<!--quoteo(post=1726376:date=Sep 6 2009, 10:07 PM:name=FocusedWolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FocusedWolf @ Sep 6 2009, 10:07 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726376"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--> Since they are so rare, that sort of indicates the game is unbalanced right now... and it is... you need 15 marines before things get interesting or else it's instant alien win every time... :P
So for a long-match to occur, their would have to be something wrong with the alien team with respect to the research-efforts-res-collecting of the marine team... One possible cause is when a game starts between 2 players... and later on the server fills up with an unusual starting point :P
The BEST!!! map for a long match is cerbsiege!!! reason being... marines can seal up those RTs with weldable walls... this and a relocate to the bunker (plus good marines) means that the marines can repeatedly be geared up and beaconed into marine start (where the door/teleporter is to the siege room)... so marines can have many shots at trying to secure the siege room... or the alternative is that marines fight through the halls all the way to the alien hive... either way that map is epic under the right conditions.
Another good map is digsiege_fnl. As long as marines don't go the easy route of getting into siege room... the other choice is a heavy train through the rocks to alien-start... now that can be epic. Other situations that can occur is marines relocate to the 5-rt tunnel and have to fight their way out because aliens OC'd the entire map...
zzzz no server runs these epic maps anymore... usually it's just the standard crap co_core ns_eclipse ns_hera ns_nothing ######. <!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
My posts are deleted and this guy's are left unscathed.
LOL
I'm not going to bother fixing the errors caused by trying to quote someone on this garbage forum.
<!--quoteo(post=1726463:date=Sep 7 2009, 07:59 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Sep 7 2009, 07:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726463"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My posts are deleted and this guy's are left unscathed.
LOL
I'm not going to bother fixing the errors caused by trying to quote someone on this garbage forum.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
locallyunsceneFeeder of TrollsJoin Date: 2002-12-25Member: 11528Members, Constellation
<!--quoteo(post=1726463:date=Sep 7 2009, 08:59 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Sep 7 2009, 08:59 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726463"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->My posts are deleted and this guy's are left unscathed.
LOL<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> That's because his posts follow the community guidelines. It's not the moderator's job to edit posts for grammar, clarity, or correctness. They generally only edit for inflammatory statements, which most of your posts have had or been. <!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=What You Agreed To)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (What You Agreed To)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Unknown Worlds Community Guidelines
We like to play games with people we like. We also like polite people who can have rational discussions about a wide range of subjects. As such, we've established the following guidelines when posting on our forums and acting in our community:
* Please behave politely at all times. That means refraining from swearing and disrespectful comments (racist, homophobic, religious, etc.). * Our admins (whom are elected from the community) reserve the right to temporarily restrict or ban any people, accounts or IP addresses in response to behavior that violates these rules. However, our admins shall be gentle and reasonable and will use their discretion. * If you ever have questions for our admins or would like to dispute an action, please write us at community@unknownworlds.com. We reply to all reasonable requests.
That's it. If you can't say something nice, say nothing at all! We hope you meet many great new friends both online and offline because of our games.
It's good to have you with us.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I take it you just got back to the forum then? Somehow all his posts end up on the "green armor > black armor", "Aliens are op", "HMG's are underpowered" and "games under 15v15 are alien biased" subjects, which I suppose are a direct result of siege maps (though I can't remember how siege maps work).
Opprobrious, what are you still doing on this garbage forum?
I sometimes start reading a post and wonder why it's so rambling and dumb and I realise I've just read half a page of prose straight from FocusedWolf's head without even checking who posted it.
Longer rounds can still happen, but just because a round takes an hour or more doesn't mean it's "epic". Most longer rounds in all versions were turtling games or a 20 minute game followed by 20 minutes base camping. Rounds with actual fighting over territory and moving "frontlines" have always been rare, although they were awesome. I'm fine with 20 minute games.
<!--quoteo(post=1726543:date=Sep 8 2009, 09:10 PM:name=MuYeah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MuYeah @ Sep 8 2009, 09:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726543"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I sometimes start reading a post and wonder why it's so rambling and dumb and I realise I've just read half a page of prose straight from FocusedWolf's head without even checking who posted it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha true, every single of his posts makes me cry a little inside.
