Siege

Armani25 · November 2002

The Siege turret has got to be the biggest unbalenced weapon in any game. All it takes is 1 seige to kill a entire hive base. Usually the siege is backe dup by 5-6 turrets, and aliens cant kill turrets (you no it better then I its suicide for any alien to go head on into 5 turrets.) I aint ranting or flaming, so dont think i sound arrogant <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'> I just hope that the siege turret should be nerfed (along with the nade launcher) and possibly give the aliens a indirect artillery building to or some type of range wep to bounce off walls. Thanks for reading.

95 percent of games = <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/turret.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::sentry::'> <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/skulk.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::skulk::'>

coldish · November 2002

I have to agree, the only alien weapon (class) available to kill turrets really is the fade and his bile bomb.

The siege cannon is a load of crap along with the grenade launcher. GL would be ok but it is so darn powerful that an alien base is toast with minimal or no resistance.

Not to be ranting but marines ARE the more powerful class unless the commander is a moron. Aliens are more fun to me but it sucks when I can't get rid of a turret. In any way. Especially because I hate the fade class.. Skulk and Gorge pwn you <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'>

My 2 cents. Later^^ Had a few awesome games with some ppl from the forums past few days, sup ppl! <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>

OneManArmy · November 2002

Well I personally have only come across a siege turret once or twice, but the other ones are definitly unbalanced. Alien turrets are made of toothpicks and tissue paper and fire plastic darts. While marine turrets are made of heavy metal and actually huhrt you. (alright a bit of an exageration but you get the point). Once those marine turrets are set up they are next to impossible to get rid of.

but blah blah blah marines need to be tweaked in some way. Great mod guys. <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>

Jonneh · November 2002

The seige turret has to be the worst thing about this mod, it's overly powerful, has massive range, and can shoot though walls, and its usually surrounded by 8 regular turrets, and before you all lynch me, yes i know this should be fixed with the new money patch, but i seriously think this weapon needs to have some sort of limitations.

Silver_Fox · November 2002

The patch will correct all turret issues

Mr_Radical_Ed · November 2002

The mod is out.. so no sense of keeping any gameplay aspects a secret. How is the patch going to correct the turrets/chamber issue? Is it the amount of turrets we will see due to fair resource handling, or offense chambers directly changed as well?

My stance on the issue is this.............
Marines have static defensive turrets that take effort to bring them down, even with marines standing by. While aliens have these softer offense chambers that are not as affect, and become OBSOLETE when more than 2 marines come in counter with them. Also I'd like to add that half the time offense chambers don't fire at the marines making this weakness worse. Aliens need something a little more tougher because they can't always be skulks or lerks on defense... aliens too sometimes need to setup some defense and have it last without needing a personal body guard skulk/lerk/fade/onos.

devilblocks · November 2002

Its only an issue because commanders right now in a lot of servers have near unlimited resources. You have to remember, that in a normal game, you have to get near the hive, AND construct a T Factory, AND some turrets AND FINALLY a siege cannon without getting killed. Its not easy, and its very hard against a good team of aliens. Once the patch is out to lock down the resources and keep balance at what was designed at, play a couple of weeks before you start saying its overpowered. PTs have played tons and tons of games and we know how good / bad something really is.

Haije · November 2002

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Silver Fox @ Nov. 03 2002,00:40)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">The patch will correct all turret issues</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
REALLY?? <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'> <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'>

how will it be changed?

Armani25 · November 2002

I played in many legit servers, some admins i know and i can tell you its very easy to get 5 turrets in everyroom with only 2, 3 nodes. I am just stating the obvous anyways its good to hear they will fix it.

Go7 · November 2002

Also, the alien towers can be shot on their sides.. to where the Marine has no risk whatsoever, so long as a bit of cover is there. The marine turret, however, is very thin and if you can shoot it.. it usually can shoot back.

I think an alien tactic for the current game would be to ignore offensive towers entirely, and just spam the world with Defense Towers. D towers heal each other, i beileve, so they may be harder to kill than Offensive Towers right off the bat. Plus as Marines shoot them, u can attack them.. any damage taken can be healed by the surrounding D towers

WaldorfWorldWide · November 2002

yeah the alien turrets need better following capability, and should shoot a mild poisonous dart at enemies. the poison should be like 15 damage, and 1 damage every 3 seconds for like a minute. darts can move faster than the acid that's spit, and will be harder to dodge. just a little suggestion

Sancho · November 2002

I have one problem with the balance so far...

I think that its insanely impossible to kill the human's turrets w/o an onos. Sure you can do it, but it takes an eternity no matter what type of alien you choose. They can leave you to destroy 5 turrets in like 10 minutes, and then simply kill you and rebuild them in about 1 minute. To me, it seems like once they put some turrets by the 3rd hive spot, its all over because you can't kill them. Well that's my opinion... <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

Tabris · November 2002

You guys fail to see a few things... a few good skulks can decemate any attempt to bring up turrets.. belive me.... I KNOW... im talking experianced alien players. (though i prefer the fade blink/melee/blink combo)

Second point... Alien towers are far from useless.... slap 4 up backed by 4-5 D towers.. and they are untouchable save grenades... it also is a place for you to regen and go out and attack again.

