Concerns regarding Independent marines.

Pollo Jack · July 2009

Anyone else concerned about marines being able to "buy" their own weapons?

Would each rine be able to buy from their own stash of cash, or the group pool. Granted on a pug it would be pooled jsut for team work, but in pubs heh.

I just think back on times when all our heaviest were given, quite literally to the lowest five players. Why? They respawn more, thus are more often in base to get the goods.

I also am regularily reminded of the people that know how to play and still suck and regularily complain when top teirs have guns first, or have a bad idea and refuse to drop it.

pSyk0mAn · July 2009

I guess marines will have their own res pool just like aliens. They want to make the res systems more a like, so with the alien commander on one side it make sense to have marines with their own respool on the other side.

I just hope commanders are still able to drop weapons or in the case of the alien commander able to drop some kind of res package for certain players to accomplish a special strategy, of course with the sacrifice of techspeed since the comm looses res for research/upgrades.

TheMatrix · July 2009

I just dont hope that it will be like one of those mods for Ns1 were you have to earn exp and then just can get what ever you want lol ^^ (was a little too easy)

Avata · July 2009

I was thinking about this last night while playing... The comm needs a "locker" system. He purchases weapons like normal but dropping them on the Armory puts it in the lockers. This always starts at the top of the ladder and progresses down for each weapon added. Drop 5 HMGs, the first 5 players have HMG's they can pick up at the armory. If comm drops a GL on the armory, then he can either add that to the next player in line, or give to a specific person's locker. That person can then chose HMG or GL. If the player leaves the game, then the locker items filter down the ladder.

Have it so you can swap your weapon at the armory too. You have a GL and HMG in locker. You grab GL, phase, kill OC's, phase back, swap gl for HMG. Comm can move items from one locker to another. This is all done in the score board... press HMG button, bring up scoreboard, drop on a persons name, that person can now "buy" that gun when they want it.

Comm can drop weapons as normal though if he wants.

This is kind of like earning points or res to buy... in that as the person with the most kills, you're most likely to get the first choice of guns. Player goes out and kicks ass and doesn't die for 5 minutes. In the meantime comm drops shotguns for the re-spawners, but drops one in the armory. When the kick ass player finally gets back to base (by death or pg or other) he has a shotgun handy, and maybe even a HMG by this stage.

Do the same for armor... drop armor into the armory, and the player gets it added to their "locker" to dress up or down

TheMatrix · July 2009

hmm you could also make a systerm like a "storage room" for each player so the commander can add weapons/tools/armor to that player so when he respawns he gets that weaponm that way a commander would be able to assign units to tasks (ie welder, soldier, so on so on) Just a thought though

radforChrist · July 2009

I guess the funny thing to me is initially, the marines were to be the "team" based game play, with the team dependent on the commander, and the Kharaa the individual based players with individual resources.

However, in NS right now, if the aliens don't work together, game is simply over. There is no other way. With NS2, it seems the marines will have more autonomy, which does concern me as they're the side which seems to need more of a push to work together.

S!K · July 2009

I agree 100% with you Pollo. I'm worried that the new players are going to end up raping the entire team of their resources for their guns. I think that if a marine should have the ability to buy his own weapons, he should have some form of achievement in-game, like at least 5-10 kills to buy a shotgun.

Anyway, I still think the commander should have complete control as to which marines get the weapons. If he's following a player, who manages to build him 2-3 res nodes, and kill a bunch of aliens while doing it, should be recognized by the commander, and they usually are. That way when that player respawns, he can ask the commander for a better gun and should have no problem getting it.

devicenull · July 2009

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Avata @ Jul 6 2009, 10:07 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1715939"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I was thinking about this last night while playing... The comm needs a "locker" system. He purchases weapons like normal but dropping them on the Armory puts it in the lockers. This always starts at the top of the ladder and progresses down for each weapon added. Drop 5 HMGs, the first 5 players have HMG's they can pick up at the armory. If comm drops a GL on the armory, then he can either add that to the next player in line, or give to a specific person's locker. That person can then chose HMG or GL. If the player leaves the game, then the locker items filter down the ladder.

Have it so you can swap your weapon at the armory too. You have a GL and HMG in locker. You grab GL, phase, kill OC's, phase back, swap gl for HMG. Comm can move items from one locker to another. This is all done in the score board... press HMG button, bring up scoreboard, drop on a persons name, that person can now "buy" that gun when they want it.

