Tweaking Graphics in NS2
Raven_XI
Join Date: 2003-01-08 Member: 12032Members, Constellation
Join Date: 2003-01-08 Member: 12032Members, Constellation
<div class="IPBDescription">Whats your opinion?</div>NS2 in game footage has recently been released as we all know and may I just say, I think it looks great.
Now, as an Australian, I tend to spend much of my time frequenting the <a href="http://www.ausns2.com" target="_blank">Australian NS2 website</a>. Since this video has been released there has been a brief discussion in our forums that I want everyone to give their opinion about, especially the boys at UWE.
For those who can be bothered to read through it, the latest part of discussion can be found on this thread:
<a href="http://forums.ausns2.com/viewtopic.php?id=474" target="_blank">http://forums.ausns2.com/viewtopic.php?id=474</a>
Just mainly pay attention to my posts (_Raven_11) and the people who respond to me.
For those who cant be bothered, this is what its all about.
The NS2 Pre Alpha footage shows intense muzzle flash and many darkened coridores and areas in the game. Many of the people in the community have seen this and have already decided that as soon as they get the game they are going to attempt to tweak their gamma so there are no darkened areas, get rid of Muzzle flash and whatever else they can do (get rid of skulk teeth?) to their graphics in order to make them able to see things better than everyone else and thus, give them an (unfair?) advantage. Their argument is that having these types of uneccesary graphical obstacles in game takes away from the skill of player v player and equates to a a "poorly developed game".
I believe players should NOT be allowed to do this to their NS2. Surely if everyone has to put up with the same graphical obstacles, then the person who can handle them better are the more skilled and therefore should win. If the game was ment to be played like that, surely the developers would have created it accordingly.
So I pose the questions to you and mainly the team at UWE.
<b>Do you believe players should be able to change their graphics in NS2 to gain an advantage over others?</b>
Now, as an Australian, I tend to spend much of my time frequenting the <a href="http://www.ausns2.com" target="_blank">Australian NS2 website</a>. Since this video has been released there has been a brief discussion in our forums that I want everyone to give their opinion about, especially the boys at UWE.
For those who can be bothered to read through it, the latest part of discussion can be found on this thread:
<a href="http://forums.ausns2.com/viewtopic.php?id=474" target="_blank">http://forums.ausns2.com/viewtopic.php?id=474</a>
Just mainly pay attention to my posts (_Raven_11) and the people who respond to me.
For those who cant be bothered, this is what its all about.
The NS2 Pre Alpha footage shows intense muzzle flash and many darkened coridores and areas in the game. Many of the people in the community have seen this and have already decided that as soon as they get the game they are going to attempt to tweak their gamma so there are no darkened areas, get rid of Muzzle flash and whatever else they can do (get rid of skulk teeth?) to their graphics in order to make them able to see things better than everyone else and thus, give them an (unfair?) advantage. Their argument is that having these types of uneccesary graphical obstacles in game takes away from the skill of player v player and equates to a a "poorly developed game".
I believe players should NOT be allowed to do this to their NS2. Surely if everyone has to put up with the same graphical obstacles, then the person who can handle them better are the more skilled and therefore should win. If the game was ment to be played like that, surely the developers would have created it accordingly.
So I pose the questions to you and mainly the team at UWE.
<b>Do you believe players should be able to change their graphics in NS2 to gain an advantage over others?</b>
Comments
Apart from blatant cheating. (wallhack, aimbot, ect.)
For me I like options to turn graphics down to bare minimum so I can get a higher frame rate.
I guess I'm just one of those people who likes a smooth running game over fancy looks that take more computing power.
The most annoying game in recent times that you can't customize the graphics options allot is modern warfare 2.
The bullet hit sparks in that game make my fps drop to about 15 when they are close up.. which is most of time while being shot at making it incredibly hard to return fire.
It wouldn't be cheating turning hit sparks off and it's just hindering my ability to play the game for no real reason.
No, they wouldn't.
Because high-gamma, lack of hud and 1st person elements, low-detail enviroment, and everything else that "distracts from gameplay" would make the game look terrible to all the possible customers.
Mr. Casual and Joe Pubber like fancy visuals, competitive players usually don't care much for them.
Customization pleases everyone as long as there are limits and rules.
Some consistency mode for servers might be a solution to protect the poor, disadvantaged pubbers from those bad, exploiting pros, but then again we have a lot of casual players, who like to customize their own game with even fancier viewmodels, sprites, etc.
So where do you wanna draw the line?
<!--sizeo:1--><span style="font-size:8pt;line-height:100%"><!--/sizeo-->(please refrain from commenting the cleary exaggerated stereo-typing)<!--sizec--></span><!--/sizec-->
Well, no, there's no reason they should be allowed to - beyond performance reasons - to do this, this is blatant cheating. Something like adjusting the gamma can be neither detected nor enforced, however, but I think UW specifically stated they won't make lighting systems that would give advantage to such things (most things are visibly lit, dark corners are 100% dark, etc.).
