Hy there. I want to give something back to this great game and here you have it! My feedback.

ceaRshafceaRshaf Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176140Posts: 7Members
edited January 2013 in Ideas and Suggestions
Feedback is meant to help the game not to rant at stuff.
Hello fellow marines and aliens.

Let me start by saying that NS2 is a great non conventional game and I just love it since the first moment I bought it. I want to make this thread in an attempt to give my honest opinion about how the game feels for a rookie and later on a veteran commander. This is a feedback and suggestion post that I hope you will welcome and discuss later on. I spent my time writing this feedback because I love this game and want to see it improved, and If my feedback can open some can of worms maybe I can help it get better.

Please take in mind the casual fan base that is essential for the life of a game. Elitist players should just be better at doing things, not do things better because they know stuff a rookie doesn't, like the fact that Armories give health and ammo and you don't need to spam your commander for any of those :D.
I am ready to discuss further any of the below points, but to keep it a rather (lol) small post I just present you my suggestions.

Gameplay Issues

1) The level should start in the dark (not pitch dark, but the red light dark) .

Why is the colony/level powered up even thought the energy sockets have not been placed by the Marines? The game should start with everything in the dark (except for the starting base) to make for a plausible and better atmosphere. Witch leads to the second point.

2) The Power Node is a broken mechanic.

Redesign the role of the power node to change it from being such a weak spot in a Marine base. Commanding Marines to power up rooms taken down by rogue Skulks all day long is not fun, and in public pubs this is frustrating since there is no coordination. The casual will get bored to repair power nodes all day long and this chaos in the team leads to a loss anyway.
The power node should power up the colony sectors/rooms only but not the Marine structures. Marines should fight in the dark, in an hostile environment if they don't power up the rooms but they should be bringing their own equipment to clear the colony of the Alien infestation. Powering the nodes should not require the commander to be (first time) repaired and should activate:

- light in the sector/room comforting the players;

- ventilators in the all the vents connected to the room with the active Power Node, disabling the path for Aliens;

- the sector/room door switches, that can allow the Marines to close doors. Aliens will have to chew the switch to destroy it in order to open the door and Marines will be able to fix the switches. Also closed doors will allow the Marines to weld them, closing them permanently until an Onos or Exo will break it. No second welding allowed.

- security cameras from the powered room that will function as an Observatory for the Commander only. The Marines will not be able to see enemy units, only the Commander.

- different interesting animations making the level feel alive, and maybe affecting the gameplay like moving platforms, elevators, lava spills, ETC.

3) Marine structures should get power only from Batteries.

All Marine structures should get power from Commander build Batteries, placed anywhere in the level. Around the battery we will see the range it can spread its connecting cables. More batteries can be build per room, though maybe with a later restriction, but a structure will get power only from a single battery. The commander will be responsible of the wiring and once the aliens take down a battery he will be responsible of the rewiring to a new battery, otherwise the disconnected structures will be powerless.

Batteries:
- 3 per room;
- can give power to a maximum of 3 structures only (3 sockets);
- have to be manually wired to the structures by the commander (click and connect);
- have a circular area where the wires can reach, so structures need to be in range;

4) Sentries with a current Battery are redundant.

Why power up a sector if I need a battery that is AGAIN the weak point of a Marine defense? I suggest that Marines should be allowed to buy a new sentry that performs like the one in Team Fortress 2.

Sentry:
- takes one full battery to power it (3 sockets from the Battery)
- costs 20 res;
- has no blind spot
- has low DPS, but can kill alone one Skulk, but not two;

5) Alien attacks should not be so one dimensional.

There should be ceiling corridors (like in the movie Aliens), under the floor railing passages, making the Aliens a constant threat that can come from under the floor or hiding in the ceiling. Fighting the Aliens in a distant hallways is not fair for the Aliens. They need more places to jump and surprise a rookie Marine.
I am not saying that they can't jump from the ceiling as it is, but it is one dimensional. You look up, the Skulk is there or it isn't, but he has no place to hide bellow or above. Jumping you from the metal railing bellow you would make it walking on corridors alone even more terrifying.

6) Allow the Marines to research Thermal Headset, Combat Shield, Grenades and Pulse Launcher.

Thermal Headset:
- researched at the Armory;
- costs 10 Pres;
- change the Marine normal vision to heat detection;
- detects Alien units and structures, even cloaked;

Combat Shield:
- researched at the Armory;
- costs 15 Pres;
- replaces the primary weapon of the Marine;
- is activated with the RMB and slows down the walk of the Marine when active. The shield is raised in front of the first person view of the player;
- when activated the Shield protects the Marine from ranged attacks and Onos charges;

Grenades (remove the Grenade Launcher):
- costs 15 Pres for 5 Grenades;
- thrown with the hand like any other grenades in any game;
- area damage;

Pulse Launcher:
- costs 20 Pres;
- fires an energy pulse beam that immobilizes any hit unit by electroshocking it (attacks the muscles or something); the unit remains immobilized as long as the Marine keeps firing the weapon or until he remains out of energy in the weapon;
- doesn't do any actual damage;
- support weapon;

7) Players should be encouraged to do things in the game, and rewarded for doing them.

