Mark's Custom Maps

Wolfenstein · June 2004

<div class="IPBDescription">*Warning* Protect your work</div> Alright, I have posted on their forums asking them to give credit to me about using my map, but I found out that it was taken, and called their work and almost no credit was givin.

Links:
<a href='http://marks-servers.com/viewtopic.php?t=939' target='_blank'>http://marks-servers.com/viewtopic.php?t=939</a>

Pictures of Posts: [Incase of topic being deleted] And to prevent orignal postes from being tampered with.

<a href='http://wolf.nsarmslab.com/Security1/' target='_blank'>http://wolf.nsarmslab.com/Security1/</a>

- [NSA]pvt. Wolfenstein

Caboose · June 2004

Sounds to me like they are on your side...

DeathKnight · June 2004

Only Raptor is on our side. Shadow seems all to eager to just make idiots out of us.

Caboose · June 2004

Well... copywrite the map... then sue them <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />

KTLGirlNSA · June 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Caboose @ Jun 17 2004, 02:23 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Sounds to me like they are on your side...  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
They are not; they are actually a little hostile and they admitted to not giving credit to any mappers and it looks like they are not about to start.

uffo · June 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Caboose @ Jun 17 2004, 02:32 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Well... copywrite the map... then sue them <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' />  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
well you don't have to copyright anything, since copyrights comes automatically to any artwork (and such) at the instance they're created.

Chrono · June 2004

sucks they didnt give you credit <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' /> but i dont think you needed to get a bunch of people from NSA to go post there <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />

KTLGirlNSA · June 2004

I did it of my own free will. No one asked, but I was told of the incident. The more people he has the more it:

1) proves he was the original creator
2) shows how strongly we feel about this incident
3) the more likely this is going to be noticed and dealt with

Wolfenstein · June 2004

Wouldn't it look odd that if only I went, and had no support? It wouldn't be very stable credit if only I went, and had nothing as support other then the original rmf's, pictures, and everything. But the moment I let them look at it, they'll steal it, and say I took it from them. So It goes both ways in a fight like that x.x (which is sad tho)

- Wolfenstein

Caboose · June 2004

take screenshots of it in editor. that prooves you have toe source.

:edit: spelling. I need to sleep...

HanzGrub3r · June 2004

<b>Wolfenstein</b> - I would seriously consider sending an email to "Mark" outlining your complaint and also what action you plan to take. I had an incident with Counter-strike a long time ago where a mapper took some of my textures and then had an official release of the map..He didn't credit me whatsoever..(this is prior to the commercial release so it was more of recognition thing than anything else)..I wrote to him and also to Gooseman about it and it was resolved through a strongly worded letter.

My advice would be to:

1. Email "Mark" outlining your complaint
2. Give evidence that it is your work (screenshots from Worldcraft with intact brushes so that it is evident that you did not decompile it, command prompt dumps with file dates from previous version - if you still have them, etc etc)
3. Demand applicable action be taken (removal of map from server, proper recognition of your authorship and ownership of the map, etc)
4. Outline what steps you will take if he does not meet your demands (legal action)

That should fix the problem for you. And if he doesn't take any notice - do a whois/dns name look up etc of his website/hosting provider and contact them and make them aware that he is plagerising your work and demand that they contact him. It is as much illegal for them to host an illegal site as it is for him to create it.

There you go. Little bit of legal advice from someone who has been screwed by untalented mappers before.

It may just be a big misunderstanding regarding ownership - he may not have known who the map belonged to ... never-the-less - don't let him get away with it.

- Hanz

Epidemic · June 2004

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (uffo @ Jun 17 2004, 09:23 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Caboose @ Jun 17 2004, 02:32 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Well... copywrite the map... then sue them <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
well you don't have to copyright anything, since copyrights comes automatically to any artwork (and such) at the instance they're created.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Yes, but it will probably only result in court order to take the map down. Legal action does seem just a tiny bit far fetched, especially if it's international

Huze · June 2004

Can't you put your name all over the inside of the map for the next versions?

