ns_origin remake
Menes
Join Date: 2005-01-23 Member: 37600Members, NS1 Playtester
Join Date: 2005-01-23 Member: 37600Members, NS1 Playtester
<div class="IPBDescription">oh yeah</div>Hello, I remade ns_origin.
[attachmentid=35508]
Thanks to my faithful servants meb, renholder and mike for early build tests and suggestions. Thanks to all who tested the map and made suggestions prior to this release. Thanks to cadaver who made the original map and the people who originally helped him. And of course, thanks JazzX for the minimaps.
<b><!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->Updated to beta 7:<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--></b>
<a href="http://download.jarhedz.com/ns_beta/direct/3.2/ns_origin_beta7.zip" target="_blank"><b>Download beta 7 here</b></a> (thanks puzl for hosting)
Beta 6 to beta 7 changelog:
- Lighting more accurate to old origin, with a few intentional changes
- Fixed being able to stop the Cargo Bay elevators after blocking them for a few seconds
- Added an extra vent entrance North-East of Biodome leading to the already existing vent system
- Added a weldable vent leading directly to Power Core
- Modified Power Core and its resource node placement
- Reduced the length of the hallway North-West of Biodome
- Added an extra column North of Biodome (protecting the resource node from long distance shooting)
- Changed the Biodome / Ventilation vent so it has some elevation in it, preventing being able to shoot aliens at a long distance on one side of the vent
- Updated minimaps and added Power Core to the labelled minimaps (thanks JazzX)
That's all I can remember
Updated full changelog:
Gameplay changes:
- Biodome elevators replaced with stairs
<b>- Added two extra columns in Biodome, one on each side of the room (beta 7)</b>
- Moved Xenoform Research resource node to Power Core
- Moved Biodome node to North-East of Biodome
- Raised Ventilation area, so the Cargo Bay ladders are shorter
- Modified the small hallway between Furnace and Ore Extraction
- Raised Ore Extraction's ceiling and lowered its length to fit the above change
- Added a vent leading to Coolant Monitoring from the Furnace/Ventilation vent
- Added a vent connecting the two vent systems above Cargo Bay
<b>- Connected the 2 vent systems in the Biodome/Power Core area (beta 7)</b>
<b>- Added an extra vent entrance North-East of Biodome leading to the already existing vent system (beta 7)</b>
- Added a weldable vent leading directly to Power Core (beta 7)
<b>- Moved Furnace hive 32 units to the east (beta 7)</b>
- All transparent textured railings now block shots (Cargo bay, Computer Lab, etc.)
- Tranparent textured floors in Lava Catwalk now block shots (commander can now drop things on it)
- Cargo Bay elevators now don't instantly kill players (they do 45 damage / second)
- Hallway between Cargo Bay and Ore Extraction is now accessible for an onos
- Ore Scanner is now much more commander friendly
Bug fixes:
- Famous stuck points in Ventilation are gone
- Biodome floor fixed
- Weird particle effect in Cargo Bay fixed
- Various restricted clipping areas removed
Esthetic changes:
- Small architecture changes in many areas
- Many texturing changes
- Heavily modified ready room
- Modified the lighting in many areas
Comments and posts of awe accepted.
Happy fragging
*** <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=96964" target="_blank">Dedicated to [t]Annihilator, NS's all-time best commander</a> ***
[attachmentid=35508]
Thanks to my faithful servants meb, renholder and mike for early build tests and suggestions. Thanks to all who tested the map and made suggestions prior to this release. Thanks to cadaver who made the original map and the people who originally helped him. And of course, thanks JazzX for the minimaps.