At the moment Pres are just resources linked to the number of the extractors. It doesn't have to do anything with your personal value in the team. Why should a valuable player not gain extra resources if he is killing Skulks like Rambo, or another sneaky ninja Marine for solo destroying Alien extractors?
At the moment players don't waste enough their resources since once dead you lose your investment in a shotgun or a fancy flamethrower. I feel more resources should be dumped in the pool for both teams to make things play a lot more fun. I suggest that the game should offer resources for killing, repairing, constructing and destroying. This will encourage activity not inactivity of the fear to die and lose your investment.
Also there should be more fun ways to spend your Pres on. As a Marine sometimes I hang on on my first weapon until I get my exo because I feel that others investments will not pay off long enough to warrant their cost.

8) Let me customize my Marine.

Imagine that in the menu you could customize your Marine, with what skin color, body, tattoos, and everything you wish to add tp reflect your personality in the game. This kind of things are required for an AAA game. I know NS2 has a small team, but I needed to mention it.

9) Give me a medium to play competitive.
The game is fun but it doesn't take advantage of the competitive nature of the player. There is no ranked system, there is no way to get matched with better, and better players. You have to do research to get into a team or the competitive scene. The game has to sunk you in. There is no way to measure your personal skill. I have no idea if I am better then I was one week ago. What are my stats? What is my win ration, or kills/deaths ratio. Or how many team actions did I do in my career? How good of a commander I am?

10) Give me achievements and badges.

If the above things were not important most of the games would not have them for casual players. People like to collect things and brag with them. Look, I have the "500 Skulk heads" achievement. Isn't that cool?
We need personalized profiles where we can see the career of a player. Players poor hundred of hours into the game, it's important for them to see that they have something at the end. A career page is just that.

11) Rookies hit a wall.

The experience you get from playing NS2 for the first time is of disorientation and somewhat frustration. All the shooters so far have sculpted this image of how a shooter should be. So once you enter NS2 and try to go Rambo you will think the game is stupid not that the game doesn't work that way. Also I didn't even know Armories heal and give ammo for free for a long time and I was spamming like hell my commander for ammo and health. Now keep in mind, what is obvious as a veteran is not for a first timer.
I suggest hints to guide you from time to time "Stick to your teammates", "Heal at the Armory" (when low in health) etc. At the moment there are some guidelines like this, but I suggest a lot more, if not a TUTORIAL.
Also loading screens need a LOT more hints. The first time I loaded the game I've read them all with great interest just to see that there are only a few.

12) Finding a game and entering play needs some work.

Finding a game is pretty easy and straightforward at the moment. However in the server list I feel the bellow features would be a great addition:

- the ability to see how many minutes into a game the server is running (maybe I want to play from scratch not an already 30 minutes developed game)
- how many players are in each team (to see if you there is room for me for marines for example)

Now, once I enter a server I often get into this situation where I want to join a certain team but more people want the same thing also. We are all in line and waiting for someone to jump to the other team to make room for one more. This is bad design. It is no fun to micro your way into the game, and forcing you to join the team you don't want to is not good.

So I suggest that in the server search lobby you can check the team you want to play in and the game will list only games that have room available in the desired teams. Once you join you are automatically in the game in that team. No game lobby, no waiting, no nerves.
All the above could be fixed with a Match Making system.

13) Make Aliens be more swarmy and feel like they infested the place.

Give the Alien commander the ability to build a special unit that is controlled by him. The unit would have low health, low attack damage, but can be massed by the commander and given orders by him to siege bases and attack players. This unit would only attack enemy units and has the role to give the feeling of the Aliens as a swarmy race, not fighting on same numbers as the marines. This would make attacks on Marine bases more epic and more slaughtery and would give the Marines a feeling that they are outnumbered.

14) The game tends to go to Exos vs Onos battles only.

Sure, there are many ways you can get to that point, and many other ways to lose till you get there but the point is that this is linear. Where are my choices? Where are my comeback solutions? Why do I have to have 2 Command Stations to buy a personal Exo of it's already researched? There should be more ways of playing the game not all small variations of the same strategy.
Some of the suggested weapons above would make a gameplay based on Marine coordination instead of based on Exo firepower.

15) Aliens have a better base defense.

