The Turret Factory Deal.
LaserApa
Join Date: 2002-10-27 Member: 1638Members
Join Date: 2002-10-27 Member: 1638Members
<div class="IPBDescription">was that not a pretty big change?</div> Not saying anything is unballanced but i was just wondering, as the topic suggests, that the change with turrets needing an operating factory nearby to work, is that not a pretty big change ballance wise? Was it conciderd before, or was it just thrown in at the last minute to calm down angry alien players that hadnt learned the game yet?
I do find it rather easy to destroy an unmanned outpost in under 3 minutes even as a skulk. Sure i like being able to do this as an alien but i dont know.
If this wasnt playtested befor can even the PT's claim that this is perfectly ballanced?
Easy now boys and girls im not taking sides here, just wondering what people think and what experiences peps have about this. I still read a few "Boo Hoo, Marines too powerful" but mostly nowdays its all "Bahh... Bring the marines back to their former glory"
Also: I want to Praise the entire Dev theam for Making the best MP game ever.
And i would also like to flip you off for depriving me of my social life and sleep time <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> ( 2:30 AM, Ahhh... just one more game)
I do find it rather easy to destroy an unmanned outpost in under 3 minutes even as a skulk. Sure i like being able to do this as an alien but i dont know.
If this wasnt playtested befor can even the PT's claim that this is perfectly ballanced?
Easy now boys and girls im not taking sides here, just wondering what people think and what experiences peps have about this. I still read a few "Boo Hoo, Marines too powerful" but mostly nowdays its all "Bahh... Bring the marines back to their former glory"
Also: I want to Praise the entire Dev theam for Making the best MP game ever.
And i would also like to flip you off for depriving me of my social life and sleep time <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> ( 2:30 AM, Ahhh... just one more game)
Comments
Marine turrets have an Achille's Heel too. They can't fire straight up. A good skulk can get on top of a turret and bite it to get at a turret factory if the defenses are weak.
x = Turret
TF = Turret factory
--- =Walls
--------------------------------
xxx
TFxx
xxx
--------------------------------
Now even if the skulk managed to get on top of the turret factory or any turret he would be ripped apart by them. True, the turret he is standing on would never hit him, but surely the turrets next to him. Add an obstacle behind the TF like and enemy resource tower for example and the skulk is pretty much screwed.
It´s all a matter of tactical placement IMHO. <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
O - turret with skulk on it X - turret
o x = x x (no skulk)
it only works for lone turrets
nother one
|
| x
| x
|TF_______
chomp that you fool (put TFs in corners)
or just put a bloody turret som were BEHINF the TF it is that simple
I generaly play as Aliens and I take FULL advantage of dumb F commies who dont defend the back of their TF (I just suicide like 3 times and then get my team to rush in and take out the turrets
TF =20+ rps, turet = 16
5 turrets + 1 TF = 100 RPs
THATS GONA SMART
just focus your attacks on a single turret, one at a time. and when your health is low you just retreat to a defence chamber. it takes a while but its satisfying when you finally destroy the turrets that can hurt you when you are attacking the turret factory.
as for balance:
the game was slightly unbalanced from the start (Flay decided this after watching some CLAN matches) and so he made a few changes to the balance, if it does come up unbalanced then he probalby will redo somethings
Currently most commanders are not used to it yet and don't cover all sides of the TF properly, meaning an alien can just run up and crouch behind the TF protected and chomp on it. However, if you use a bit of strategy, you place your turrets so that there is nowhere to hide around the TF. And try to make certain that no one turret is the only turret that can see a certain side of a TF. Aliens are not stupid, if they see that one side is guarded by only one turret, they'll rush that one turret then they're home free.
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Umm... i have _never_ seen a TF close enough to the corner that i couldn't get behind it as a skulk.
I say put tf's in the middle of the room, with a trio of turrets around it to provide cover fire from every direction.
The best defense is actually having a competent person there watching out.
And ther other thing about Mines...overall its good...but still as skulk you can avoid that too....jump and bite works nice, or if you have the 2 hives, leap(which does close to no damage) but if you wanna stay alive, all the power to you.
lol
If there is ANY location that is safe from turret fire, rest assured there WILL be a skulk sitting there chomping on the TF, avoiding all damage. The only way to make sure your TF is safe is to place four (4) turrets evenly spaced around the TF, and placing the TF AWAY from any walls/obstacles. Even then, a skilled skulk can take down the TF by circle strafing around it, chomping it the whole time (thereby avoiding damage from all but 1 of the turrets at any one time as one is on the other side of the TF, and 2 are beginning to track you).
Now, with the ease of TF killling established, i will also say this: it was dearly needed. The aliens NEED a way to break through turrets farms when they only have 1 or 2 hives. Hell, they need one with 3 hives too seeing as both xeno and bilebomb (which should be their turret killers) are both bugged vs buildings and are essentially useless.
Best defense against sabotage skulks? Place a phase gate nearby (but dont get mad when the skulk 'camps' the gate, killing every marine you send through before they fire a shot. <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> *munch* <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='asrifle.gif'><!--endemo-->)
I have relized the core thing sucks (lol I can always get back therE)
however here is the solution:
1) TF in corner
2) 1 marine in base at all times (I generaly do this if I am marine)
3) give that marine Sgun and MINES, have him place 1 mine ON the TF in the vulnerable area
4) every tme a skulk goes boom, have him remine it <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
that SHOULD stop me from getting througH (I think, I as of yet have not seen marines being this smart)
1) built turrets in positions that will cover all sides of the turret factory.
and
2) always, ALWAYS have my marines place mines on the ground around my turret factories (I do this with the CC as well).
If the turrets don't get the aliens, then the mines will blow them to pieces. This works ESPECIALLY well against that Lerk who thinks umbra will protect him long enough to kill my factory =).
I also try to build two factories, resources permitting. But as resources don't usually permit, I resort to the above two tactics to keep the aliens at bay.
The cost of turret factories needs to be increased. Now that they are required to keep turrets functioning, they are much more valuable, so their cost needs to be increased to match this importance.
Regards, Guspaz.
The cost of turret factories needs to be increased. Now that they are required to keep turrets functioning, they are much more valuable, so their cost needs to be increased to match this importance.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oooo, now that's interesting. Think the turrets are powered/controlled by the Tfacs, so the more turets you have in one area the worse their aim gets. Makes sense actually.
Ok. Since power should be distributed, I think this means that all alien players should share attack power.
It'll be -10% damage per copy of a class... so if there are 4 skulks, thats -30% damage! Makes sense, right? The hive can only handle so much..
Marines on the other hand have a single pool of resources, and mechanical building methods that don't require any support. Where do Turrets get their ammo from anyway? do they shoot imaginary bullets? maybe the Tfac creates the bullets and can only store so many, you could limit it that way too.
Marines on the other hand have a single pool of resources, and mechanical building methods that don't require any support. Where do Turrets get their ammo from anyway? do they shoot imaginary bullets? maybe the Tfac creates the bullets and can only store so many, you could limit it that way too.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
*sigh*
I was poking fun at your post because it's completely ludicrous. While aliens can move fast and defend key locations, marines are generally slow-moving and vulnerable. We <i>need</i> static defense to keep our locations secure until we can arrive.
Thank you for reiterating my exact point.
...err, huh? you posted 2 minutes before me while I was typing. That post was meant for Grav in case you couldn't tell.