<b><!--coloro:#FF0000--><span style="color:#FF0000"><!--/coloro-->Updated to beta 7:<!--colorc--></span><!--/colorc--></b>
<a href="http://download.jarhedz.com/ns_beta/direct/3.2/ns_origin_beta7.zip" target="_blank"><b>Download beta 7 here</b></a> (thanks puzl for hosting)
Beta 6 to beta 7 changelog:
- Lighting more accurate to old origin, with a few intentional changes
- Fixed being able to stop the Cargo Bay elevators after blocking them for a few seconds
- Added an extra vent entrance North-East of Biodome leading to the already existing vent system
- Added a weldable vent leading directly to Power Core
- Modified Power Core and its resource node placement
- Reduced the length of the hallway North-West of Biodome
- Added an extra column North of Biodome (protecting the resource node from long distance shooting)
- Changed the Biodome / Ventilation vent so it has some elevation in it, preventing being able to shoot aliens at a long distance on one side of the vent
- Updated minimaps and added Power Core to the labelled minimaps (thanks JazzX)
That's all I can remember
Updated full changelog:
Gameplay changes:
- Biodome elevators replaced with stairs
<b>- Added two extra columns in Biodome, one on each side of the room (beta 7)</b>
- Moved Xenoform Research resource node to Power Core
- Moved Biodome node to North-East of Biodome
- Raised Ventilation area, so the Cargo Bay ladders are shorter
- Modified the small hallway between Furnace and Ore Extraction
- Raised Ore Extraction's ceiling and lowered its length to fit the above change
- Added a vent leading to Coolant Monitoring from the Furnace/Ventilation vent
- Added a vent connecting the two vent systems above Cargo Bay
<b>- Connected the 2 vent systems in the Biodome/Power Core area (beta 7)</b>
<b>- Added an extra vent entrance North-East of Biodome leading to the already existing vent system (beta 7)</b>
- Added a weldable vent leading directly to Power Core (beta 7)
<b>- Moved Furnace hive 32 units to the east (beta 7)</b>
- All transparent textured railings now block shots (Cargo bay, Computer Lab, etc.)
- Tranparent textured floors in Lava Catwalk now block shots (commander can now drop things on it)
- Cargo Bay elevators now don't instantly kill players (they do 45 damage / second)
- Hallway between Cargo Bay and Ore Extraction is now accessible for an onos
- Ore Scanner is now much more commander friendly
Bug fixes:
- Famous stuck points in Ventilation are gone
- Biodome floor fixed
- Weird particle effect in Cargo Bay fixed
- Various restricted clipping areas removed
Esthetic changes:
- Small architecture changes in many areas
- Many texturing changes
- Heavily modified ready room
- Modified the lighting in many areas
Comments and posts of awe accepted.
Happy fragging
*** <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=96964" target="_blank">Dedicated to [t]Annihilator, NS's all-time best commander</a> ***
Comments
Cheers,
~ DarkATi
If I'm going to nitpick, and it's something I could live with, it's the lighting. I don't know if it's intended or not in your version, but the light seems to flood the map more than the old version.
I loaded up the original real quickley, and I can see that the spotlights are more pronounced in the original and the texture lighting is a bit more low key. The white light was the primary colour and it was accented here and there with colour. It's as though the original only used bounce 1 or more fade.
The hallway outside comp lab going to ms is a good example I think... the blue floods the area now, wihle before it came straight down from the lights, leaving the wall above the lights darker. This gave it a bit more contrast. (I'm not complaining too much... Having just recreated my .rad file after forgetting to transfer it to my new machine, I realize this is something that takes a lot of tweaking and compile time to get right!)
Anyway, that's my first impressions. The new architecture looks good and if the map needed remaking, good on ya for taking up the task!
Origin would be up there with Eclipse and Veil if Aliens' success didn't <i>hinge</i> on taking and holding Vent. At the moment the connections are too poor between Furnace and Bio (you can either go through Vent via two long, straight vents - or you can go through DBL; both highly likely to be heavily populated by 'rines and neither of which is particularly Onos-friendly).
Also, Bio and Furnace could do with some ceiling-level vents into the siege rooms next to them. Bio is especially hard to defend against sieges (the lifts are such an Onos nerf). Getting some vents that let Lerks spore the siege spots would be nice.
Yeah, it's nice you remade it (not sure why this was necessary), but since it's still in beta maybe you can make it better while you're at it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
[Edit] DOH!
Heh I wrote that before I'd seen the changes, and I have to say I'm impressed. The vent between Vent and Furnace is now staggered so you can't camp one end of it and see all the way down. Bio Hive has no lifts (!), which should make it a LOT more Onos-friendly. The RT in the holo projection corridor has now been moved much closer to Bio (into the room with the big spinney reactor), and the Vent-Furnace vent now has another branch that takes it through the middle of the map towards Bio (but without going throgh double, which is great!). All in all excellent changes. <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":)" border="0" alt="smile-fix.gif" />
Only problem is I think you actually made the Vent-Bio vent longer than it used to be (and it's still straight!). Nevertheless I <i>badly</i> want to play this, so tell us which servers are running it! <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin-fix.gif" />
It's one of the best maps so I've been waiting for this one, thx Menes <3
it would help if you told us what exactly you changed. from the overview you provided, it looks the same as the original
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Looking at the overview i can spot 1 layout change. Look at bio hive where the elevator is. Very top left of the map..