Cloak, gorges, whip, etc.
This should be the other way around. Marine bases should not be put in threat by a single Skulk making a whole squad get back to base to chase it away for a minute till he comes back. Why don't the Marines behave like an organized team? Why is the base of an Alien harder to take down or attacked by small groups of Marines? Marines should be in danger once they leave their comfort zone, their base. A Marine base should be taken down with some coordination from the Aliens. Now a single smart Skulk can cripple a whole team. and even win the game.
The gameplay now is that the Marines really need to work like a charm together. For casuals and public pubs this leads to frustrations. All the Marines run like drunk sheep trying to defend extractors, repair power nodes and chase away one skulk poking at an Infantry Portal or Phase Gate. Meanwhile the Alien Commander expands and gets Onos. GG.
Marines should be more organized by design.

16) Give the Marines the ability to build an Outpost, a defensive structure.

Outpost:
- costs 25 res;
- doesn't require energy;
- costs Pres to give it ammo;
- defensive covers at the front of the structure and a mini-gun above;
- one Marine can enter the structure and use the min-gun at the cost of Pres for ammo used;
- has 180 degrees at the back blind spot;

17) Commander orders should appear more important on the screen of the Marine.

A blue line on the floor sometimes just doesn't cut it to a lazy Marine that thinks the destination is too far away or doesn't understand where it leads or why. The Commander orders should appear more personal on the Marine screen like a text saying "The Commander orders you to defend Pipe Works" or something else that give the Marine a better understanding of why and when and that is important for him to cooperate.
17) Marine Commander needs some bug fixing and features.

Bugs:
- sometimes it's hard to click on a structure that has an icon suggesting me what to build;
- things don't deselect easy enough and orders are given wrong from this;
- an upgrade finished or structure has a red circle around it to warn me about it but this confuses me to think the place is attacked;
- ARCs should fire as soon they have vision not after a while. I waste a scan and they fire only twice while the scan lasts instead of three times as it should if they would fire ASAP;
- the ability to drop ammo and health is so broken i can't believe it. Dropping health on to a Marine should be done with a small area circle not a click on a moving Marine. The closest unit to the center of the circle gets the ammo/health;
- let me cancel some uncancelable upgrades;
- Exos coming from the small ProtoLab structure just seem wrong;
- dragging never selects right, only double click;

Features:
- this is only for the Commander interface, but make it that I have all my team lined up somewhere in the UI like in a strategy game. When one of them asks for ammo/health his icon just pulses. I click on it and will have some options there and personal information about him like Pres, current weapon, etc;
- as a Marine Commander I want to see the health of the enemy structures my Marines see, what weapons my Marines have on them and their Pres. I am their commander. I need to know if they can afford an exo or not to make better moment decisions.
- structures that I want constructed should remain a hologram until they are completed. Otherwise the current mechanic just pins down a Marine until the structure is completed and I have to hope that no skulk is near by the Marine working or both the Marine and the uncompleted structure will be lost;
- let me cancel structure holograms without losing res; Why am I punished for changing my mind if nothing has been constructed?
- I need better alerts when something is attacked. I have one alert and then I need to spam click to see if any building is actually attacked;
- let me research 70 clip rounds for Marines as a late game upgrade;
Post edited by Unknown User on

Comments

  • halfofaheavenhalfofaheaven Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168660Posts: 379Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    edited January 2013
    None constructive post *SNIPPED*... Seriously what is wrong with some of you these last days, stop being so bloody hostile!!! -Kouji San
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • ceaRshafceaRshaf Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176140Posts: 7Members
    QUOTE (halfofaheaven @ Jan 2 2013, 09:52 AM) »
    Please uninstall the game.


    Why are you so hostile? The community has to be open to suggestion. I feel now that every suggestion ends up with l2p or the devs are doing what they can and go back to the rookie servers.

    I bring some points, maybe not the most correct ones or relevant but are points after hours of playing.

    If the elitism is not dropped there will be no player mass to keep the game alive.
  • halfofaheavenhalfofaheaven Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168660Posts: 379Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    Just trying to help. By the looks of it, you want a completely different game. Also, every single one of your ideas is atrocious and shows you have no idea what the game is about.

    tldr: l2p
  • ceaRshafceaRshaf Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176140Posts: 7Members
  • Crumbling EgoCrumbling Ego Join Date: 2012-10-30 Member: 164692Posts: 52Members
    edited January 2013
    I think that this would work great as a mod, and that's what you should pursue it as. Some of your ideas are a bit too drastic for short term changes, however the power node only affecting lights is one that I heartily support.
    Also, Half. Stop being an asshat.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • SaltSalt Join Date: 2012-11-21 Member: 172766Posts: 45Members, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Gold, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    1) The level should start in the dark.
    Yup, Already a point on the dev's list to-do. Maybe not pitch black, but the red reserve power light.

