A lot of balance required
40oz_to_Freedom
Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 3997Members
Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 3997Members
Natural selection came out last night and after a couple long game sessions it's clear to me how this game could stand some balancing.
First off if you're one of those people who always plays marines don't even bother responding to my ideas. You don't know, so buzz off.
If you played aliens and "pwned" the marines I'm guessing that the teams were lopsided in the aliens favor, or that the marines and their commander were total morons (morons on the internet playing Half life? GASP!<!--emo&;)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'><!--endemo-->.
First off is resources, it takes too long for an alien to build the resources to start their base off early. Because first you have to travel to a building spot without being killed, then you have to morph into a gorg, then you have to wait for yourself to build 22 resources so you can build a resource collector. Then unless you want a single marine with his uzi to come in, kill you and your resource hauler you have to set up offense chambers, which means more waiting. Finally if you manage to save up 80 resources you can build your second hive, but you'd better have people setting up resource stations and the marines better leave them alone.
In contrast a commander can just drop this stuff down for his guys and anyone can come along and build it. the marine is both a fighting and a building unit which means they're never defenseless while setting up bases.
Firepower: Early on in the game the skulks, if used wisely can be vicious and deadly. I've charged marines as a skulk and single handedly taken down 3 heavily armed marines. Again it helps that they were total morons. The marine weapons are totally overpowered, 2 Onos were charging me as a Marine and I managed to kill them both without taking a scratch by lobbing a few nades at them. The Grenade launcher can spam areas and do no damage to friendly units or structures but damage an alien from across the room. You can build offense towers all you like but what good does it do when someone can just nuke the area from around the corner.
So let's assume the Alien defenses hold and the aliens are trying to expand. While they were setting up their defenses the humans were building turrets. I can't believe this part of the game made it through beta, how can they even contest that the game is balanced when the marines can set up these automated killing machines in relatively no time at all. Nothing the Aliens carry short of the bile bomb will even harm these things. I've heard people say that if you circle strafe a turret as a Skulk you can take it out, but I say not while the other 8 turrets are firing on your 10 armor at the same time. And even then if you managed to survive the first run, the bite doesn't actually do much damage to a turret, I don't think I've ever seen an organized and motivated group of aliens working together who successfully took out a turret cluster. Going up against them is suicide even as an Onos.
Now let's pretend your team has somehow managed to set up all 3 hives, and you've saved your resources for the last 25 minutes so you could be an Onos. Now you're much stronger yes, but you still have to get close enough to your enemy to damage him, and you're a big slow target. Even with your full HP and armor it'll only take 1 grenade launcher to take you out, or 1 HMG, or a couple turrets for that matter. But let's pretend you took redemption, and you've been whisked away to safety and are now repairing, now you have 5 minutes to sit and wait for healing and on your next run you will get your ### handed to you again.
I know that team tactics would work well in this game, they work wonders for the Marines, the aliens could really use a commander unit as well.
If nothing else the above balance issues could be somewhat fixed by making the aliens spawn faster. If there were enough of us pouring out of the hive then maybe we could get through the grenade spam and the HMGs and save our hives. In all the games I've played I've never seen the aliens even come close to winning, only once did I see 3 hives get built. It's just too easy to take them out, and too hard to protect them.
First off if you're one of those people who always plays marines don't even bother responding to my ideas. You don't know, so buzz off.
If you played aliens and "pwned" the marines I'm guessing that the teams were lopsided in the aliens favor, or that the marines and their commander were total morons (morons on the internet playing Half life? GASP!<!--emo&;)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'><!--endemo-->.
First off is resources, it takes too long for an alien to build the resources to start their base off early. Because first you have to travel to a building spot without being killed, then you have to morph into a gorg, then you have to wait for yourself to build 22 resources so you can build a resource collector. Then unless you want a single marine with his uzi to come in, kill you and your resource hauler you have to set up offense chambers, which means more waiting. Finally if you manage to save up 80 resources you can build your second hive, but you'd better have people setting up resource stations and the marines better leave them alone.
