Auditing The Election.

moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">Possible election fraud. Donate now.</div> <a href='http://www.blackboxvoting.org/' target='_blank'>http://www.blackboxvoting.org/</a>

<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->THURSDAY Nov. 4 2004: If you are concerned about what happened Tuesday, Nov. 2, you have found a home with our organization. Help America Audit.

Black Box Voting has taken the position that fraud took place in the 2004 election through electronic voting machines. We base this on hard evidence, documents obtained in public records requests, inside information, and other data indicative of manipulation of electronic voting systems. What we do not know is the specific scope of the fraud. We are working now to compile the proof, based not on soft evidence -- red flags, exit polls -- but core documents obtained by Black Box Voting in the most massive Freedom of Information action in history.

We need: Lawyers to enforce public records laws. Some counties have already notified us that they plan to stonewall by delaying delivery of the records. We need citizen volunteers for a number of specific actions. We need computer security professionals willing to GO PUBLIC with formal opinions on the evidence we provide, whether or not it involves DMCA complications. We need funds to pay for copies of the evidence.

TUESDAY Nov 2 2004: BREAKING NEWS: New information indicates that hackers may have targeted the central computers that are counting our votes.

Media calls: 206-335-7747 (congestion) - 206-778-0524
E-mail

Freedom of Information requests are not free. We need to raise $50,000 as quickly as possible to pay for records and the fees some states charge for them. We launched one major FOIA action last night, and have two more on the way, pell-mell. Now is the time. If you can't donate funds, please donate time. E-mail to join the Cleanup Crew.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

As a computer scientist, I believe that this is essential to the freedom of this country. Diebold completely ignored the opinions of virtually every computer scientist in the country in their insecure voting machine designs, and if we are to have any accountability, we need this type of audit.

If you value the transparency of our electoral process, I urge you to donate now.
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Comments

  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    And just to be clear.
    <img src='http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/rmoulton/proof.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' />
    I already did.
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  • SpoogeSpooge Thunderbolt missile in your cheerios Join Date: 2002-01-25 Member: 67Members
    Um, discussion?
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  • Jim_has_SkillzJim_has_Skillz Join Date: 2003-01-19 Member: 12475Members, Constellation
    This is a great idea but I don't have any money right now. I would love to support them though, not only does this seem like a great idea but it would be fun to do aswell.(at least in my opinion.)
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  • BobTheJanitorBobTheJanitor Join Date: 2003-12-10 Member: 24228Members, NS1 Playtester
    Very interesting. I hope no one tries to turn this into a partisan issue. Even if the machines are taken to bits and fraud is found that proves Mickey Mouse really won the election, it doesn't matter. The core issue is simply that the voting process may have been unfairly tampered with, and that should make everyone in every political party concerned.
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  • Jim_has_SkillzJim_has_Skillz Join Date: 2003-01-19 Member: 12475Members, Constellation
    <!--QuoteBegin-BobTheJanitor+Nov 5 2004, 03:25 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BobTheJanitor @ Nov 5 2004, 03:25 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Very interesting. I hope no one tries to turn this into a partisan issue. Even if the machines are taken to bits and fraud is found that proves Mickey Mouse really won the election, it doesn't matter. The core issue is simply that the voting process may have been unfairly tampered with, and that should make everyone in every political party concerned. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Exactly, this group isn't trying to prove that Bush stole the election or anything like that. They are trying to see if there was any fraudulent behavior with the electronic voting. Since this is brand new for this election, it would be good to know that these work the way they are supposed to.
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  • DrRobotoDrRoboto Join Date: 2003-08-12 Member: 19598Members
    edited November 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you value the transparency of our electoral process, I urge you to donate now.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    If you value real democracy you should donate now.

    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Donate by mail

    Make check out to:
    Black Box Voting

    Mail to:
    330 sw 43rd St. Suite K
    PMB 547
    Renton, WA 98055<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    see for more info:
    <a href='http://www.votergate.tv/' target='_blank'>http://www.votergate.tv/</a> (30min video)
    <a href='http://www.blackboxvoting.org/' target='_blank'>http://www.blackboxvoting.org/</a> (more info and news)
    <a href='http://politics.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/03/1815227&tid=103&tid=219' target='_blank'>http://politics.slashdot.org/article.pl?si...tid=103&tid=219</a>
    <a href='http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=389&row=0' target='_blank'>http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=389&row=0</a>
    <a href='http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=392&row=0' target='_blank'>http://www.gregpalast.com/detail.cfm?artid=392&row=0</a>
    <a href='http://apnews.myway.com/article/20041105/D865R1DO0.html' target='_blank'>http://apnews.myway.com/article/20041105/D865R1DO0.html</a>

    when the the CEO of the company that makes the voting machines says that he's "committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year", and there isnt a shred of material evidence to prove how/if your vote was counted/made, you get to worrying about whether you actually live in "the land of the free".