    2) The Power Node is a broken mechanic.
    Yes it is, it needs to be removed or not affect surrounding buildings so dramatically.
    I made a post about powernodes in the map affecting the efficiency of buildings, which could work out. but it definately needs attention.

    3) Marine structures should get power only from Batteries.
    Nope, Bad mechanic. if anything building efficiency should be dependent on the amount of HP a building has left.

    4) Sentries with a current Battery are redundant.
    Sentries are very controversial at the moment, the damage they do is low, and the cost they have compared to their impairment against an alien that knows how it operates is not worth it.
    They should be marine-deployables like mines, costing T/P resources.

    5) Alien attacks should not be so one dimensional.
    Alien attacks consist of guerrilla style attacks, Which are not meant to be game enders, The transition from guerrilla to game ending is something new players need to know how to do.

    6) Allow the Marines to research Thermal Headset, Combat Shield, Grenades and Pulse Launcher.
    New items are comming for both aliens and marines at the end of January, best leave creation and addition of big mechanics like that to them and test it over and over rather than throwing in random stuff and see if it works.

    7) Players should be encouraged to do things in the game, and rewarded for doing them.
    Yup.

    8) Let me customize my Marine.
    "This kind of things are required for an AAA game."

    What... the ######. are you serious?
    Just no.

    9) Give me a medium to play competitive.
    Tryout for a clan, Join it, Train by doing clan-organised scrims and wars, Join online tourneys. it's community organised, and well organised i might add. No need for an 'official' system.

    10) Give me achievements and badges.
    Same as your customizing point.. What the ######.
    No, Not a requisite, Not desirable and not worth it.
    Bragging rights are retarded, and it lets people ###### around too much "because they want that achievement".

    11) Rookies hit a wall.
    Rookies need to be in rookie status a lot longer.
    There is a lot in this game to learn. I hate it when a majority of my team doesn't understand the works of a certain mechanic that i've tested and doctored out. And continue to do their things in ignorance. It ruins games if not infuriate players that know how things work and make them leave.

    12) Finding a game and entering play needs some work.
    Joining games is an opportunistic thing. You pick whatever, or wait for a new round to start, or perhaps spectate to see the status of the current game.

    13) Make Aliens be more swarmy and feel like they infested the place.
    One word: Blabbers.
    Comming end of January

    14) The game tends to go to Exos vs Onos battles only.
    Thats where a lot of 'newbies' think it should go.
    To be honest, it's the reward of spending your topgun resources on the biggest lifeform/thing you can get.
    Which makes you near unkillable, if you're good that is.
    Marines are slowly starting to realize that for them this is not the case and jetpacks are much better in that aspect.
    Aliens are even slower, when they learn that like the skill required to play skulk, the same goes for lerks and fades.
    I've seen lerks kill 4 marines without dieing, and i've seen 1 marine kill two lerks, It completely depends on your skill, and that tad bit of luck.

    15) Aliens have a better base defense.
    Not really, Not going into specifics, but the whip's range makes randy savage cry at night. that's all i'll say about that. Other than that, Marines just need an extra defensive option, Walling off with armories is valiant, but should be a dedicated structure, maybe even deployable costing P-res.

    16) Give the Marines the ability to build an Outpost, a defensive structure.
    Like your previous point, this will fix it, Maybe not this specific idea, but a defensive option in general to even it out.

    17) Commander orders should appear more important on the screen of the Marine.
    For sure, For aliens as well, The 'danger' icon and expanding icons are barely used because it's barely visible and acknowledgeable.
    Commanders use voice chat to be more clear of those general calls of direction. So a visual representation for it is really not desirable. And only there for rookies and newbies.
    Marines should be in the same boat, but they can be directed in specifics.
  • LingosLingos Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176896Posts: 32Members
    yeah that half guy is lame.

    only things I can agree with is 11, 12 and 17.

    Rewarding individuals playing good would unbalance the game.
  • bERt0rbERt0r Join Date: 2005-03-23 Member: 46181Posts: 553Members
    edited January 2013
    The TO makes some very valid points. After all, this is his feedback and an opinnion can never be wrong. Obviously, some things like achievements should not be top priority for the devs to make, those are nice to have features. I find people like halfofaheaven very rude and damaging to the community. I'm not sure whether I should report him because the forum rules are a bit unclear towards this behaviour.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • DamDSxDamDSx Join Date: 2004-08-10 Member: 30506Posts: 311Members
    edited January 2013
    My god what the hell are babblers!!!!!

    ignore, made a topic.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • Thr3xThr3x Join Date: 2013-01-02 Member: 177135Posts: 15Members
    @ nr.3
    You must construct additional Pylons!
  • zenatsuzenatsu Join Date: 2012-12-26 Member: 176363Posts: 30Members
    What salt said, everything that salt said.