Found another.
Look at the vent that leads from ore processing to vent hive.
I wish mineshaft would get remade like this. Loved that map <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
Overall though the layout looks great.
Gameplay changes:
- Biodome elevators replaced with stairs
- Moved Xenoform Research resource node to Power Core
- Raised Ventilation area, so the Cargo Bay ladders are shorter
- Modified the hallway between Furnace and Ore Extraction
- Added a vent leading to Coolant Monitoring from the Furnace/Ventilation vent
- Added a vent connecting the two vent systems above Cargo Bay
- All transparent textured railings now block shots (Cargo bay, Computer Lab, etc.)
- Tranparent textured floors in Lava Catwalk now block shots
- Cargo Bay elevators now don't instantly kill players (they do 45 damage / second)
Bug fixes:
- Famous stuck points in Ventilation are gone
- Biodome floor fixed
- Weird particle effect in Cargo Bay fixed
- Various restricted clipping areas removed
Esthetic changes:
- Small architecture changes in many areas
- Many texturing changes
- Heavily modified ready room
- Modified the lighting in many areas
I wish mineshaft would get remade like this. Loved that map <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
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This man is a genius. I would work to recreate the pure sexual loveliness of mineshaft.
Good work on the origin remake guys! It's amazing how important the official classic maps become to people and how they are looked after long after the original designer has moved on to other things.
EDIT: .res file is missing for downloading minimaps
One suggestion (carried over from the old origin): bio hive was gimped not just because xeno was a hard node to defend, but because it's a pain in the ###### getting to ventilation- the crawl space from bio to vent takes you on a magical journey to the centre of the map (nearly). Maybe just have a straight vent from the east side of biodome to above ventilation? As well, the length of the current vent means a marine can sit in it and completely block off that route on his own.
Also, perhaps consider a vent from furnace to smelter. The secondary route into that room requires you to go through ore extraction, but I guess that's not <i>too</i> bad.
I think that, apart from Vent-Bio not having any hidey-holes or alcoves to stop mid-way, the layout looks incredibly solid. This should definitely be considered for official status pending further playtests.
One last thing I noticed is that you made complab harder to attack for Marines coming from Marine Start. Atm the 'window' has been shortened meaning that it takes slightly longer for you to lay eyes on the res node, giving Alien skulks and extra couple of bites before they can be attacked. Given that the Marine RT health has just been reduced as well, this might cause problems (not to mention the railings in there now blocking bullets).
Also are the doors in Marine Start slower? I know the one in the corner is smaller, which I agree with, but they also seem slower, too.
I hate making little bug reports when there are possibly larger more important ones in play, but I found that as an Onos in ventilation I couldn't charge out of the room due to the slopes on the floor-girder leading up to the corridor. My Onos would just fly up vertically when hitting the slope. Clipping the slopes off with square clip brushes would solve that, so it looks like a slope but behaves like steps.
Those fire particle effects are to die for.
If a vent makes that time too short- maybe a complete corridor from bio vent.
Ala:
<img src="http://kgiswellnew.com/sherpa/origin.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
The problem with the above is that it could "do a bast" and that extra corridor (like the corridor from engine to -the room where the rotating door used to be- in bast) doesn't have any RTs and thus has little significance on its own, which would dilute gameplay.
Still, something to consider, I believe.
One last thing I noticed is that you made complab harder to attack for Marines coming from Marine Start. Atm the 'window' has been shortened meaning that it takes slightly longer for you to lay eyes on the res node, giving Alien skulks and extra couple of bites before they can be attacked. Given that the Marine RT health has just been reduced as well, this might cause problems (not to mention the railings in there now blocking bullets).
Also are the doors in Marine Start slower? I know the one in the corner is smaller, which I agree with, but they also seem slower, too.