<!--quoteo(post=1726549:date=Sep 8 2009, 01:36 PM:name=Razagal)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Razagal @ Sep 8 2009, 01:36 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726549"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Haha true, every single of his posts makes me cry a little inside.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--quoteo(post=1726526:date=Sep 8 2009, 10:46 AM:name=locallyunscene)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (locallyunscene @ Sep 8 2009, 10:46 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726526"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec--><That's because his posts follow the community guidelines. It's not the moderator's job to edit posts for grammar, clarity, or correctness. They generally only edit for inflammatory statements, which most of your posts have had or been.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Completely subjective.
I've refrained from attacking posters personally.
Polite DOES NOT mean cordial or friendly.
I maintain the decorum that I expect to see in a lively debate.
<!--quoteo(post=1726540:date=Sep 8 2009, 01:53 PM:name=tjosan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (tjosan @ Sep 8 2009, 01:53 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726540"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I find having to trash his posts is giving me inflammed wrists from all the typing. That's pretty inflammatory if you ask me!!!
Besides, we need to be able to dual wield HMGs in teams of thirty marines, or else that gorge will spit us to death. Man.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I'm with the OP on this one, 3.2 is terrible, 1.4 all the way.
I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.
You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.
You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.
and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.
The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.
It's obvious why the player base shrunk after every update past 1.4, because every update made the game less fun.
<!--quoteo(post=1726986:date=Sep 11 2009, 08:32 PM:name=8-bit thief)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (8-bit thief @ Sep 11 2009, 08:32 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726986"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I'm with the OP on this one, 3.2 is terrible, 1.4 all the way.
I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.
You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.
You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.
and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.
The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.
It's obvious why the player base shrunk after every update past 1.4, because every update made the game less fun.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
And you're not a troll? This whole thread you've been negative. 8-bit thief stated that he did not like 3.2 as much as 1.04 and backed his opinions with solid reasons.
Anyway yeah I definitely agree with razor's statement of nostalgia goggles. My chief example of this would probably be Goldeneye 007 and Perfect Dark (both N64 titles); they are made almost unplayable nowadays by the absolutely terrible fps and the controller's inoperable joystick. NS v1.04 was rife with poor server performance, bunnyhopping marines, fps dependent build times and jetpack efficiency, and poorly designed maps with double siege points.
<!--quoteo(post=1726990:date=Sep 12 2009, 05:26 AM:name=Invader_Scoot)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Invader_Scoot @ Sep 12 2009, 05:26 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726990"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And you're not a troll?
This whole thread you've been negative. 8-bit thief stated that he did not like 3.2 as much as 1.04 and backed his opinions with solid reasons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Solid reasons?
Let's see:
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=8-bit thief)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (8-bit thief)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, this is one of the big server issues. People play those for some reason, no matter how ridiculous tech picks there are. 1.04 would've been very similar, if not worse on such massive servers. Still, I get to skulk and stalk a lot, people just are using headphones nowadays so you can't slip that many sounds.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> The whole alien early game revolves around defending those RTs. It's just that the big servers have this chaotic tendency as the marines are able to spread out everywhere. Once again, the big server is the issue, not the 3.2.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, first of all that's just your opinion. In addition, now that people are maybe slightly more aware of the gameplay, they'd most likely tell you to stop wasting res in 1.04 too.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Opinions, you are the very first person I hear saying that 1.04 flight model was better. I felt the old model was totally awkward. Hitting space twice, maybe three times doesn't sound that bad to me.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ever thought why there were such comebacks? People were still learning the game. I'd say NS 3.2 has far more options for comebacks than 1.04, just back then people weren't used to playing the game. Nowadays 1.04 games would be won with a quick JP rush 90% of the time.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If my memory serves me right, NS 1.04 had far more useless time like that. There are solutions like allowing F4 and IP recycling, but most servers don't allow them. Once again, I think 3.2 has more possiblities for comebacks, but it's more difficult because people play better. In 1.04 the comms were bad enough to give aliens a chance. Nowadays most comms are good enough to deny aliens the biggest lifelines, but not good enough to finish the game quickly.
So, as games get older, the playstyle becomes more optimized and predictable. My way of getting over that is to get deeper into the game and learning to enjoy the smaller details where there's still more alternatives.
