Welder

OutlawDrOutlawDr Join Date: 2009-06-21 Member: 67887Posts: 423Members
edited May 2012 in Ideas and Suggestions
Make it more viable
Currently when I have a welder and I see a marine that could use repairs on his armor, I ignore him.
Its too risky to switch to a welder, since you never know when you need to switch back in case of attack.

I liked it when you simply had to go up to a marine and press the use button. I would repair marines much often, since it was a quicker, less risky transaction.

I propose that if a marine has a welder, he simply needs to press the use button to repair marines and structures that need it.
It won't interfere with building structures since they are two different things that don't overlap.
I think the welder also needs to have its range increased a bit, since it seems im always just barely out of range while following a marine that needs repairs.

Marines can still equip the welder like now in case they are mass repairing multiple buildings (don't want to press the use button the whole time) or damaging alien structures.
It would be nice if you need repairs, and there is marine with a welder equipped in his hands, that an icon would appear over his head indicating he can repair you.

Small modest ideas.
Post edited by Unknown User on
...down by the river.

Comments

  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    This is a nice little suggestion that could improve the functionality of the game quite a bit.
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  • botchiballbotchiball Join Date: 2003-04-24 Member: 15810Posts: 560Members, Constellation
    I don't understand.. whats the difference between this suggestion and simply pushing "3" and then "1" when needed? In fact, if holding "E" will swap your weapon whenever you come in and out of range of welding, wouldn't it be more of a nuisance than anything else? Especially with the way someone can pop in and out of range of the welder as you pointed out. It would suck to want to switch to your primary when you just auto-switched to the welder.
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Posts: 694Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (OutlawDr @ May 7 2012, 11:05 AM) »
    I propose that if a marine has a welder, he simply needs to press the use button to repair marines and structures that need it.
    It won't interfere with building structures since they are two different things that don't overlap.


    It will however interfere with trying to use damaged Armouries and Prototype Labs, possibly even the Exo down the road. I agree with you on the marine icons, but they would have to be pretty unintrusive in case group situations such as marines in front of you suddenly taking damaged all at once.
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  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    He means that the welder would work the same way your omni-tool would work for building structures. You hold E it is brought out and used immediately, you let go of E and it's put back up and your main weapon is brought it immediately.
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  • ImbalanxdImbalanxd Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Posts: 1,803Members
    edited May 2012
    I'm pretty sure NS1 worked this way. If you had a welder and you pushed E on another player, your weapon disappeared for the duration of the weld. However it still worked as normal on any non player objects.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • OutlawDrOutlawDr Join Date: 2009-06-21 Member: 67887Posts: 423Members
    edited May 2012
    QUOTE (Arkanti @ May 7 2012, 01:44 AM) »
    It will however interfere with trying to use damaged Armouries and Prototype Labs, possibly even the Exo down the road.

    Thats a good point. You will just have to whip out the welder manually for those situations then. Not a big deal.

    QUOTE
    I agree with you on the marine icons, but they would have to be pretty unintrusive in case group situations such as marines in front of you suddenly taking damaged all at once.

    I think you read that wrong...the icon appears on players that have a welder equipped in their hands when you are missing armor. Its to let damaged players know when there is a marine with a welder that is willing to repair.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    ...down by the river.
  • internetexplorerinternetexplorer Join Date: 2011-10-13 Member: 127255Posts: 1,369Members
    edited May 2012
    Yeah, let's make it so marines can kill RTs twice as fast as skulks without putting down the rifle too. Changing weapons is a total bonerkill, man.

    Did you go to Hollywood Upstairs Game Design school too?
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • OutlawDrOutlawDr Join Date: 2009-06-21 Member: 67887Posts: 423Members
    QUOTE (internetexplorer @ May 7 2012, 06:42 PM) »
    Yeah, let's make it so marines can kill RTs twice as fast as skulks without putting down the rifle too. Changing weapons is a total bonerkill, man.

    Did you go to Hollywood Upstairs Game Design school too?

    Awesome verbal diarrhea champ.

    Now actually post something.
    ...down by the river.
  • bobrunbobrun Join Date: 2012-03-06 Member: 148235Posts: 39Members
    In another topic, somebody complained that nobody used welders. I just said that I hate buying a welder, because I like the axe, and I lose my axe when I buy a welder.

    But a welder button could be really nice. I could keep my axe and buy a welder.
  • internetexplorerinternetexplorer Join Date: 2011-10-13 Member: 127255Posts: 1,369Members
    edited May 2012
    QUOTE (OutlawDr @ May 7 2012, 07:55 PM) »
    Awesome verbal diarrhea champ.

    Now actually post something.


    Okay.

    The welder being a separate weapon is a deliberate design choice by the people who made the game. It forces an obvious tradeoff in how the welder is used. It's much easier to make it balanced than if the welder was available "as well as" the other guns, as per your idea.

    You have not explained in a reasonable way how it is an incorrect design decision, or a problem for the game. Your idea is predicated on the fact that you feel something is 'risky', while I would say it carries an appropriate level of risk (from my subjective view).

    Like most idea threads, it's based on your own frustration with playing an incomplete game. It will amount to nothing more than a tally chart (yea or nay), and a lot of irrational words will be written on the subject.

    Here, let me give an example:

    QUOTE (OutlawDr @ May 6 2012, 09:05 PM) »
    I think the welder also needs to have its range increased a bit, since it seems im always just barely out of range while following a marine that needs repairs.


