Alien Upgrades
RedRaider
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8182Members
Join Date: 2002-11-11 Member: 8182Members
<div class="IPBDescription">The point?</div> Greetings all,
First off I love NS and at the moment it seems very well balanced. This isn't actually a complaint... rather its a question born of curiousity. 1 defence chamber equals level 1 defence upgrades, 2 equals level 2, 3 equals level 3. We all know this. But how often do you actually see aliens running around with level 1 or 2 upgrades? The difference in time between an alien team getting level 1 and level 3 upgrades is almost never more than a few minutes.. normally much less. Aside from carelessness there is pretty much no reason to have less than level 3 upgrades. After all, if the aliens can build 1 defence chamber, what's to stop them building 2 more immediately after (resources permitting, which really isn't an issue given a minute or two).
So, if the aliens in an average game take a few minutes to get from level 1 upgrades (for whichever chamber type) to level 3 is a matter of a few minutes, then given that an average game lasts say 45 minutes or more... doesn't that make having different upgrade levels kind of pointless? When you have level 1 you pretty much have level 3 within moments.
Also, Aliens often target specific Marine structures to temporarily deny access to certain things. Turret Factories, Armouries, Observatories. The destruction of almost every Marine structure has a certain amount of tactical significance, because only the Commander can fix the situation, resources and available/willing Marines permitting. But how often do you see Marines targetting upgrade chambers before offense towers? Often the defense towers -will- be targetted first, purely to stop them healing nearby structures. But destroying upgrade chambers purely to deny access to specific upgrades (or levels of upgrades) is pointless because technically -any- alien player with enough resources can put up another in mere moments.
Just curious... anyway its not a problem, just seems kind of redundant. I love NS anyway. :-)
Kind Regards,
RedRaider
First off I love NS and at the moment it seems very well balanced. This isn't actually a complaint... rather its a question born of curiousity. 1 defence chamber equals level 1 defence upgrades, 2 equals level 2, 3 equals level 3. We all know this. But how often do you actually see aliens running around with level 1 or 2 upgrades? The difference in time between an alien team getting level 1 and level 3 upgrades is almost never more than a few minutes.. normally much less. Aside from carelessness there is pretty much no reason to have less than level 3 upgrades. After all, if the aliens can build 1 defence chamber, what's to stop them building 2 more immediately after (resources permitting, which really isn't an issue given a minute or two).
So, if the aliens in an average game take a few minutes to get from level 1 upgrades (for whichever chamber type) to level 3 is a matter of a few minutes, then given that an average game lasts say 45 minutes or more... doesn't that make having different upgrade levels kind of pointless? When you have level 1 you pretty much have level 3 within moments.
Also, Aliens often target specific Marine structures to temporarily deny access to certain things. Turret Factories, Armouries, Observatories. The destruction of almost every Marine structure has a certain amount of tactical significance, because only the Commander can fix the situation, resources and available/willing Marines permitting. But how often do you see Marines targetting upgrade chambers before offense towers? Often the defense towers -will- be targetted first, purely to stop them healing nearby structures. But destroying upgrade chambers purely to deny access to specific upgrades (or levels of upgrades) is pointless because technically -any- alien player with enough resources can put up another in mere moments.
Just curious... anyway its not a problem, just seems kind of redundant. I love NS anyway. :-)
Kind Regards,
RedRaider
Comments
1 hive + 3 different chambers == 1st level alien with ALL base level upgrades!
Sounds like rush-mania to me.
i agree that level 3 upgrades are too easily gained and cost too little to implement. making the level of the upgrade based on the number of hives combined with requiring an extra evolution for each level of the upgrade sounds fine to me. 1 RP for a level 1 upgrade, then 2 RP for level 2, then 3 for a level 3. we'd probably see a lot more level 2 versions of upgrades, since using upgrades is more of a conscious act of resource managing than the current format of gaining super enhancing abilities for a dirt cheap investment. the aliens would not always have use of the third hive, as well, which would limit their abilities. this makes for even more motivation in aquiring a third hive, and by no means is a fade with level 2 carapace useless compared to a level 3.
don't get me wrong, i don't think the aliens are overpowered. i command lots, and i've been under a good commander or two, so i know it's entirely possible to defeat even a very aggressive alien team as long as the marines are skilled fighters and know the game. i simply feel that a system similar to what has been described here would make playing aliens much more strategic than the current system, which is amazingly simplistic compared to the method of the marine tech advances.
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3 players evolve to gorge
3 gorges all build different chambers
3 evolutions
can be done in a few minutes I'd say - definately a HUGE difference as to waiting for a second hive to be built.
There are 9 upgrades max, for every hive 3 upgrades.
"Unlimited" sensor ,movement and defense chambers.
a gorge can Advance any sensor, movement or defense chamber to an "super" defense/movement/sensor chamber.
the "super" chamber makes 1 upgrade possible. (example: 1 defense chamber has been Advanced to "super", the aliens get level 1 defense upgrade)
The super Chamber should be
1| easily visible ( a different look from the normal ones)
2| Not stronger than normal one.
Just my idea
Mano-waR
Requiring a seperate evolve for each level of an upgrade will likely NEVER be implemented as it would just take WAY too long to get back into fighting condition after dying. Hell, it already takes almost a minute to get a fully tricked out fade back from the dead.
Aliens who aren't builders usually have a huge surplus of Rps as it is. Of course multiple upgrade chambers would still be built to ensure the aliens keep their powers.
Anyway, yeah. The only time i havent had L3 upgrades was when i was playing with very noob gorges, or we were already destined to lose the game, and it didn't really matter what level i had. I wonder if that 'feature' should just be removed and some other nifty thing added. The alien upgrade system does need to be reworked IMO.
Simply because the chambers have other effects like healing, teleporting, and marine sesing.
although sensory and movement are seldom built, they are so cheap that rebuilding is never a problem. upgrade levels 1 or 2 never occur in a normal game (which is especially sad for cloaking, the transparent effect is well implemented, and realizing that that shadow on the wall is actually an alien makes for very tense situations)
i would prefer this system:
1) no restrictions on types of chambers, all types can be built right from the start
2) the level of the upgrade depends on the number of HIVES, not of chambers
<b><i>Every resource counts</i></b>
As for the building 3 buildings bit.. it costs you 30rp to get lvl3 sensory. 42rp to get lvl3 def. i think 42rp for lvl3 movement. they're still kinda expensive
As for the building 3 buildings bit.. it costs you 30rp to get lvl3 sensory. 42rp to get lvl3 def. i think 42rp for lvl3 movement. they're still kinda expensive
Edit: sorry for the repeat, the webserver is getting "too busy" errors so i resubmitted