DeathKnight · June 2004

Weel, Mark is going to take the maps down. And also, I used to be a big regular there. I was hoping one of the admins I got to know would post there. But I ended up attracting the attention of admins I did not want to deal with.

Game969 · June 2004

I'm posting this to clear Mark's Servers of any exaggeration you may have heard. Read NSA_Ryan's post, and I suggest NSA doesn't release maps that aren't fit for public use.

<a href='http://www.marks-servers.com/viewtopic.php?t=939&start=30' target='_blank'>http://www.marks-servers.com/viewtopic.php?t=939&start=30</a>

DarkSeraph · June 2004

i'm not saying either side is right, Mark's side was EXTREMELY rude about the whole ordeal, but NSA does have their noses kinda stuck in the air <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif' /> lose-lose situation i guess, since it doesn't affect me at all

Shadow00Caster · June 2004

Thankyou Game .. I was going to post to everyone to go read that. Also, I would like to let everyone know that Mark's Servers will always give credit where credit is due, and never has and never will take anything and not give credit for it, especially to mappers, however we do that it still is unknown to me .. I shall construct some sort of pop-up, yes one of those annoying pain in the a55 pop-up's that wont go away, when you come to the website, it will constantly spam the hell out of you making sure EVERYONE knows who made what map. GOD-FORBID u put a simple msg in the map at the beginging of it to let people know who made it, it's not like it's something new.

XFall · June 2004

Read Urd's post then read ryans. we were accused of taking the map as our own, renaming it and taking credit for it. that is a blatent LIE. For those of you who are too lazy to check our forum. i'll quote what NSA_Ryan said.

Also note: My views and opinions do not represent MS offically. just my own rants and raves. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Thank you for removing the map from your rotation. I just registered to make a few simple comments regarding this issue.

First of all, I'd like to thank you for your quick responses. They are greatly appriciated.

Second, if anyone in NSA insinuated that you stole or "pirated" this map, they didn't mean what they said, and if you were insulted by that, I appologize for them and NSA as a whole. No one here at NSA believes you pirated or stole our map.

As for the credit, there originally was a readme.txt document included with the map that gave proper credit where credit was due, but the map it's self was never built for release on other servers. Originally King of the Hill was a software test showing some of the neat features of Valve's Hammer Editor (and it's creator Wolfenstein). We never really even intended it to be playable. For this reason, the .rmf source was released with each version of the map so other mappers could see how we "did stuff" (the cannons, etc.). Over time however, the map evolved into something more realistic and playable, but we had not considered that it would be public and others might want to use it on their servers. Mark is no way at fault for this, only were are, and we are working on fixing this issue. We will probably work on a public release for this (with credit built in) so that these problems will not exist.

Anyway, I thank Mark for his quick response, and appologize for all of NSA for offending him. It was our fault anyway for this even happening.

Thanks for reading my huge post
- [NSA]Ryan | Systems Engineer and Network Administrator

P.S. The cannons do work, but you have to turn on friendly fire. They are lots of fun. And there is a new version, 3.8c that fixes many of the bugs/balance issues. As for NSA and exclusives, this map was made by our staff and was not even built for public release, that is why it is "exclusive." And we believe in open/free source (especially me because I use it daily), however, we also want to respect the wishes of our staff since many of them spend many many hours making these things for their friends and our community.
P.P.S. Thanks again Mark for your truely honest and fair response to this issue </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Carling · June 2004

There was no credit giving because the map came with no infomation on the author. mark never claimed any of us had made it. he was just hosting it. Also NSA has made a bad impression on most of marks players and mark him self. A simple request without any accusations would of been enough for him to take the map of the server.

What i dont understand is after reading <a href='http://www.nsarmslab.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=1166' target='_blank'>This thread</a> how is it your map came to be plublic ?

Also... Why you need to feel the urge to flame a perectly decent server ? This entier topic is pointless. you got what u wanted. the map is not on server. altho it should of been taking off due to the bugs and the general poorness of map. so why come try tarnish the name of a respectable server where the owners dont try to turn a profit ?

Delarosa · June 2004

problem solved...

no further discussion is needed, if it is, pm me with a thread-lock apeal... i migh unlock it.

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Mark's Custom Maps

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