    You think that the welder should have more range, since something "seems" a certain way to you. What is that something?
    It's "you're barely out of range while following a teammate". The teammate moves at the same speed you do (unless he's sprinting and you're not). You both share a communication medium, and if you want him to be welded the two of you can agree to meet up. Nothing about the game should change to help you with your "catching up to a person and clicking on them" problem.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • ArkantiArkanti pub baddie Join Date: 2011-07-22 Member: 111781Posts: 694Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (Champlo0 @ May 7 2012, 08:41 PM) »
    He means that the welder would work the same way your omni-tool would work for building structures. You hold E it is brought out and used immediately, you let go of E and it's put back up and your main weapon is brought it immediately.


    I know, I'm listing the issues that would arise with this function for interactive buildings.

    QUOTE (OutlawDr @ May 8 2012, 06:43 AM) »
    Thats a good point. You will just have to whip out the welder manually for those situations then. Not a big deal.


    That just unnecessarily convolutes the system, and you'd still be left with the proposed issue.

    QUOTE (OutlawDr @ May 8 2012, 06:43 AM) »
    I think you read that wrong...the icon appears on players that have a welder equipped in their hands when you are missing armor. Its to let damaged players know when there is a marine with a welder that is willing to repair.


    Ah in that case, it's even better of a suggestion. Something perhaps in their name tag that appears above them, as there is a lot of unused space in there as it stands.

    QUOTE (bobrun @ May 8 2012, 09:57 AM) »
    In another topic, somebody complained that nobody used welders. I just said that I hate buying a welder, because I like the axe, and I lose my axe when I buy a welder.

    But a welder button could be really nice. I could keep my axe and buy a welder.


    Tap 3 and then G, continue hacking away with your axe to your heart's content and pick the welder back up when you're done with it ;).
    Mr. Arkanti
    noGG Arkanti
    nova | Arkanti
    Pub Baddie

    Co_Summit - A remix of Summit's unique areas to mould it into a better Combat mod experience. I also broke all the textures. Mad skills yo.
    WildGrass Games - I make video games.
  • OutlawDrOutlawDr Join Date: 2009-06-21 Member: 67887Posts: 423Members
    edited May 2012
    Christ..I didn't think such a small idea would solicit such a angsty, nerd rage reply.

    QUOTE (internetexplorer @ May 7 2012, 07:51 PM) »
    Okay.

    The welder being a separate weapon is a deliberate design choice by the people who made the game. It forces an obvious tradeoff in how the welder is used. It's much easier to make it balanced than if the welder was available "as well as" the other guns, as per your idea.

    You have not explained in a reasonable way how it is an incorrect design decision, or a problem for the game. Your idea is predicated on the fact that you feel something is 'risky', while I would say it carries an appropriate level of risk (from my subjective view).


    Right...and in my subjective view, the risk associated in equipping the welder leads to what we see now of hardly anyone using the welder to repair marine armor. However when compared to past versions of the game that allowed welder with the use button, we saw a higher number of players repairing each others armor. Sorry... I don't have graphs and spreadsheets verifying this. You'll just have to take my word on it.

    QUOTE
    Like most idea threads, it's based on your own frustration with playing an incomplete game. It will amount to nothing more than a tally chart (yea or nay), and a lot of irrational words will be written on the subject.

    Here, let me give an example:

    You think that the welder should have more range, since something "seems" a certain way to you. What is that something?
    It's "you're barely out of range while following a teammate". The teammate moves at the same speed you do (unless he's sprinting and you're not). You both share a communication medium, and if you want him to be welded the two of you can agree to meet up. Nothing about the game should change to help you with your "catching up to a person and clicking on them" problem.


    Your example was a minor point in the op, but its an opinion I've seen and heard others express. If this minor point in the op amounts to no more than a tally, then so be it. Not sure if it was worth the emo rage bomb over it.
    Yes it "seems" like its always out of range when following a marine. Do I have proof? No. I'll be sure to get those graphs and spreadsheets next time. But If I were to guess why it seems like this, I'd say its latency. As you see a marine move hes actually a step or half step ahead as you follow...making him perpetually out of range. Whos knows though, I'm just presenting my opinion on the range to the devs, they can decide what do with it....but feel free to get angry about it....and Congratulations, you've earned it.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    ...down by the river.
  • OutlawDrOutlawDr Join Date: 2009-06-21 Member: 67887Posts: 423Members
    edited May 2012
    QUOTE (Arkanti @ May 7 2012, 08:36 PM) »
    That just unnecessarily convolutes the system, and you'd still be left with the proposed issue.
    Ah in that case, it's even better of a suggestion. Something perhaps in their name tag that appears above them, as there is a lot of unused space in there as it stands.
    Tap 3 and then G, continue hacking away with your axe to your heart's content and pick the welder back up when you're done with it ;).


    If it is determined to be too convoluted and hard to figure out for people then I don't have a problem not having the options for repairing buildings. Repairing marine armor was the focus anyway. A name tag could work just as well, however an icon would mirror the repair icon we see now when buildings and marines need repairs. It might be easier to for players to understand it as an icon, since they can associate it with the repair icon. I would hope eventually we can better customize what we take. Unless not being able to take an axe and a welder is a deliberate design choice by the people who made the game.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    ...down by the river.
  • YuukiYuuki Join Date: 2010-11-20 Member: 75079Posts: 1,731Members
    edited May 2012
    Welders are fine, we used them in scrims and they are efficient. They should increase the range a bit and make them droppable/picakble.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
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