In contrast a commander can just drop this stuff down for his guys and anyone can come along and build it. the marine is both a fighting and a building unit which means they're never defenseless while setting up bases.
Firepower: Early on in the game the skulks, if used wisely can be vicious and deadly. I've charged marines as a skulk and single handedly taken down 3 heavily armed marines. Again it helps that they were total morons. The marine weapons are totally overpowered, 2 Onos were charging me as a Marine and I managed to kill them both without taking a scratch by lobbing a few nades at them. The Grenade launcher can spam areas and do no damage to friendly units or structures but damage an alien from across the room. You can build offense towers all you like but what good does it do when someone can just nuke the area from around the corner.
So let's assume the Alien defenses hold and the aliens are trying to expand. While they were setting up their defenses the humans were building turrets. I can't believe this part of the game made it through beta, how can they even contest that the game is balanced when the marines can set up these automated killing machines in relatively no time at all. Nothing the Aliens carry short of the bile bomb will even harm these things. I've heard people say that if you circle strafe a turret as a Skulk you can take it out, but I say not while the other 8 turrets are firing on your 10 armor at the same time. And even then if you managed to survive the first run, the bite doesn't actually do much damage to a turret, I don't think I've ever seen an organized and motivated group of aliens working together who successfully took out a turret cluster. Going up against them is suicide even as an Onos.
Now let's pretend your team has somehow managed to set up all 3 hives, and you've saved your resources for the last 25 minutes so you could be an Onos. Now you're much stronger yes, but you still have to get close enough to your enemy to damage him, and you're a big slow target. Even with your full HP and armor it'll only take 1 grenade launcher to take you out, or 1 HMG, or a couple turrets for that matter. But let's pretend you took redemption, and you've been whisked away to safety and are now repairing, now you have 5 minutes to sit and wait for healing and on your next run you will get your ### handed to you again.
I know that team tactics would work well in this game, they work wonders for the Marines, the aliens could really use a commander unit as well.
If nothing else the above balance issues could be somewhat fixed by making the aliens spawn faster. If there were enough of us pouring out of the hive then maybe we could get through the grenade spam and the HMGs and save our hives. In all the games I've played I've never seen the aliens even come close to winning, only once did I see 3 hives get built. It's just too easy to take them out, and too hard to protect them.
Comments
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->If you played aliens and "pwned" the marines I'm guessing that the teams were lopsided in the aliens favor, or that the marines and their commander were total morons<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Those 2 statements alone make me not want to read anything else you've said. We spent <i>months</i> balancing this mod, and getting it as close to perfect as possible. This isn't like a normal mod, where balance claims can be easily made after a few days. This is an RTS mod, and until you learn the game, you don't know jack.
Alien players simply have not learned how to play the game yet. Give them time.
I was the one continually bitching about the lack of teamwork <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->
No doubt that some sort of command structure might help the aliens somewhat. Listening to teammates might help also.
But I agree, the aliens are way too slow gaining resources, the turrets don't seem to do nearly enough, especially relative to the human turrets.
All humans need to do is fill a room with turrets (which they do), and its impossible to do anything to the room at all. One time I spent some time trying to firebomb them with exploding aliens and didn't scratch a single one.
And what kind of alien has its eyes *inside* its mouth? It's REALLY hard telling if you've even damaged a human, attacking with the skulks (thats the base one, right?). All the human need do is run away and there you are, biting a wall for 5 minutes, wondering if you hit the guy at all.
Anyway.. something definitely needs to be done. The aliens depend on hyper expansion, which the humans can easily counter with a few well places shots of any gun.
I dont know if the human turrets need be weakened, or a limit put on their numbers, or if the alien turrets need boosting, or... what.
I'll have to play some more and learn how to more fully utilize the alien skills before coming out with a definite answer. Maybe its just a harder learning curve on the aliens. I'm not making any definite comments (yet) on NERF THIS or BOOST THAT.