I wish my favourite band still played live with the same insane joy and enthusiasism they did on their first gigs, but it simply doesn't happen. They still enjoy tremendously and have awesome gigs afaik, but in a different, slightly more composed and delicate way. Such thing happened to NS too, except that I think NS got also _a lot_ better in many ways, it wasn't just a slight routine creeping in to the performance.
<!--quoteo(post=1726990:date=Sep 11 2009, 09:26 PM:name=Invader_Scoot)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Invader_Scoot @ Sep 11 2009, 09:26 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726990"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->And you're not a troll? This whole thread you've been negative. 8-bit thief stated that he did not like 3.2 as much as 1.04 and backed his opinions with solid reasons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Solid reasons? Did you actually read his post? It was 100% bull######.
Man am i sorry i ever started this post:) Come on guys how about some civility.
So i spend some time playing NS this week to see if it was really so much worse than 1.04 and the versions before. And guess what, in my opinoin it really is.
I just dont get this game/community anymore, none of the games i played in made any sense to me.
Why is it that nobody deploys turrets anymore to defend their base? i asked this ingame to my team and the overwhelming response was "it's a waste or resources" Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.
Then i got it! people really expect the outcome of the game to be determined in the first five minutes of playing.
To most players it seems the game can only be won by charging the hivepoint right at the start of the game, dont defend your base! the game will not last long enough to use it for anything else than spawning anyway.
I played a lot of matches this week and i cant say i had any fun what so ever, its pretty clear to me that the game is now focused more on the needs and wants of "counterstrike" players than the people who started playing in the beta and had a hell of a lot of fun.
Dont get me wrong i still love the game and i pre-ordered my special editon of NS2 last week. But i really hope the devs can balance NS2 so both the old players and the new "combat" players can have fun together.
<!--quoteo(post=1727008:date=Sep 12 2009, 12:54 PM:name=LordHorusNL)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LordHorusNL @ Sep 12 2009, 12:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727008"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I just dont get this game/community anymore, none of the games i played in made any sense to me.
Why is it that nobody deploys turrets anymore to defend their base? i asked this ingame to my team and the overwhelming response was "it's a waste or resources" Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sometimes turrets can be useful in pub games, but usually they are a waste of res. That is not something that changed in later versions, it was simply learned by the players. The 2 Fades and the Onos you are talking about would have destroyed the TF in no time, even with 10 turrets around it. Nowadays mines are used to defend structures.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->To most players it seems the game can only be won by charging the hivepoint right at the start of the game, dont defend your base!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Isn't that how it's always been? You push out to secure some RTs. Directly charging the main hive only works on large servers, where marines are totally overpowered.
<!--quoteo(post=1727008:date=Sep 12 2009, 10:54 AM:name=LordHorusNL)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LordHorusNL @ Sep 12 2009, 10:54 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727008"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Why is it that nobody deploys turrets anymore to defend their base? i asked this ingame to my team and the overwhelming response was "it's a waste or resources" Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> So, if you can't fight those 2 fades and onos at base without turrets, how are you going to fight them outside? Matches aren't won from the MS.
I can assure you 3.2 has got dramatic increase in depth and huge improvements gameplay wise. It's up to you whether you find the depth and enjoy it. On present 32 player publics it might be difficult though.
<!--quoteo(post=1727001:date=Sep 12 2009, 04:30 AM:name=homicide)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (homicide @ Sep 12 2009, 04:30 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727001"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Solid reasons? Did you actually read his post? It was 100% bull######.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There may have been reasons I don't agree with in his post, but they were <i>his</i> reasons. Whether someone likes one version of NS over another is a matter of opinion. I myself like Smash Bros. Melee FAR better than Brawl, and I can give plenty of reasons for that too. Which is of course another matter of opinion.
<!--quoteo(post=1727045:date=Sep 12 2009, 08:31 PM:name=Invader_Scoot)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Invader_Scoot @ Sep 12 2009, 08:31 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727045"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->There may have been reasons I don't agree with in his post, but they were <i>his</i> reasons. Whether someone likes one version of NS over another is a matter of opinion. I myself like Smash Bros. Melee FAR better than Brawl, and I can give plenty of reasons for that too. Which is of course another matter of opinion.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> They were his reasons, but most of the reasons don't originate from the 1.04 --> 3.2 transition, but from the natural change and partitial development of the gaming style. In a similar way I wish publics were still 22 player max servers, but it doesn't mean that 3.2 would suck just because most servers have the cap of 26 or more.