    /thead

    salt won.
  • ceaRshafceaRshaf Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176140Posts: 7Members
    edited January 2013
    QUOTE
    @ nr.3
    You must construct additional Pylons!


    Correct. But if you think of it the current Power Nodes are just like that but more of an Artosis Pylon if you know what I mean :).

    Batteries make more sense for a Marine deployment in a hostile environment and make for a more interesting gameplay for the commander that has to manage his base better and has more control than a Achilles Heel Power Node.

    QUOTE
    What salt said, everything that salt said.

    /thead

    salt won.


    In a feedback discussion there is no winning since it's not about that :).

    And Salt, I understand your points about achievements and badges but you must understand that the game has to cater to the masses not to the elitists that don't give a crap about a badge. A successful game community is made out of 90% random casuals and 10% of competitive players that care only to get better.

    This is at the bottom of the to do list maybe, but things like this do matter to the success of a game.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • Thr3xThr3x Join Date: 2013-01-02 Member: 177135Posts: 15Members
    QUOTE (ceaRshaf @ Jan 2 2013, 01:57 PM) »
    Correct. But if you think of it the current Power Nodes are just like that but more of an Artosis Pylon if you know what I mean :).


    Yes ! Those ######ing Artosis Pylons. One runby and the zerg wins. I mean the Kharaa :D
  • sHawke_NativesHawke_Native Join Date: 2012-12-20 Member: 175650Posts: 131Members
    i agree with Salt and i have made my point with a ranking system it does NOTHING to help the player just makes it so "oh this guy has a high rank let me hangout with him" blah blah blah and if someone knows how to play and is being watched by a newbie on how to play or whatever then that newbie should learn and not just hangout with him so he doesnt die it should be you know what you're doing let me watch how you play so i know how to play also a ranking system would prevent people who are good at the game be on a rookie server and own all the newbs you can't be a certain rank and be on a rookie server or a max per team and it should be a marine/alien rank also a higher rank marine/alien can take a newbie commander out of the comm chair it maybe a bit OP because of trolls, could be ranked by win/loss ratio the more you lose the lower comm rank you have and same with on-ground marine/aliens also the better you do with an alien type(skulk,gorge,lurk,fade and onos) the higher rank you have with that alien may be hard to implement
    and before you give your ideas on this game play more then the 6 hours you have...play at least till you have played like 10 hours or so and newbies should be newbie rank for like 10 hours of gameplay
  • SquishpokeSquishpoke Join Date: 2012-10-31 Member: 165262Posts: 1,254Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited January 2013
    Don't mind that rude guy. I'll be a bit more helpful and talk about what I like and dislike from your list (and try to give reasons).

    QUOTE (ceaRshaf @ Jan 2 2013, 08:28 AM) »
    Gameplay Issues

    1) The level should start in the dark.

    I agree! Also, I feel that emergency lighting should fade in and out very slowly.

    2) The Power Node is a broken mechanic.

    Your idea is interesting but complex. I like the simplicity of the current power node system.

    5) Alien attacks should not be so one dimensional.

    I wouldn't mind a level with tons of floor grates and ceiling vents. That would be really cool.

    6) Allow the Marines to research Thermal Headset, Combat Shield, Grenades and Pulse Launcher.

    Thermal Headset:

    Somewhat redundant due to scanning and observatories. Plus, 10 PRES is too cheap for a direct hard counter against an entire alien tech tree.

    Combat Shield:

    It's a cool idea, but I doubt anyone would want to use it if it meant losing your primary. I can only see this being used as a novelty for Onos blocking.

    Grenades (remove the Grenade Launcher):

    The point of the Grenade launcher is to encourage teamwork and specialization. You have one or two guys with high damage potential, but weak defense, so the commander needs to make sure the GL guys have backup and proper positioning.

    Removing the GL and "hybridizing" marines would be boring in my opinion, and would encourage more ramboing instead of teamwork.

    Pulse Launcher:

    Against aliens, this idea is a bit too powerful, and would render Onoses completely ineffective. Furthermore, weapons that immobilize or alter the movement of their enemies are almost always disliked in every game they show up.

    7) Players should be encouraged to do things in the game, and rewarded for doing them.

    They are encouraged to do effectively in the game. If players do well, the TEAM is rewarded with extra resources or map control. I think we should strive to encourage teamwork, not glorify personal accomplishments.

    Example: sure, you lost your flamethrower by taking out an enemy extractor. But hey, that means your team can get ahead resource-wise and the Commander may drop you another flamethrower if you can consistently keep your team ahead.

