Tired Of All The Co Hatred (long/rant)
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Join Date: 2005-03-06 Member: 43667Members
Join Date: 2005-03-06 Member: 43667Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Try not to scream nub right away</div> This is a rather long rant...here goes
It’s getting very annoying to me, how these forums are so biased against co. Many people here claim to be NS only...100% of the time. I'm going to guess, that many of these people are lying.
As different and mindless as it is compared to an NS game, no one can deny, that combat is not a fun game within NS. Sure its new, sure it’s still unbalanced, sure there are mods on servers, that completely unbalance it even further. But new things shouldn't be immediately dismissed.
I'm going to go out on a limb, and guess that of the people who really do only play NS maps, most of them have played so few co games, you could count them on all your fingers. This just isn't enough to accurately judge a game. Many people don't see that most combat maps have just as much atmosphere as some of the NS maps.
For example, take eclipse. In my opinion, this is an NS map with very little atmosphere. There are few details in most of the halls, and even some of the hives have very little going on in them. In my opinion, the most atmospheric thing on that map, is the little collapsed framework around one of the hallways.
Now compare this to the new daimos. To me, the hive room looks like there was a lab experiment going on with the Khaara, that went out of control. It’s got a sewer system, which leads to what I see as a power plant. It’s got an elevator to the lab, and an alternate pathway that I can imagine people moving cargo through. In my opinion, it is much more atmospheric than Eclipse.
The main thing I think people are doing...is judging all combat maps, by the two most played, which are faceoff and pulse. These two maps are mindless death arenas, with little to add to the game, I agree. No combat isn't the NS we've all known and loved since 1.0. But that doesn't mean co and ns can't co-exist peacefully. So maybe instead of saying "I hate co, it’s retarded and adds nothing to the NS world, therefore I will never play it!" Why not say, "Look a co map, not my favorite, but maybe I'll play a game or two till an NS map comes along?"
If this is hard to follow, tell me, and I'll try and regroup it in a more orderly way. I've never been good at organizing things like papers =\
It’s getting very annoying to me, how these forums are so biased against co. Many people here claim to be NS only...100% of the time. I'm going to guess, that many of these people are lying.
As different and mindless as it is compared to an NS game, no one can deny, that combat is not a fun game within NS. Sure its new, sure it’s still unbalanced, sure there are mods on servers, that completely unbalance it even further. But new things shouldn't be immediately dismissed.
I'm going to go out on a limb, and guess that of the people who really do only play NS maps, most of them have played so few co games, you could count them on all your fingers. This just isn't enough to accurately judge a game. Many people don't see that most combat maps have just as much atmosphere as some of the NS maps.
For example, take eclipse. In my opinion, this is an NS map with very little atmosphere. There are few details in most of the halls, and even some of the hives have very little going on in them. In my opinion, the most atmospheric thing on that map, is the little collapsed framework around one of the hallways.
Now compare this to the new daimos. To me, the hive room looks like there was a lab experiment going on with the Khaara, that went out of control. It’s got a sewer system, which leads to what I see as a power plant. It’s got an elevator to the lab, and an alternate pathway that I can imagine people moving cargo through. In my opinion, it is much more atmospheric than Eclipse.
The main thing I think people are doing...is judging all combat maps, by the two most played, which are faceoff and pulse. These two maps are mindless death arenas, with little to add to the game, I agree. No combat isn't the NS we've all known and loved since 1.0. But that doesn't mean co and ns can't co-exist peacefully. So maybe instead of saying "I hate co, it’s retarded and adds nothing to the NS world, therefore I will never play it!" Why not say, "Look a co map, not my favorite, but maybe I'll play a game or two till an NS map comes along?"
If this is hard to follow, tell me, and I'll try and regroup it in a more orderly way. I've never been good at organizing things like papers =\
Comments
Although i suppose it does bring in new players and to hone their skills
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Although i suppose it does bring in new players and to hone their skills
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Agreed
if u want atmosphere, u sacrifice the gameplay.
you could look at it as the minority kicking and screaming.
I like both NS and Combat, it's just that I like them both at their time.
There is nothing like mindless ramboing in Combat, and since I'm not that much of person that goes for the perfect score I enjoy it a lot.
On the other hand, there is nothing like working together as a team in NS, keeping the pressure up and enjoying a com who knows what he is doing.
However, it plays like ****.
carry on
Look at all the posts :o)
It just pains me to see NS remain popular at the expense of the game that broght me here in the first place "Classic NS", and no i'm not the typical 1.04 was better player. I just enjoy the team aspects of NS, I enjoy the options that a NS game presents its players in public play.
My idea of fun dosent involve frags so much as it involves the "Clever" factor. Thinking and creative game play translates better into NS then it does CO.
Enjoy your CO. I will continue to enjoy my NS when ever I am lucky enough to be able to join a decent game.
co haters mainly hate combat because it basically killed ns (how many classic only ns servers do you see that run in vanilla mode? 3 or 4 out of 450+) and they are usually either full to the brim or empty. but co isnt the only thing that killed classic ns, siege maps add to the never ending pool of detritis.
i personally dont like combat because its basically counter-strike or hldm. deathmatch, mmm... if i wanted to play dm, tfc or hldm would serve nicely. combat has been too hacked up since its inital addition to ns as a game mode. deathmatch games should be a level playing field. humans vs humans or some such. as long as its humans vs aliens, there will always be advantages and disadvantages in the gameplay. especially if its a skill stack.