<!--quoteo(post=1727063:date=Sep 13 2009, 01:56 AM:name=Bacillus)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Bacillus @ Sep 13 2009, 01:56 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727063"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->They were his reasons, but most of the reasons don't originate from the 1.04 --> 3.2 transition, but from the natural change and partitial development of the gaming style. In a similar way I wish publics were still 22 player max servers, but it doesn't mean that 3.2 would suck just because most servers have the cap of 26 or more.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Come on down to the <gud> server. 24 player max hosted in Chicago. BS_0
<!--quoteo(post=1727075:date=Sep 13 2009, 01:51 PM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Sep 13 2009, 01:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727075"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Come on down to the <gud> server. 24 player max hosted in Chicago. BS_0<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd--> Playing with high ping is not much fun :(
<!--quoteo(post=1727075:date=Sep 13 2009, 06:51 AM:name=Opprobrious)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Opprobrious @ Sep 13 2009, 06:51 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1727075"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Come on down to the <gud> server. 24 player max hosted in Chicago. BS_0<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is definitely the server that I immediately join whenever I see it has some players, but for the past while it's been so empty. When it's got a crowd this is easily Natural Selection's current greatest server...
I recall the forum rules explicitly forbidding server advertisement? But yeah, it's funny how the only people I see posting knowledgeable and well-founded arguments/comments are a) ex-top players and b) the usual forum culprits who have been posting on here for god knows how many years. Mostly all of the idiotic posts I look at the forum username and think "who is this?". In a community as small as the NS one, that basically means you're a nobody.
Comments
Since they are so rare, that sort of indicates the game is unbalanced right now... and it is... you need 15 marines before things get interesting or else it's instant alien win every time... :P
So for a long-match to occur, their would have to be something wrong with the alien team with respect to the research-efforts-res-collecting of the marine team... One possible cause is when a game starts between 2 players... and later on the server fills up with an unusual starting point :P
The BEST!!! map for a long match is cerbsiege!!! reason being... marines can seal up those RTs with weldable walls... this and a relocate to the bunker (plus good marines) means that the marines can repeatedly be geared up and beaconed into marine start (where the door/teleporter is to the siege room)... so marines can have many shots at trying to secure the siege room... or the alternative is that marines fight through the halls all the way to the alien hive... either way that map is epic under the right conditions.
Another good map is digsiege_fnl. As long as marines don't go the easy route of getting into siege room... the other choice is a heavy train through the rocks to alien-start... now that can be epic. Other situations that can occur is marines relocate to the 5-rt tunnel and have to fight their way out because aliens OC'd the entire map...
zzzz no server runs these epic maps anymore... usually it's just the standard crap co_core ns_eclipse ns_hera ns_nothing ######.
<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
My posts are deleted and this guy's are left unscathed.
LOL
I'm not going to bother fixing the errors caused by trying to quote someone on this garbage forum.
LOL
I'm not going to bother fixing the errors caused by trying to quote someone on this garbage forum.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I demand a proper quoting xD
LOL<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That's because his posts follow the community guidelines. It's not the moderator's job to edit posts for grammar, clarity, or correctness. They generally only edit for inflammatory statements, which most of your posts have had or been.
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=What You Agreed To)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (What You Agreed To)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Unknown Worlds Community Guidelines
We like to play games with people we like. We also like polite people who can have rational discussions about a wide range of subjects. As such, we've established the following guidelines when posting on our forums and acting in our community:
* Please behave politely at all times. That means refraining from swearing and disrespectful comments (racist, homophobic, religious, etc.).
* Our admins (whom are elected from the community) reserve the right to temporarily restrict or ban any people, accounts or IP addresses in response to behavior that violates these rules. However, our admins shall be gentle and reasonable and will use their discretion.
* If you ever have questions for our admins or would like to dispute an action, please write us at community@unknownworlds.com. We reply to all reasonable requests.