    8) Let me customize my Marine.

    Check out the Steam workshop, plenty of people are making mods! I'd much rather have the mod community working on this than the developers. This means the developers will be free to work on more important things, like new maps.

    9) Give me a medium to play competitive.
    This game has too few players in order to utilize matchmaking effectively. You basically need players numbering at the level of Starcraft's in order to have a positive matchmaking experience.

    Right now, competitive play is organized via Pick-Up-Games.

    10) Give me achievements and badges.

    Achievements are nice, but if it takes the developers 40 hours to do this, I'd rather have them working on something more important.

    11) Rookies hit a wall.

    This is where "L2P" comes in. I started out as a rookie like anyone else, and I felt that the learning experience was perfectly fine. If players can't figure out the game with a little experimentation, I'd say all hope is lost for them.

    12) Finding a game and entering play needs some work.

    Yeah, I wouldn't mind "time elapsed" and the players within the game being shown.

    13) Make Aliens be more swarmy and feel like they infested the place.

    I hear babblers are making a comeback!

    14) The game tends to go to Exos vs Onos battles only.

    Haven't seen a bile bomb rush or flaming jetpack marines yet, have ya?

    15) Aliens have a better base defense.

    Don't forget that marines have mines and guns. I feel those give them an edge on defense (especially with upgraded weapons).

    Whips? Bah, I just jetpack past them most of the time, unless there are enough of them to one-hit me as I speed past.

    16) Give the Marines the ability to build an Outpost, a defensive structure.

    Outpost:

    Just use Exos instead.

    17) Commander orders should appear more important on the screen of the Marine.

    There's voice chat, and good commanders use it effectively.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    For each word spoken, one forgotten. For every thought, a memory rotten.
  • ceaRshafceaRshaf Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176140Posts: 7Members
    edited January 2013
    Thanks for the nice reply.

    Gameplay Issues


    2) The Power Node is a broken mechanic.

    Your idea is interesting but complex. I like the simplicity of the current power node system.

    It is simple but flawed, making casual Marines run all over the map trying to power up rooms and dying from a skulk while doing so.


    6) Allow the Marines to research Thermal Headset, Combat Shield, Grenades and Pulse Launcher.

    Thermal Headset:

    Somewhat redundant due to scanning and observatories. Plus, 10 PRES is too cheap for a direct hard counter against an entire alien tech tree.

    I would remove Scan and Observatories. Scan is kinda OP and has no real explication of how we can scan. Marines would have the helmet and the commander would have the security cameras from powered rooms.

    Combat Shield:

    It's a cool idea, but I doubt anyone would want to use it if it meant losing your primary. I can only see this being used as a novelty for Onos blocking.

    If you don't lose your primary I think this shield would be too powerful. This would also reinforce the idea of a support equipment. Shield guys in front, the firing guys in the back.

    Grenades (remove the Grenade Launcher):

    The point of the Grenade launcher is to encourage teamwork and specialization. You have one or two guys with high damage potential, but weak defense, so the commander needs to make sure the GL guys have backup and proper positioning.

    While I understand why it is interesting I don't think it is actually fun to see your grenades bounce like ping pong balls and suddenly die because one bounced back. And if you get 10 bad experiences as a rookie with this weapon you will never use it after since you will label it as useless.

    In comparison to the flamethrower or shotgun this is a LOT less used in the team. There must be a reason.


    Removing the GL and "hybridizing" marines would be boring in my opinion, and would encourage more ramboing instead of teamwork.

    I would consider removing the hand Gun when you have grenades, just like you loose the Switch-Axe when you have the welder.

    Pulse Launcher:

    Against aliens, this idea is a bit too powerful, and would render Onoses completely ineffective. Furthermore, weapons that immobilize or alter the movement of their enemies are almost always disliked in every game they show up.

    I agree that hard counters are bad. I am thinking at a support weapon only thought. Maybe with some tweaks and limitations, like no effect on higher evolved creatures, only to freeze the Gorge healing an Onos but not to freeze the Onos itself. Point taken.

    7) Players should be encouraged to do things in the game, and rewarded for doing them.

    They are encouraged to do effectively in the game. If players do well, the TEAM is rewarded with extra resources or map control. I think we should strive to encourage teamwork, not glorify personal accomplishments.

    Example: sure, you lost your flamethrower by taking out an enemy extractor. But hey, that means your team can get ahead resource-wise and the Commander may drop you another flamethrower if you can consistently keep your team ahead.

    You gave a positive negative, to say so. The point was that good, effective players should be rewarded for doing good things. I should repair this structures because not only I help the whole team but I get one extra Pres for instance. This is good encouragement of being good and helpful.


    11) Rookies hit a wall.