Comm can drop weapons as normal though if he wants.

This is kind of like earning points or res to buy... in that as the person with the most kills, you're most likely to get the first choice of guns. Player goes out and kicks ass and doesn't die for 5 minutes. In the meantime comm drops shotguns for the re-spawners, but drops one in the armory. When the kick ass player finally gets back to base (by death or pg or other) he has a shotgun handy, and maybe even a HMG by this stage.

Do the same for armor... drop armor into the armory, and the player gets it added to their "locker" to dress up or down</div>

No, that's a terrible idea. Kills do not mean you are good member of the team. Kills mean you went and spawn camped somewhere, or have been doing nothing but killing aliens (not building, not going to waypoints, etc). This is not CS. Just because you have an uber KD ratio does not mean you are a good player.

FocusedWolf · July 2009

All the more reason that guns should be 100% free so that once a commander has researched them... you get your pick to use what feels best.

To balance this... all guns should be effective... lmg should do good damage and accuracy with limited magazine... hmg should do everything good with slightly longer reload (like 4 seconds). Shotgun should be devastating in every conceivable distance in game (since we're indoors it should have tight patterns and be like a pump action sniper rifle).

So in this model... all guns kick ass... all guns are free after research... there problem solved and it's balanced... just give aliens whatever... flamethrower breath etc so they stay happy... but give marines what they love most of all... guns and shooting things with guns...

Obviously the same should be done for jet pants and heavy armor... it should be free for the player to choose once researched.

Capping res would still be needed to deny enemy resources and allow your team to do upgrades and most of all to control sectors with the new style they got where holding territory is more important then attacking fades and hives...

There now know one can say "then that idea makes capping res useless".

Maybe the com can do research on SLINGS so you can carry a shotgun or flamethrower along with your lmg (since lmgs are now like mp5's and all the specialists love them in NS2)... that makes you an overall extremely useful player... you can kill anything... and do everything... :P.

SjN · July 2009

I kinda like how marines are 100% depended on the comm and I hope they keep it that way.

"take any gun you want" takes away the freedom from the commander to take charge of strategies...

What's gonna stop from some random player on the team to scream "let's shutgun rush", and it will be out of commanders control because he's no longer in charge of weapons. Marines will be free to do what ever they please.

Bottom line is, the commander has to work his way to gather resources in order to do HA/HMG or JP/SHOTTY rush. And should remain as part of his responsibilities..

If you want more freedom picking guns and having fun with them, download NS1 and play combat, and don't turn NS into one of these games :<

TheMatrix · July 2009

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SjN @ Jul 7 2009, 07:41 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1716133"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'>I kinda like how marines are 100% depended on the comm and I hope they keep it that way.

"take any gun you want" takes away the freedom from the commander to take charge of strategies...

What's gonna stop from some random player on the team to scream "let's shutgun rush", and it will be out of commanders control because he's no longer in charge of weapons. Marines will be free to do what ever they please.

Bottom line is, the commander has to work his way to gather resources in order to do HA/HMG or JP/SHOTTY rush. And should remain as part of his responsibilities..

If you want more freedom picking guns and having fun with them, download NS1 and play combat, and don't turn NS into one of these games :<</div>

Or play counter strike:P J/K

I aggre totaly with you

Alaska · July 2009

I thought exactly the same.
Marines are the guys who get orders and fullfill them as good as they can.
Anything regarding tactics is up to the comm.
Thats just a rough scatch of the responsibility-distribution.
The important thing is: if marines can choose which weapon to go with and what equiptment to take with them, the commander has much less power over tactics and strategies.

And of course marines shouldn't be able to carry multiple weapons. That's ridiculous and there's no need to discuss such stuff.

The_Real_Quasar · July 2009

With a good commander in the chair, the current system is very effective. It allows the commander to reward those that follow orders, meaning that those orders are more likely to be followed.

I'm sure that all of these issues will crop up during the alpha and beta at some point, there are likely to be many iterations of just how the system works before anything is finalised.

Jiriki · July 2009

Just more reason to do a promod. Well we'll see how this turns out.

RobB · July 2009

That's why there's an alpha and a beta scheduled.

Concerns regarding Independent marines.

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