    RAGE AGAINST THE VOTING MACHINES
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  • ForlornForlorn Join Date: 2002-11-01 Member: 2634Banned
    Doesn't look like a fraud... but still I'm not going to donate.

    off the front page:

    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Please excuse our temporary reconstruction
    This site went down recently when we posted sensitive information.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Would those be credit card numbers? (Ultimate irony) The site that tries to prevent fraud gets hacked?
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    <!--QuoteBegin-Forlorn+Nov 6 2004, 04:13 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Forlorn @ Nov 6 2004, 04:13 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Doesn't look like a fraud... but still I'm not going to donate.

    off the front page:

    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Please excuse our temporary reconstruction
    This site went down recently when we posted sensitive information.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Would those be credit card numbers? (Ultimate irony) The site that tries to prevent fraud gets hacked? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    They don't take the credit card numbers themselves. The online donating system is run by a company called E Services that provides online billing services to a lot of companies.
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  • DrRobotoDrRoboto Join Date: 2003-08-12 Member: 19598Members
    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Please excuse our temporary reconstruction
    This site went down recently when we posted sensitive information.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    that's been up for days at least. the site went down a few times when massive amounts of <a href='http://www.airamericaradio.com' target='_blank'>http://www.airamericaradio.com</a> listeners would go to the site. its been stable lately though.
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  • funbagsfunbags Join Date: 2003-06-08 Member: 17099Members
    edited November 2004
    Hey Moultano, It is very annoying seeing you post over and over and over again in 2-3 different threads that the Elections were rigged, and that America is a horrible place, and that all republican's are idiots with IQ's lower than 90. It really doesn't help, and it bothers me. I just thought I'd let you know my opinion on your "Theories".
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    As if we needed any more urgent reasons for this . . .
    <a href='http://politics.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/08/1910250&threshold=-1&tid=103&tid=219' target='_blank'>Holy inconsistencies!</a>
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  • funbagsfunbags Join Date: 2003-06-08 Member: 17099Members
    Fixed post.
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    <!--QuoteBegin-funbags+Nov 8 2004, 05:03 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (funbags @ Nov 8 2004, 05:03 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Hey Moultano, It is very annoying seeing you post over and over and over again in 2-3 different threads that the Elections were rigged, and that America is a horrible place, and that all republican's are idiots with IQ's lower than 90. It really doesn't help, and it bothers me. I just thought I'd let you know my opinion on your "Theories". <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I have never once said that the elections were rigged, that America is a horrible place, or that Republicans are idiots.
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  • funbagsfunbags Join Date: 2003-06-08 Member: 17099Members
    edited November 2004
    /me points to "Black Box Voting has taken the position that fraud took place in the 2004 election through electronic voting machines".
    EDIT: You obviously support the theory, since you donated 50 bucks to it.

    /me then points to that picture that you posted listing the average IQ's of the states that voted for Kerry and Bush, that listed any Bush state as 88 or below. (Did you notice where it said the census was: Innacurate, old, and NOT FACT.)


    :\ It just gets old. I think you are whining that you didn't get your way.
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts
    edited November 2004
    <!--QuoteBegin-funbags+Nov 8 2004, 07:09 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (funbags @ Nov 8 2004, 07:09 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> /me points to "Black Box Voting has taken the position that fraud took place in the 2004 election through electronic voting machines".
    EDIT: You obviously support the theory, since you donated 50 bucks to it. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I don't have the slightest idea whether fraud occurred or not, and I want the facts. It's worth $50 to me to help fund a group that is working to get the facts.

    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->/me then points to that picture that you posted listing the average IQ's of the states that voted for Kerry and Bush, that listed any Bush state as 88 or below. (Did you notice where it said the census was: Innacurate, old, and NOT FACT.)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Those of us with a sense of humor refer to such things as "jokes."

    <!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->:\ It just gets old. I think you are whining that you didn't get your way.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    I don't get this attitude. In a democracy, when things are going a direction you don't like, you don't just suck it up and deal with it. You try to make changes. That's what makes democracy work.
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