That's it. If you can't say something nice, say nothing at all! We hope you meet many great new friends both online and offline because of our games.
It's good to have you with us.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I take it you just got back to the forum then? Somehow all his posts end up on the "green armor > black armor", "Aliens are op", "HMG's are underpowered" and "games under 15v15 are alien biased" subjects, which I suppose are a direct result of siege maps (though I can't remember how siege maps work).
Opprobrious, what are you still doing on this garbage forum?
Besides, we need to be able to dual wield HMGs in teams of thirty marines, or else that gorge will spit us to death. Man.
I'll just leave this here.
Most longer rounds in all versions were turtling games or a 20 minute game followed by 20 minutes base camping.
Rounds with actual fighting over territory and moving "frontlines" have always been rare, although they were awesome.
I'm fine with 20 minute games.
<!--quoteo(post=1726543:date=Sep 8 2009, 09:10 PM:name=MuYeah)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (MuYeah @ Sep 8 2009, 09:10 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1726543"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I sometimes start reading a post and wonder why it's so rambling and dumb and I realise I've just read half a page of prose straight from FocusedWolf's head without even checking who posted it.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Haha true, every single of his posts makes me cry a little inside.
+1
Also, thanks for that ignore link
Completely subjective.
I've refrained from attacking posters personally.
Polite DOES NOT mean cordial or friendly.
I maintain the decorum that I expect to see in a lively debate.
In other words, a touchpad user that thinks that marines are underpowered.
Besides, we need to be able to dual wield HMGs in teams of thirty marines, or else that gorge will spit us to death. Man.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Lawl. :P
I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.
You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.
You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.
and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.
The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.
It's obvious why the player base shrunk after every update past 1.4, because every update made the game less fun.
Nostalgia goggles can do wonders.
I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.
You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.
You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.
and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.
The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.
It's obvious why the player base shrunk after every update past 1.4, because every update made the game less fun.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
stop trolling
And you're not a troll? This whole thread you've been negative. 8-bit thief stated that he did not like 3.2 as much as 1.04 and backed his opinions with solid reasons.
Anyway yeah I definitely agree with razor's statement of nostalgia goggles. My chief example of this would probably be Goldeneye 007 and Perfect Dark (both N64 titles); they are made almost unplayable nowadays by the absolutely terrible fps and the controller's inoperable joystick. NS v1.04 was rife with poor server performance, bunnyhopping marines, fps dependent build times and jetpack efficiency, and poorly designed maps with double siege points.
This whole thread you've been negative. 8-bit thief stated that he did not like 3.2 as much as 1.04 and backed his opinions with solid reasons.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Solid reasons?
Let's see:
<!--quoteo(post=0:date=:name=8-bit thief)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (8-bit thief)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I remember as a skulk you had to stalk your prey, following the marine waiting for just the right time to strike, sure we still get that but only for the first 5 minutes once marines get motion sensing that whole element is gone.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, this is one of the big server issues. People play those for some reason, no matter how ridiculous tech picks there are. 1.04 would've been very similar, if not worse on such massive servers. Still, I get to skulk and stalk a lot, people just are using headphones nowadays so you can't slip that many sounds.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You actually had to defend your resources, now you just drop the RT leave and prey that the opposite team doesn't find it, because of this playing gorge just isn't fun anymore, what's so great about going around dropping random RTs everywhere? gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The whole alien early game revolves around defending those RTs. It's just that the big servers have this chaotic tendency as the marines are able to spread out everywhere. Once again, the big server is the issue, not the 3.2.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->gorge forts were awesome, if I drop an OC today my team will tell me to stop wasting resources.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well, first of all that's just your opinion. In addition, now that people are maybe slightly more aware of the gameplay, they'd most likely tell you to stop wasting res in 1.04 too.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->You didn't have to press the space bar like a maniac on lerk, playing lerk was actually fun and easy to get the hang of, now it just feels awkward.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Opinions, you are the very first person I hear saying that 1.04 flight model was better. I felt the old model was totally awkward. Hitting space twice, maybe three times doesn't sound that bad to me.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->and of course the epic matches, matches where I saw the aliens with 3 hives end up losing, and where aliens with 1 hive took down a team full of heavies.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ever thought why there were such comebacks? People were still learning the game. I'd say NS 3.2 has far more options for comebacks than 1.04, just back then people weren't used to playing the game. Nowadays 1.04 games would be won with a quick JP rush 90% of the time.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The most annoying thing about 3.2 is that I can tell who's going to win halfway through, so that means I have to spend 10-20 minutes pointlessly defending my last hive/marine spawn knowing that it's all in vain.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
If my memory serves me right, NS 1.04 had far more useless time like that. There are solutions like allowing F4 and IP recycling, but most servers don't allow them. Once again, I think 3.2 has more possiblities for comebacks, but it's more difficult because people play better. In 1.04 the comms were bad enough to give aliens a chance. Nowadays most comms are good enough to deny aliens the biggest lifelines, but not good enough to finish the game quickly.