But what I've seen so far is
Human = win
Aliens = trying to find a way around turrets (or through) and dying. Repeatedly.
but if we have 2 or more player building resource towers as fast as we can we usualy get at least to hives quite well protected and i very often alwasy have max resources... BUT the marine towers are alot more powerful than the leins offesive chambers and an onos is quite easy to kill even though i have a couple of succsefull rushes with one and wiped out small bases with 2-3 turrets and a reosurce node..... but then i have like mx 70 hps left and no armour....
and the grenade launcher is abit too powerfull and the aliens dont anything to compare with it.... the lvl 4 alien or whatever it is the one wit acidrockets and stuff dont half as much damage .... the bile bombs do 40 damge i think and double vs buildings while the nade laucher does 200 and diuble vs buildings ringt??
so balance may be neeede but no too drastic chamges.... and yes i agree with you that it takes long time to get the first nodes running.... but you just have to deicate your team to get nodes and not attacking as much in the beginning
but the main problem is to get the alien team organised then you a quite good chanse of defeating the opponents
and one more problem the teams ar rarely even you often seee 6 mariens vs 2-3 aliens since everyone whant to be marien as it seems (I am not an exception but i play alien as well but I am great fan of temwork...)
And come on the game just came out, I dont think anyone who downloaded it yesterday has mastered it yet. Especially the alien side which has a higher learning curve. Most people who first play are gonna be marines first, because shotguns and machine guns are familiar to people. Give it some time and you will see that people will then learn aliens out of curiousity and this game will really shine!
YES, there is a problem right now, but it has nothing to do with the balance <i>as the game was designed to function</i>. There have been many reliable reports (from people who know what to look for) of a serious problem with the marine resources, ie: they are getting waaay too many waaay too fast. Once this bug is addressed, you will notice a remarkable change in the game balance. Please try and refrain from giving balance feedback until this happens. I know you're trying to be helpful, and I appreciate that you wouldn't have even taken the time to write a suggestion if you weren't genuinely interested. Just hang tight, and give us time to iron things out to the level at which we <i>know</i> from experience that the game works and is balanced. <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
That will help the aliens and melee atack, and hey I have DSL and on some servers it was hard to hit those fast moving aliens because they were jumping all over, + high ping.
<!--emo&::skulk::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/skulk.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::skulk::'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::asrifle::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/asrifle.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::asrifle::'><!--endemo-->
you gotta be sneaky, have you ever seen the movie Aliens? They pop outa conduits and pipes and take heads off! they dont run head on in broad daylight. you gotta hide and then put the fear of God into those marines.
Overall I love the hell out of this mod, but the aliens are fighting a losing battle. I agree about the resources... the marines are getting them WAY to fast and the aliens are at a disadvantage from the get go. <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
Anyway, I'll totally buy the resource reasoning as to the current imbalance. Its like Starcraft, using a resource cheat, or playing on BGH. Build right away, upgrade right away. The aliens have to wait for their structures so naturally are at a disadvantage.
Anyway, I, for some reason, rudely neglected to mention what an awesomely unique experience you guys have cooked up here! I look forward to playing it as often as possible, and actually learning more about the alien tech tree (which I'm sure would help <!--emo&:D--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':D'><!--endemo-->)
Example, I and another 2 people (all skulks) sort of accidentally stumbled across a level 3 marine with HMG facing the other way so we all started to attack. The marine heard the first chomping jaws noise, spun around, started firing and gibbed all 3 of us in about 2 seconds. Now this could have been the horrible lag or just bad luck, but it kinda annoyed me.
Another thing is with the marine turrets, they're too numerous and too difficult to destroy, so how about setting it so that destroying the factory that controls them will make the turrets go offline This would give the aliens something to focus their attacks upon, and also, something for the marines to actually defend, rather than just make walls and walls of turrets.
Aside from these small niggling problems, I really must applaud the dev team and anyone who worked on the game, it geniunely feels different from everything else out right now, and looks awsome. Bravo
[edit]: I RITE SENTANSES GUD!