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Computer lab is identical to the original computer lab, with the exception of texturing, some physical light placement and the smoothed corner near the hallway going to xeno. Both "windows" are 96 units long, so it is an illusion, as all other dimensions in that room are the exact same in width/height.
As for the marine start doors, they are both exactly the same as the original ones, not only for their dimensions, but also their speed (75 units / second).
Also, note that using the original ns_origin minimap with the new origin will work perfectly for all areas, except biodome, ore extraction, power core rt spot and some vents.
The lighting feels a bit plain sometimes (c-lab and the ladder from dbl to vent for instance), but it really doesn't matter. I'm fine with it as long as I can see the skulks this good.
A huge improvement indeed.
Edit: The extra corridor would have to go quite far away from the hives unless you want to have a double-hive siegespot la hera processing. Unless its just a ventilation shaft with vent llamas of its own. Hera in 2.0 btw.
I hate making little bug reports when there are possibly larger more important ones in play, but I found that as an Onos in ventilation I couldn't charge out of the room due to the slopes on the floor-girder leading up to the corridor. My Onos would just fly up vertically when hitting the slope. Clipping the slopes off with square clip brushes would solve that, so it looks like a slope but behaves like steps.
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thanks I was still thinking of how to fix this, but never thought of stairs
Sherpa, I'd rather make small curves in the current vent to fix marine camping than make a whole new hallway above there, that would do the trick just fine
The only thing I'm not entierly sure about is the entire tieing together the vent systems thing. One of the charms of origin was that you actually could cut off alien movement paths somewhat. I don't know, it just doesn't feel good. I've never been a fan of vent systems that span entire maps as opposed to short vents in important places.
[Edit] ESPECIALLY the vent from double, tying that up with the one leading down to ventilation loses some of the tactical advantages of trapping a life form there. It's a about the small things <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":(" border="0" alt="sad-fix.gif" />
above my expectations, keep it up!
after a quick run around.. i have to agree.. the lighting needs tweaking.. origin, the primary color was white and everything else was accent. now u got hallways that are entirely.. blue, red, green... and dark also. its a good step in the right direction... but lighting does need some tweaking
Agreed, Crispy. IIRC the mapping guidelines states that it should take ~30s to get between hives (or was that just MS-> hive?).
If a vent makes that time too short- maybe a complete corridor from bio vent.
Ala:
<img src="http://kgiswellnew.com/sherpa/origin.jpg" border="0" alt="IPB Image" />
The problem with the above is that it could "do a bast" and that extra corridor (like the corridor from engine to -the room where the rotating door used to be- in bast) doesn't have any RTs and thus has little significance on its own, which would dilute gameplay.
Still, something to consider, I believe.
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That suggestion could also "do a hera version 1" A possible dual siege location on the two hives, bio and vent. Adding a RT there could work to make the area more significant, but the siege issue has to be kept in check for it to work at all ^^
Edit: The extra corridor would have to go quite far away from the hives unless you want to have a double-hive siegespot la hera processing. Unless its just a ventilation shaft with vent llamas of its own.
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How is processing good for sieging more than just datacore? You can't siege vent from processing <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" />
My suggestion would be from the small vent-room south-east of Bio (with exits on the left, right, and bottom... the right one going to Vent). Maybe move the Vent exit from that room so that it's on the North side? Then, have it go 90 degrees right, then 90degrees left, to come to the original entrance into Vent. It will up the corners from 2 to 3, possibly being just enough to fix the long LOS issue.
What about this? The red lines show a vent-sized network for aliens adjusted to make the vents a little shorter in general. The blue lines denote a new walkway for marines that avoids double entirely making it alot easier to get from biodome to ventilation hive. The vent system could be out of reach (and probably out of sight-ish) for marines from industrial so the vent is still predominantly alien-use only. The new corridor could be made very alien-friendly to compensate for it's added value to marines. You would probably have to adjust the position of the walkway slightly or put something that blocks line of sight (that doesn't look stupid) so that marines can't see right into generator room.
<a href="http://img259.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nsoriginoverviewrevised3un.jpg" target="_blank">http://img259.imageshack.us/my.php?image=n...wrevised3un.jpg</a>
sherpa eat your heart out
<a href="http://onovia.com/files/index.php?dir=&file=ns_origin_beta6.res" target="_blank">http://onovia.com/files/index.php?dir=&...rigin_beta6.res</a>