It just pains me to see NS remain popular at the expense of the game that broght me here in the first place "Classic NS", and no i'm not the typical 1.04 was better player. I just enjoy the team aspects of NS, I enjoy the options that a NS game presents its players in public play.
My idea of fun dosent involve frags so much as it involves the "Clever" factor. Thinking and creative game play translates better into NS then it does CO.
Enjoy your CO. I will continue to enjoy my NS when ever I am lucky enough to be able to join a decent game. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I fully agree with you!
the bottem line is, natural selection is a great game and in order to keep the skilled players and less skilled players happy we have two types of matches. i personaly get bored of co maps but i also cant play 10 ns maps in a row, i think that natural selection is one of the most prefected games of all time and without co/ns maps it would get boreing tbh.
the natural selection team has done a great job keep it up <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
I do NOT believe it should be what new players start in. I believe starting in ns_ from the get-go is the best way to learn the game, because combat is 99% different.
Once you have the basics down, THEN combat comes in. I view combat more like "combat training" rather than a mode itself. I use it when I need to improve something, or try out a new strategy. Also, it lets people fantasize about 9 Upgrade Fades and whatnot.
Not to mention, the life-form feel more... correct... in how a marine should view them. Not too afraid of a skulk, rediculously scared of Onos. Unlike NS, Onos are scary as hell in Combat.
After improving skill in combat, you take that back to ns_ and have fun. Or interchange between the two. Whatever floats your boat.
I just don't feel people should be introduced to co_. I learned in 2.00 from NS only, and although it took awhile, I learnt well, while having fun.
Do whatever floats your boat though.
i'm uk, i am only on a 300kbps connection, but i can find ns match pings below 40 as standard.
but its pretty clear they ARE local, otherwise those pings wouldnt even be possible.
CO will deserve a spot up there with NS... personaly i have never seen anything like it... a bit RPGish... but not too much...
CO is here to stay... Not only does it bring in fresh blood but it allows for the veterans to try some stuff that would be lethal in a normal map...
I say that everything is good in moderation... even an occasional seige map doesn't hurt... It's when you start to get obssesed thats when things get ugly <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Servers can elect to do this already; they simply have to remove all of the co_ or ns_ maps from the map cycle / votemap selections.
...
I'm going to go out on a limb, and guess that of the people who really do only play NS maps, most of them have played so few co games, you could count them on all your fingers. This just isn't enough to accurately judge a game. Many people don't see that most combat maps have just as much atmosphere as some of the NS maps.
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That is far from true. another point, it is easier for a co player to stick ns players with co then a ns player to stick a co player with ns. its the mechanics of how the 2 inter react. that has caused a great deal of problems. fr31ns went to ns only and great increases in game play have been noticed. It seems that thread has had some benifit since it starte if nothing else by making awarenesss. I have seen ns servers on the rise lately as of posting they are nearly equil, no filters and counted at nearly 50 servers each it has been quite lopsided in the past. either more players became aware and intrested or server ops started making changes either way i think some of the tension has been releaved or vented as the case may be.
I also dont hate co as a game it can be fun on occasion but becomes bs when all the co players leave and we get stuck with another co map only for them to rejoin a min later.
I also feal that fangs thread name was unfortunatly worded. It was also inapropriate for the admin to censor the name like that. (side note were you the same fangs that hoped on fr31 the other day and was raggin on a "noob commander"? if not your reputation is not being helped by another player with that name)
The thread could have some good points for people willing to leave grudges behind. on all sides. It seems my points came to late to get past the flame war. that thread should not have turned in to a hate co/ns thread but did
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Would you like to see the CM server go only NS or continue to be CO untill 9 players then switch to NS.
I have my own server. When me and my clannies play, it seems that we never have enough for a decient ns_ game. We usually end up playing co_. This usually attracts a bunch of people, getting enough for an ns_ map. When this happens, I announce with a server message saying that next round will be on an ns_ map. We finish the round, and I switch to a random ns_ map. When it loads, all of the players have gone. So, then we switch back to co_. More people join. I announce again. Changemap. People gone. Its an endless cycle.
My stance on it is that if I want mindless killing, I would play The Specialists, because that is definatly mindless killing + slowmo. The way I see it, co_ encourages ramboing. One guy can completely own an entire alien team, while the others sit there. With ns_, there is actually a lot of thinking involved in the game. You have to strategize, communicate, and execute. With co_ there is just going in and wasting the hive. No securing a minibase, no sneaky tactics, just run in, and waste the hive. Heck, I was on NS-Armslab the other day, and two guys there (I think it was an admin and a contributor) were using cat packs, running in circles around the map, and they would shoot the hive when they ran by it. Where is the fun in that? And don't say that it was only that game, because I tend to see bs like that a lot. Its gotten to the point to where I loaded Whichbot on my server last night and am close to deleting everything with the co_ prefix from both the server and my computers.
However, I do like the attempt to create something to make the transition easier. It would be better, though, to make the secondary game option more team based instead of mindless killing. Like I said, if I want that, I would rather play TS than co_. Shoot, I even use the marine model for TS, so its like I am playin co_, except I enjoy the game (since TS = mindless killing).