf post, he had a very valid point if you ask me. ns1 is full of stuff that is not usefull for much more then maybe countering damage to structures (welder, the anti web is a very rare used part, atleast as far as I noticed), or anti-jetpack (webs, how often is it used for slowing normal enemies compared to make a jetpacker unable to fly).
And yet those parts played out well, so just because this particular idea is very limited, it does not mean it must be bad. And yes the stuff from ns1 I mentioned do have secondary uses, but the gas mask have been suggested some aswell, such as protection from certain map-environments, or other splash damage the aliens use (bile bomb?, healing spray, more).
Altough I have to agree that gas-masks is not really that usefull, atleast not enough to be somethign you need to buy. Maybe if it was built into the marine and was quite limited, but still sounds like it would be more of an annoyance (when should I activate it? Will it be enough to go past this place? Is it even worth the cost of armor?) then good balancing..