Another thing is with the marine turrets, they're too numerous and too difficult to destroy, so how about setting it so that destroying the factory that controls them will make the turrets go offline This would give the aliens something to focus their attacks upon, and also, something for the marines to actually defend, rather than just make walls and walls of turrets.
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I think this makes a TON of sense if it hasn't already been done....I'd actually even like to see all turret's powered by the factory destroyed instead of disabled.
-SandTyger
<!--emo&::skulk::--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/skulk.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='::skulk::'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td><b>Quote</b> </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE"><!--QuoteEBegin-->Server patch coming shortly (players won't need to download anything):
- Improve server performance which is resulting in higher pings
- Code resource constants in the game, so admins can't unbalance the economy
- Some type of auto team balance to make the team sizes even
- Update linux server for shared library compatibility
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The Marines getting too many resources is to some server ops changing the RP draw speed and amount via a server var. This is going away immediately, so that there are no more 'Starcraft Big Game Hunter' games. The team balance will help keep teams from getting too lopsided. And the 'pings' (really the server CPU utilization) will get squared away soon (hopefully before the weekend).
As for concerns about 'morons' or 'non-teamplay': patience grasshoppah. I'm pretty sure everyone here was called a n00b and scoffed at in their first CS game too, and thought such and such sucked. NS was balance tested for about 6 months straight. It is as balanced as the first ever RTS-FPS game can be <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->. People need more than a couple hours to learn how to play teamwork for maybe the first times in their online lives, or to judge how to play each team. I guarantee you that if I jump on your server, I will own you as a Skulk, Gorge, Marine with pistol, or old lady with an umbrella. Not because I'm a great player (I'm not), but becuase I'm an experienced one. Give it some time.
When I played as a marine, I was "impressed" as to how fast things could be built (layed down by the comm).
As for the CPU ut. thing going on, low pings will be sweet to have =). Played on a server where everyone was pinging 900+, was quite funny actually =P.
As much of an "Arghhhh!" factor as there is to this game atm, I must say, I'm incredibly impressed with the design of it.
Once the kinks are ironed out, and people learn how to play as a team with the aliens (and people playing marines actually switch teams when it's 10 vs 3), there will be a lot of fun times to be had <!--emo&;)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'><!--endemo-->
Cheers,
Mr. PAin
humans probably arent supposed to be building entire roomfuls of turrets, the likes of which I ran into.
cant wait to try the aliens when we have a fighting chance
oh yeah, team balancing will be nice too! <!--emo&:)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=':)'><!--endemo-->
Yes, I saw this as well in the games I've played. To illustrate a little less vaguely, the marine resources were going up at about 30-50 per second when I was commanding (and there were only 2 r.collecters up).
There are no really critical balance issues as far as I'm concerned. Once the devs fix that little marine resource thing I'm sure I won't see anymore squads of 5+ HAs with HMGs rushing at my hives.
I've seen another problem though, and it concerns the alien 'hive sight' mechanism. Sometimes when I destroy a marine structure (not sure whether it was just set or completed) and I back away to do other things, the yellow 'ping' sprite remains there. This happened a couple times before and I searched EVERYWHERE for where the ping might be originating from and found nothing at all.
p.s. This bug is extremely annoying when the buggy ping is near a hive and the 'hive mind' constantly says 'the enemy approches'.
Aliens only way of communicating, other than the microphone, is to look at the blips through the walls. This may seem like an advantage at first, but the humans have the SAME ABILITY with an observatory. Not only can humans see you through walls, they can SHOOT you through walls with the siege turret. grrrrr
learning curve my butt, aliens are a lot of effort to learn with little reward.
that and I'm a good commander and soldier. heheh. But being a kharaa is pretty damn interesting.
In the games ive played the marines have won all the games.
The firepower of the marines is too great, plus the ability for command to drop ammo and med supplies on fighting marines - whats up with that?