Yes siege guns are annoying as hell.. but in all the matches ive played today.. aliens won all but 1 in 7 or so games. Sieges can be beaten... deal with them.

the_stalker · November 2002

there should be an upgrade for the alien offense tower as well that rapidly fires slime balls, only less damage, like 20 each hit and shoots ALOT more accuretly because its accurecy is pathetic <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

Chron · November 2002

The idea that the marines don't even have to put themselves into combat to capture a room is pretty lame. The whole basis of this kind of combat is that they can't attack your structures without going through you. But this just bypasses any player/structure defense. I mean, they just build a little turret base outside of a couple resource points and there is no way to get resources. Then they advance to a point close to the hive, build another siege turret and kill the hive through the wall.

But of course the play testers must have went through this a THOUSAND times, so I'm assuming all will be fixed soon.

Sancho · November 2002

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> (Tabris @ Nov. 02 2002,12:56)</td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">(though i prefer the fade blink/melee/blink combo)</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>
Blink has never worked for me...

How do you get it to work? <img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>

Silver_Fox · November 2002

The way the turret issue will be fixed is with the resource patch.

Because you simply can <b>not</b> place the amount of turrets you can now. You will go broke, then you will be up a river without a paddle.

Under the correct resource system, you dont have more then 5 turrets in a room. You dont (usualy, unless the commanders been saving for a <b>long</b> time) see more then one Siege.

Be patient, the patch (baring any problems that might come out of it) should fix NS into what it was ment to be, instead of a RTS with a resource cheat on ...

Greedo · November 2002

Within a week, any alien player worth the slime he spawned from will know all the good seige turret locations (and it's not hard to figure this out), and will know how and when to respond to 'structure is under attack' hive mind updates. Placing alien turrets in hive rooms usually means that the seiges will attack them first, before they start attacking hives. This gives aliens a lot of time to respond to a seige turret and take it out. Generally, though, if the marines have already gotten up the seige turret, and if there are nearby turrets to guard it, you've lost the hive. That's just how things work.

Now, if you're a smart player, or team, you'll have put some offense chambers in the likely siege locations. Now the marines have to actually kill those offense chambers before they can place a turrets factory and upgrade and then place a siege. Now, every time a structure comes under attack, you get a verbal warning, and if you're close enough to the structure it will show up red on the hive sight. If you rush there, you will have a legitimate shot at stopping the marines from even building up a turret factory to begin with, especially if you rush them with a teammate or two at your side. Even if you don't kill all of them, there squad will be weaker, and easier to attack a second time.

Eventually, you'll probably get to a point where marines trying to siege hives will be one of the most exhilirating and enjoyable aspects of the game, from either team (especially if you succeed).

ViPr · November 2002

i don't like siege turrets and i play as marine always. i think they should be taken out or changed so they don't shoot through walls. how fun is it to destroy the entire alien's base without even seeing it <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' valign='absmiddle' alt='confused.gif'> i say the marines should get other tools instead which are much more fun to use.

Greedo · November 2002

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Greedo386 @ Nov 3 2002, 08:28 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Eventually, you'll probably get to a point where marines trying to siege hives will be one of the most exhilirating and enjoyable aspects of the game, from either team (especially if you succeed).</td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'>
Vipr, read that.

ViPr · November 2002

yeah that's a pity coz if there were no siege turrets then we would have to attack their base ourselves to destroy it and that would be the most exhilirating experience instead and it would be much more exhilirating than sieging with those boring siege turrets.

coil · November 2002

Great tactic: wait for the commander to drop the turret factory, start it upgrading, and drop a turret or two. While the marines are building the turrets, take them out. then the turrets, then the factory. You just cost the marines a TON of resources.

Hive Sight warns of impending attack so you can get there and save your hive - Greedo's right, you need to build turrets to keep marines out of siege range of your hive. As aliens learn counters to each marine strategy, the balance will fall into place. You can't complain about the balance if you don't understand how the game plays yet... and you all haven't been playing long enough to know, believe me. I've got 4 months under my belt, and I'm *still* learning new strategies.

ViPr · November 2002

I'm not talking about balance! ! !! !! !! ! ! I'm talking about fun! ! ! !! ! ! ! ! !

Chron · November 2002

I've come to learn slowly that each aspect of this game is pretty well balanced, you just need to learn how to do everything. I thought it was BS that marines could teleport anywhere instantly...just today I learned that movement chambers can teleport. I thought that skulks couldn't kill shit, even stock marines. Now I can do well against even mid-game marines(Though heavies are still tough).

I would like to see a more efficient way of killing marine turrets as aliens, just to make the game more enjoyable. Its just aggrivating to see an unmanned base block the road for almost the entire game because we aren't strong enough to take it out without pulling my other aliens out of battle and losing other parts of the map.

Siege

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