NS2 is going for a darker setting IMO, where skulks should be allowed to hide in corners if the map provides them. If a marine really wants to know if something is there, then he should shoot and use a flashlight. Given the large amount of people who want to see into dark corners and will stop at nothing until all they see is bright textures and bright characters, I think a system should be developed that allows mappers to designate areas of the map that can only receive light from a light sort like a flashlight and will always be pitch black, regardless of the gamma setting. This would also do something with all of the models inside the designated area that will prevent them from being seen.
I believe FEAR had something like this. I remember turning up the gamma and brightness but there were always some areas of the levels that were always pitch black dark and only the flashlight could light them up.
<img src="http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/7910/ns2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
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Great ideas Dalin.
<img src="http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/7910/ns2.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />
edit:
Great ideas Dalin.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not necessarily. The problem is that the majority "vets" that post here thinking they're god's gift to the gaming world, and that everyone should stop everything their doing and listen to them are the dregs who really don't make the rest of us who play the game seriously look very good.
meight. MEIGHT. maybe if you listened to me and made all the maps the same as tanith then you'd get more respect. huh? yeah.
OTOH there are a lot of whiny idiots who think theyre good now after everyones quit or were good because they reached div1. but you should really listen to me, im different!!!
make the gameplay so that jacking up gamma has no effect because people are going to do it in or out of game no matter what. LOD is a biggie that should be locked because its basically like whitewalls. TF2 has done a good job with this because you can make it like a PS1 game but doing so has virtually no effect on playing, only your FPS.
<!--quoteo(post=1751997:date=Feb 9 2010, 08:59 AM:name=MuYeah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MuYeah @ Feb 9 2010, 08:59 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1751997"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->meight. MEIGHT. maybe if you listened to me and made all the maps the same as tanith then you'd get more respect. huh? yeah.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Don't listen to this guy. Every map should be a clone of ns_nothing. :D
no, no, no, ns_origin.
You can't do anything about gamma because even a monitor can adjust that so it's up to mappers to make sure their maps does not rely on shadows. However, modifications like making walls white is just a pettier form of cheating in my book.
Basically, there's no way to stop stuff like this from happening, and no real reason to try -- better just to separate "pure NS2" servers from servers that allow modifications such as these. Let people play how they want, but if they do, make sure they're playing against others who are on equal footing.
UWE just needs to make sure that they have validation techniques to ensure that there are "pure" servers will not allow techniques such as this to be used to gain an advantage.
This would be all client-side customizations, so don't worry.
Personally, as long as we're not replacing texture with neon green Skulks, I'm fine. That's what sv_pure is for. Turning up brightness/gamma/light client mods are fine in my book. Something similar to the Knife Gaming Pack will surely come out, and I'll probably use it.
They also claim they have anti-gamma adjusting tweaks in place, I believe.
Yes, but the game shouldn't look like a watercolor that's just had a gallon of water on it :P
My demands are as such:
<ul><li>Ability to change every single model (including character model + animation, weapons, props). So if i want my marines to all be in black, or in green, or in Colonial Marine outfits, then it should be possible.
</li><li>Ability to change, add, and/or remove sprites (including the ability to remove the annoying teeth, the annoying cross hair, the annoying ammo readout, and any other part of the interface i find inferior).
</li><li>Even more modification power... If i want my marines to have shoulder lamps (Aliens movie), then i should be able to script that piece of equipment as an additional light source to aid the marine!
</li><li>If i want a set of night-vision, or thermal-goggles, it should be possible to script it as a client-side mod that can be used on any server.</li></ul>
These things are available for everyone whoever says otherwise is not putting enough effort. Whatever you think of tweaking dont blame your own incompetence in them.
Decreasing LOD is equal to whitewalling but NS2 cannot do anything about it I reckon, so its not the devs' problem. Screenshots can be used as anticheat tool.
1.) Gamma doesn't go high enough. It's going to get dodged anyway, so why make gammapanel a necessity if people want to have brighter maps? I could live with dark maps myself, but it obviously doesn't work in general.
2.) There's a plenty of useless stuff that can be disabled only by file modification. See how Ninelegends pack improves the HUD. All that should either be protected by the consistency or disabled by a client variable. There's no reason to force people to blank everything manually by changing files. Also a lot of things should have been reworked, for example the waypoint sprite is absolutely horrid as it blocks the visibility.
r_atmospherics true/false : Enable/Disable God Rays
r_bloom true/false : Enable/Disable Bloom
r_flash true/false : Enable/Disable flash GUI