In the games ive played the marines have won all the games.
The firepower of the marines is too great, plus the ability for command to drop ammo and med supplies on fighting marines - whats up with that?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Actually, you kind of need to do a little homework. In the previous posts it's been said that there is in fact a bug in the marine resource system, where the marines are sometimes given <b>way</b> more resources than the aliens. This is probably why you've been experiencing this overdrive of firepower from the marine force. I've actually been in a game where the commander would constantly arm me and 7 other marines with heavy armor and guns to do assaults on whatever area he wanted and at the same time, build masses of turrets and siege turrets everywhere so that the aliens can't build anything.
And as for the ammo and medpack drops, I'm guessing that the aliens should be able to kill off marines faster than the commander can get there and drop ammo. Skulks do 75(?) damage per bite, and marines have 100hp/50ap w/o upgrades. And since the skulks bite quite quickly, 2 seconds should be enough to kill the marine, scare the crap out of the player, and leave the commander with another guy at the respawn.
But this is just a guess. I wasn't there for the many millenia of playtesting for game balance.
The first is securing resource points and hives at the start. You have to run over to one, wait until you have enough points to change into a gorg, change into a gorg, wait until you have enough points to build a collector, build the collector, wait until you have enough points until you can build an offense tower (unless you want a marine to blow it up while your off doing other stuff), build the offense tower etc etc etc etc etc..... throughout all of this you have to hope like hell a marine doesn't come along and kill you otherwise you're back to square one. The same is true with getting a Hive except twice as worse due to the fact there are less of them, they are further away, they cost more and marines are actively defending them.
The second problem is that unless the aliens control two Hives they have no strong fighters (fades and onoses) and are screwed for the rest of the game if the marines secure two of the Hives as they don't really have anything good to take them back with.
The final problem is that apart from the needle attack they don't have any GOOD ranged attack for taking out sentries until they have two hives which is quite a while. Also they don't have anything to take out massed sentries until they have three Hives and a commander can just spam millions of them.
CS players always talk about how much better it is when a group works as a team and while we've all suspected as much it was sorta hard to gauge who was working as a team and who wasn't in CS. Well NS seems to prove that these people were always right, team play is about a thousand times mroe effective than people randomly running around.
And to that point, marines have a huge advantage because with a good commander and they seem to naturally gravitate towards working as a team. Crappy 'n00bs' will just end up running towards the waypoint they're given and doing what they're told cuz they aren't sure of themselves and experienced palyers will follow orders cuz they know its the best way to win.
On the other hand aliens could be just as effective as marines if they worked together in a team, but unforunatly the very nature of the aliens causes them to be disorganized. The NS team tried to counter this by providing hive site, movement towers, etc in the hopes that these would serve as a commander replacement; however it just doesn't work that way.
I think the problem that NS playtesters had was that well... they were the NS playtesters. They were all intimately involved with the creation of and/or balancing of the game; in other words they all were expert game players. However on the internet, as we all know, there are just as many inexperienced players and plain ol' dumbasses trying to play the game as there are experienced players. I've heard suggestions that once people 'learn' the aliens then the play will start to even out. Well I humbly respond that enough people will never 'learn' the aliens. There are simply too many 'n00bs' out there and as the game increases in popularity it will only get more n00bs playing it.
The aliens need some kind of unifying force helping them or their needs to be some serious balancing done...
...and of course heres a list of a few of the things that need balancing in my humble opinion <!--emo&;)--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=';)'><!--endemo-->
--Grenade explosions should hurt EVERYTHING, including marine units and buildings whether friendly fire is on or off. This will keep a few marines from simply rushing into a room while their friend stands back and lobs grenades in there.
--Marine turrets must be made less efficient/effective or alien turrets must be made to actually work <!--emo&???--><img src="http://www.natural-selection.org/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'><!--endemo-->
--All aliens should be able to build buildings. If marines can do it they want not aliens?
--aliens need a weapon equivalent to marine siege turret.