So, as games get older, the playstyle becomes more optimized and predictable. My way of getting over that is to get deeper into the game and learning to enjoy the smaller details where there's still more alternatives.
I wish my favourite band still played live with the same insane joy and enthusiasism they did on their first gigs, but it simply doesn't happen. They still enjoy tremendously and have awesome gigs afaik, but in a different, slightly more composed and delicate way. Such thing happened to NS too, except that I think NS got also _a lot_ better in many ways, it wasn't just a slight routine creeping in to the performance.
Solid reasons? Did you actually read his post? It was 100% bull######.
So i spend some time playing NS this week to see if it was really so much worse than 1.04 and the versions before.
And guess what, in my opinoin it really is.
I just dont get this game/community anymore, none of the games i played in made any sense to me.
Why is it that nobody deploys turrets anymore to defend their base? i asked this ingame to my team and the overwhelming response was "it's a waste or resources"
Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.
Then i got it! people really expect the outcome of the game to be determined in the first five minutes of playing.
To most players it seems the game can only be won by charging the hivepoint right at the start of the game, dont defend your base! the game will not last long enough to use it for anything else than spawning anyway.
I played a lot of matches this week and i cant say i had any fun what so ever, its pretty clear to me that the game is now focused more on the needs and wants of "counterstrike" players than the people who started playing in the beta and had a hell of a lot of fun.
Dont get me wrong i still love the game and i pre-ordered my special editon of NS2 last week. But i really hope the devs can balance NS2 so both the old players and the new "combat" players can have fun together.
Why is it that nobody deploys turrets anymore to defend their base? i asked this ingame to my team and the overwhelming response was "it's a waste or resources"
Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Sometimes turrets can be useful in pub games, but usually they are a waste of res.
That is not something that changed in later versions, it was simply learned by the players.
The 2 Fades and the Onos you are talking about would have destroyed the TF in no time, even with 10 turrets around it.
Nowadays mines are used to defend structures.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->To most players it seems the game can only be won by charging the hivepoint right at the start of the game, dont defend your base!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Isn't that how it's always been? You push out to secure some RTs.
Directly charging the main hive only works on large servers, where marines are totally overpowered.
Really? they told me it was a waste of resources while 2 fades and a onos ran through our base destroying everything in sight.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So, if you can't fight those 2 fades and onos at base without turrets, how are you going to fight them outside? Matches aren't won from the MS.
I can assure you 3.2 has got dramatic increase in depth and huge improvements gameplay wise. It's up to you whether you find the depth and enjoy it. On present 32 player publics it might be difficult though.
There may have been reasons I don't agree with in his post, but they were <i>his</i> reasons. Whether someone likes one version of NS over another is a matter of opinion. I myself like Smash Bros. Melee FAR better than Brawl, and I can give plenty of reasons for that too. Which is of course another matter of opinion.
They were his reasons, but most of the reasons don't originate from the 1.04 --> 3.2 transition, but from the natural change and partitial development of the gaming style. In a similar way I wish publics were still 22 player max servers, but it doesn't mean that 3.2 would suck just because most servers have the cap of 26 or more.
Come on down to the <gud> server. 24 player max hosted in Chicago. BS_0
Playing with high ping is not much fun :(
This is definitely the server that I immediately join whenever I see it has some players, but for the past while it's been so empty. When it's got a crowd this is easily Natural Selection's current greatest server...