    This is where "L2P" comes in. I started out as a rookie like anyone else, and I felt that the learning experience was perfectly fine. If players can't figure out the game with a little experimentation, I'd say all hope is lost for them.

    Here you have an elitist view on rookies. No, it's not like that. Every game is responsible of making the customers understand what they have to do in the product they bought, and possible customers interested into buying the game with all the cool features presented in a friendly way. After all why should a new player have interest into something he knows nothing about? Interest doesn't spawn out of nothing. You have to present them something.


    14) The game tends to go to Exos vs Onos battles only.

    Haven't seen a bile bomb rush or flaming jetpack marines yet, have ya?

    I have but the fact is that most of the games are not that. Those are exceptions.

    15) Aliens have a better base defense.

    Don't forget that marines have mines and guns. I feel those give them an edge on defense (especially with upgraded weapons).

    Mines are ok, but Marines don't sit in bases. A base needs structures. When commanders wall of with armories you know there is need for something.

    16) Give the Marines the ability to build an Outpost, a defensive structure.

    Outpost:

    Just use Exos instead.

    An exo for an Outpost is a wasted 50-75 resources. The concept was of a static defense structure that takes Pres to use and is fun to use. Also it make a base sound more like a base with defense and stuff.

    17) Commander orders should appear more important on the screen of the Marine.

    There's voice chat, and good commanders use it effectively.

    But that has nothing to do with the fact that the game doesn't help coordination. We don't need workarounds but features.

    Again, thanks for getting on the discussion.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • LingosLingos Join Date: 2012-12-31 Member: 176896Posts: 32Members
    The thing on the onos vs exo thing. the game has been out for 2 months, people are going to become somewhat pro in this game in the coming months and we will hopefully see a variety of tactics. just today, the commander ported everyone to base and told them to get flamethrower guns if you got the res. I believe this game has the potential to become some sort of E-sport, its more entertaining to watch than Dota 2/LoL/HoN, hell maybe even more entertaining than starcraft 2(But then again, the reason starcraft 2 is awesome to me is the personality of the players). And I've been watching Honcast for like a year

    I just think its too early to try speak for the strategies, especially when the steam sale is going on, people don't have a clue what they are doing. Watch some competitive matches and you will see they are pulling off some starcraft 2 stuff.
  • halfofaheavenhalfofaheaven Join Date: 2012-11-09 Member: 168660Posts: 379Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    edited January 2013
    Okay here comes the rude guy's feedback.