(Please note this is not a complaint, I LOVE the game you guys made and now worship your programming skillz as if you were gods, these are merely suggestions I'm making)
The rest of the complaints like "What if the marines secure 2 hives.. the aliens are screwed!" Well.. if you let them do that it's your own damn fault. Right now it's easy for them to do, but once resources are taken care of, boom, it's much much harder.
Almost ALL the problems I hear about will be fixed when the marine resource thing is, OR the player just doesn't understand how to play aliens and so they think they are underpowered. Wait. Be patient. Learn.
Things that help balance most people don't realize:
1. Lerk spikes have greater range than turrets. Lerks can pelt turrets safely out of range, though it does take a while.
2. Umbra is very abusable. A lerk with adrenaline can basically keep up a constant wall of umbra for him and his team mates. Two lerks with adrenaline could definately keep their team covered.
3. A group of 2 or 3 Lerks and everyone else as Onos can completely destroy a marine base. This will basically have a bunch of semi-invulnerable Onos in the marine base destroying everything very quickly. The only thing that will hurt anyone aside from the occasional shot that gets through, is a knife or grenade.
4. Skulk rush at the beginning of the round can kill a marine team completely even if aliens are outnumbed. A good Skulk is worth at least 3 naked marines.
Things that are serious issues:
1. Marines, even without resource problems, can pump out heavy units much faster than aliens can. If aliens are trying to take a base (without my above strategy) they can expect a constant wave of marines in jetpacks/heavy armor carrying their weapon of choice in addition to dealing with their turrets. If marines are attacking an alien base, marines can easily pick off skulks as they spawn.
2. Regular marine turrets are too easy to flood an area with. They're very cheap, get set up fast, and are very efficient. Hopefully the marine resource fix will help this out a lot. Another related problem is the low trajectory of Bile Bombs. It's really hard to shoot a Bile Bomb without the fade taking splash damage. Perhaps they need a slightly higher trajectrory so it's easier taking out turret nests.
3. Siege turrets. Range on these needs to be half what it is if not less. It's too easy to hide siege turrets and blow up hives or resource gatherers from halfway across a level or from highly protected areas it would be very difficult for aliens to take having only 1 or 2 hives.
4. If aliens fail to secure three hives very early they're doomed. The scenario that normally occurs is this: Marines find both the empty hive and the alien's secondary hive in construction. By the time aliens are getting enough resources to build a second hive, marines probably have HMGs. Marines have 1 or 2 people at the empty hive setting up turrets and siege turrets. Everyone else is at the 2nd hive. The aliens are all skulks, gorges, or Lerks without umbra. Versus a squad of marines with shotties and HMGs these aliens will lose. The marines take that hive, and set up defenses.
Now the aliens are stuck with only 1 hive, a very limited selection of evolutions and upgrades, and are faced with taking down an entire marine base without the luxury of high end fighters or umbra, not to mention marines can simply port their units straight to any trouble spots if aliens start taking out turrets.
This is probably the biggest problem in the game. It's near impossible to avoid if both teams are evenly matched, and it's near impossible to overcome.
I know the devs probably disagree with me and think they're mod has perfectly good balance and I hope they're right and the resource patch resolves balance issues. However I, along with most of the community, want these issues addressed and while I understand this mod is your personal work, if you want people to enjoy it, perhaps you should make a few concessions.
Don't you see the contradiction in this? It is *because* of the resource bug that the Marines can do this. You say that the Marine turrets are very cheap to build, but you base this on the current resource model, in which resources accumulate for the Marines vastly quicker than they were intended to. With resources the way they are supposed to be, turrets are not cheap, but a fair investment, and any commander who put up 4 or 5 turrets would quickly find himself unable to give his teammates any weapons or build anything else, unless they had saved up for a while.
You wouldn't see 10 turrets here, 8 there, and 12 over there, unless the alien team had gone afk for 20 minutes and then come back.
Wait for the patch, and *then* decide...
Twilight