People Miss The Point Of Ns
tsabrak
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8232Members
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8232Members
Without directing this to anyone in particular, I feel that many people have missed the point of NS. I've read countless posts about inbalance within the game, or strategies for playing the game, but what few (if any) have mentioned is the target players of NS. This game was never designed towards the public server play style. How could it be? It's designed around teamwork and team strategy. Getting a group of (essential) strangers on a public server to act as a cohesive unit is neigh impossible...and moreso, wasn't the intention of the game designers (IMHO). The aliens need to work as a team to an extent, but the marines are twice as team oriented. This being the case, it's twice as hard to actually get a group of marines working together, and so they lose more often on the pubs. When I see designated patrols of marines, commanders issuing orders that marines follow without hesitation, refined strike forces, defined builders, pre-planned crossfires, battle formations, flanking manuevers, and all of the other RL battle strategies incorporated into "wars" on a regular basis, then I think the game will be at the level it is intended. And if the marines are losing every battle, tweaking is necessary. As long as I continue to see marines who stand around yelling for equipment rather than acting as a useful tool for the commander....as long as I see teams of 7 aliens with 5 gorges on the team....as long as I see arguments occurring during a match as to the order of upgrade chambers....as long as I see the same, single marine die over and over at the waypoint that the commander set while his teammates play Rambo....as long as I continue to see these things, there is no room for complaint, and plenty of room for improvement.
Comments
Well, but this is the problem with nearly every mod out there I guess. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Else, i try to make teamplay "in vivo". It's a kind of challenge ;p (Teamplay-o-matic man, it's me <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> )
Now let's stop make suppositions and get back to reality: it is finding a good pub can be hard, that ppl there might not be the best gamers, etc... But let me tell you I have played some great games that lasted hours, with brilliant (if somewhat lucky) tactics and unexpected comebacks. In some games teamwork does exist even while you are playing with complete strangers.
So long live the public games! I'll keep playing as much as i can, so long as i'm not bored, and that will be in a long long time.
By the way, who are you to speak for the devs and say how this game should be played?? <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> It's everybody's game, that's all.
i've played games on public servers that have lasted nearly 4 hours of a constant struggle for both sides. of course the only way a game can last 4 hoursof intense game-play is if both teams are working as a team.
But it would be nice to see the first official clans fights.
Actually, i really enjoy to play on public servers and we DEFINITLY need them.
They are very indispensable to train in hard conditions (when everybody fails <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> )
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I'm totally agree. That's why i come to public server with my entire team (when possible).<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That is sorta sad. It's not even fair when an entire team or clan hijacks a game and completely mops the floor with the opposing side. Organization is key in this game, and while your team has it I'm sure, it can get frustrating for the other people (I'm obviously speaking from experience here)
But more power to you. I guess you gotta practice for official clan matches somewhere.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->The Frontiersmen adhere to the Hirshelm Doctrine of Tactical Flexibility, which advocates that while a command structure is necessary off the battlefield (to avoid the endless debates of boardrooms and parliaments), it is better for squads to evolve a hierarchy organically – favoring those best suited or prepared for each situation over pre-selected officers.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Quite appropriate for public servers.
That's not fun if we play all in the same side, that's why we slip up in two team to train. We don't go to public servers to win, but to train. There's no fun to crush opponent without leaving them a chance <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
But in general, my original statement still stands.
omg let me in i cant take pubs any more...
But yeah...i think i'm only emphasizing here...or repeating....so i'll shut up....but i think i proved my point...there's no way someone can just solo through the whole game...that's not really the point
Private servers are definately a good way to limit games to good players, and i've toyed with this idea myself, unfortunately the minute you enable a password on the server it becomes remarkably harder to give that password to the good users <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> . I run my server to provide an enviroment for NS fans to play, but it's hard to make calls on wether or not they are just new players who have yet to learn that NS <b>DOES</b> need Teamwork or they are just players who are out for the glory of killing as many of the enemy as possible. The only real way I can see to limit the game to real players is to start banning everyone who is obviously out for personal glory and not for playing the game as it was ment. This of course gives your server a bad name as people start going around saying the Admin of so-and-so server bans people for no reason <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo--> .
For the sake of modesty and so this doesnt turn into a ''advertisement'' post i'll just say 'Ethereal' and those who play on my server will hopefully know who I am. But if the regulars on said server feel that they would like me to make it private for the use of dedicated NS players drop me a line in game or whichever, and i'll be happy to do so.
OK I'll stop ranting now <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> but if anybody has any more good ways to ensure good gameplay I'm all for hearing them.
I do understand what you're saying. Most other games that include teamplay do basically that: they include teamplay. Sure, you'll be more effective if you use it, but it's somewhat of an option (even in games where such wasn't meant to be the case). NS goes further than that and damn near requires team play, especailly for the marine side. However, I think that there's more than that at work here.
I think there's a definate noob factor that the marines have. Most new players start as marines. A lot of bad, inexperienced, or just lame players tend to stick to marines for some reason. When I go into a public server and join the marine team I'm very likely to see people sitting around the spawn waiting for "gl and jetpack plz" for 5-minute stretches and/or running off on their own, or generally not listening to their commander, making ridiculous requests, etc.
If I join a public alien side, sure there are some new or lackluster players, but I've found in general that there's a higher percentage that seem to know what they're doing. You'll probably have enough to go gorge and build up competantly, and I've often seen skulks working in teams to ambush marines or attack their fortifications. At the very least I see it more often that I see marine teams showing equal diligence. Sure there are times that I see 5 gorges on my team, all building random things all over the place. But that happens far less often.
(For the record I'm not trying to go out of my way to insult new players; many of them are simply that, new to the game and don't know what's going on. However, it does have a noticeable effect on gameplay.)
If you hop around you can generally find a server with enough competant people to make it fun. I don't think its all as dire as this thread may paint things to be, but I have seen some god-awful servers. Hopefully at least some of this is due to the newness of the mod, hopefully many people simply haven't learned how to play in teams properly and will do so sometime over the next few months. Hey, I can always hope, can't I?
There's also something else that's been bothering me...There's really a best plan to follow as commander for each particular map. Yeah, you can do a few things different here and there each time you command the map...BUT, eventually, there will be a procedure that can be used every time because it's basically the best to follow. Once these are all figured out for each map, won't NS turn into nothing but a non-strategic first person shooter? <!--emo&:(--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='sad.gif'><!--endemo-->
Tsabrak