      1) The level should start in the dark (not pitch dark, but the red light dark) .It makes sense logically, but it's already hard enough for marines to pressure areas early game. Darkened or red-lit rooms would just make it worse.2) The Power Node is a broken mechanic.No it's not. Power nodes bring a unique gameplay aspect to the game. Rushing and defending power nodes is exciting and challenging. Knowing when it's a waste of time to kill a power node and when to get it down seperate the more experienced and intelligent players from the new and/or mindless ones.3) Marine structures should get power only from Batteries.There's a reason powering buildings is something field players have to take care of and are in some way responsible for. The commander already has enough stuff to do. Constantly having to worry about, wire and rewire batteries while your marines die from the lack of medpacks and the alien commander expands everywhere freely is not something you want to add. The game is about interaction and teamwork between the commander and their team, not about the commander playing singleplayer warlord.4) Sentries with a current Battery are redundant. Sentries are redundant. They don't secure or hold locations, phase gates and marines do. But that's beside the point here. Your idea of a single powerful sentry with no blind spot is terrible for the same reason as my last point. If they made sentries useful instead of a minor annoyance, commanders would secure areas with sentries instead of trusting their marines to do their job. There are already enough pseudo singleplayer comms getting sentries instead of upgrades, and it's a great way to easily tell apart terrible and good commanders. With your idea, you could argue it takes aliens teamwork to get a sentry down, but that also holds true with the current sentries.5) Alien attacks should not be so one dimensional.Two words: walljumping and teamwork. Use them. Skulks are not meant to win 1:1 encounters. Alien play is about map awareness and coordination. Plus, it's perfectly possible to surprise a marine if you do it right. Don't wait behind a wall and hope they won't notice you when they walk by. Jump in their face.6) Allow the Marines to research Thermal Headset, Combat Shield, Grenades and Pulse Launcher.With the exception of hand grenades, all of these either counter something that should only be able to be countered by prevention or they don't encourage intelligent play in a balanced and satisfying way. Introducing a hard counter to every alien ability is not how you create exciting and rewarding gameplay. I see where you're trying to go with the shield and the pulse launcher, but that's not how you introduce more teamwork to the game. Reward intelligent play and players will learn faster and realise teamwork is the way to go. Any "I saw x, so now I have to get y" features are something heavily avoided by the devs, and rightly so.7) Players should be encouraged to do things in the game, and rewarded for doing them.RFK has been discussed a lot, and was regarded as too imbalanced. Players are rewarded by points and their team having a higher chance to win with every useful action. I feel intensely satisfied every time I solo an RT down, because I know it can be a game changer in the long run. If you're saying players should be made more aware of what's a big deal to achieve, all I can say is they will once they understand the game better. The current points system is perfectly fine, with the exception of not getting points for welding and healing, which I think is already being addressed.8) Let me customize my Marine.I wouldn't mind this as long as it's subtle differences, but I also don't really care.9) Give me a medium to play competitive.Once again, you will be able to judge your skill level once you understand the game. If you want to play with people at your skill level exclusively, find a fitting team and/or play matches/gathers. If you're new to the game, play on rookie servers.10) Give me achievements and badges.Yup. Achievements would be great and are already planned.11) Rookies hit a wall.There are tutorials (and rookie servers) for a reason. You can't expect to learn and understand a game this complex instantly and easily, it takes time and effort. I do agree there need to be more loading screen tips though.12) Finding a game and entering play needs some work.Sounds reasonable. I do however only play on one server exclusively, so I don't really care. I suggest you do the same.13) Make Aliens be more swarmy and feel like they infested the place. (commander controlled attack units)No. It's not a singleplayer game. If you want scouting units, use drifters. For everything else you're gonna have to rely on teamwork. Just like it should be.14) The game tends to go to Exos vs Onos battles only. First of all, I'll have you know that shotguns counter pretty much everything, especially combined with jetpacks. So it's not really always boiling down to Exos vs Onos. Or at least it doesn't have to. Secondly, if you let aliens have 3 hives, lost your 2nd base and all your Exos, you don't deserve an easy comeback. The only possible comeback from this situation right now is killing their lifeforms while getting a sneaky PG up somewhere pretty much at the same time. Which is incredibly hard to pull off, just like it should be. Marine base turtling is already bad enough and does certainly not need any worsening.15) Aliens have a better base defense.Yes they do. Which, again, is exactly like it should be. Marines need aggressiveness to win because it's in the nature of a scenario of ranged weapons vs melee attacks. Marines being constantly paranoid and having to be careful of not losing their base to a rush is also perfectly fitting. A single skulk or even a small team of aliens can only do any damage to a base if both the marines and their commander don't scout, don't pay attention and are badly organised. Now, aliens being free to attack marines over and over while their commander freely expands everywhere is another issue altogether, which I agree needs addressing quite badly, but you won't solve this by reversing roles. The roles make sense, it's balance that needs work. If there's an easy way to make it harder for aliens to expand without any player help, neither you nor I know one that isn't drastic or crippling, and the devs and playtesters don't seem to either.16) Give the Marines the ability to build an Outpost, a defensive structure. Why? There is absolutely no point to this whatsoever. Teamplay and pressure wins games, not defending. Much less immobile defending. It would just be a waste of a player who's needed and much more well used somewhere else.17) Commander orders should appear more important on the screen of the Marine.Any good commander will have a microphone and tell you where to go and what to do. Waypoints work perfectly fine for what they are. For everything else, use your minimap and get to know the map better.18) Marine Commander needs some bug fixing and features.Some good suggestions here, some really bad ones. Medpack "aim" and browsing the map for hurt marines are skills that need to stay that way, else you'll massively alter game balance for any higher level play. Also, hologram structures work perfectly fine as they are now. You're punished for recycling them because otherwise you could find out where alien structures and hives are for free.


    I hope I helped.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • SaniKSaniK Join Date: 2012-11-04 Member: 166850Posts: 78Members
    awesome post OP alot of that was what I have in my own wall of suggestions I am creating. Great work!
    Where are the scorpions that hovar without flapping? -Smart_Bomb aka SaniK

    Join me on my Server: The Hovaring Scorpian!
    (Home of the Weekend Warriors)
  • Crumbling EgoCrumbling Ego Join Date: 2012-10-30 Member: 164692Posts: 52Members
    Personally, what would really enforce the asymmetrical nature of the two sides is having the alien commander, rather than placing down buildings, would be more of a guidance to the swarm. With the building of most structures given to the gorge, the Khamm would have control of the AI units. Where the Comm would focus on the Macro parts of RTS, the Khamm would focus on the Micro. The Gorge would build on the ground, while the Khamm would handle upgrades and unit management. To make this work, though, there would have to be more AI units on the alien side. Drifters and Babblers are a good start, but there need to be more.
  • BurdockBurdock Join Date: 2012-08-27 Member: 156553Posts: 202Members
    about 70% of that post was good stuff.... Please be nicer guy!
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