<!--QuoteBegin--RabidWeasel+Oct 4 2003, 02:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RabidWeasel @ Oct 4 2003, 02:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Forlorn, the bind is for those who use the mousewheel to change weapons, where hud_fastswitch 1 makes no difference.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I was wondering why this wasn't making a difference. But the bind seems to be giving me grief as well.
Oh and yes I agree we need |2es \/\/hore's on the team, but the team <b>needs</b> to break down evenly. The reason all these people are "whining" is because it is not breaking down evenly. I think the breakdown should be like this, using a 12 player team as an Example.
(2) Saving up for ONOS. [Untill they are onii, count them in the skulk pool.]
(2) Early Fades. [Take down weak outposts / Take down elec structures.]
(2) Lerk. [Harrass lone marines / provide support to major attacks.]
(2) Skulks [Who stay skulks so they can parasite structures for reference and be fodder early game while Xeno-ing late game.
(4) Gorges. [One of which should follow any major attack from behind so that offensive aliens can run back and be healed. He may also set down some DC's / MC's / SC's out side the oupost/base being attacked for added benefit.
<!--QuoteBegin--|2ed |2ebel+Oct 4 2003, 11:29 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|2ed |2ebel @ Oct 4 2003, 11:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 6-8 RTs and a few kills and you'll have 50 res in no time. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> If the marines let the aliens get 6-8 rts, then they've already lost.
<!--QuoteBegin--sk84zer0+Oct 1 2003, 08:47 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (sk84zer0 @ Oct 1 2003, 08:47 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Fades early are good if the following applys... 1. Marines have a lot of electrified rts 2. If aliens have around 6 rts 3. If aliens have more than 1 gorge Or if the marines are just purely owning the aliens <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> + If you are a really badass fade, like most better players...
One fade with regen can wipe out a whole marine team if given the time and space... Fade is basically a skulk that dont die between laps...
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->the bind seems to be giving me grief as well<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I also find such binds troublesome to use, as the direction in which the wheel needs to be turned to move in a given direction through the wepon list seems to change frequently, which is why I reverted to using the number keys opposed to the theoretically superior mousewheel technique.
I just don't see the use of early-game fades/onos.
A couple of regen/adren lerks can take out those LA marines better than an acid-rocketless fade and bile-bomb gorges are better at getting those RTs. When it boils down to it, a team of hive-two aliens is a lot more valuable than a single fade. Hive two means a second upgrade, leap, bile bomb, and umbra for the low life-forms. The only time going fade instead of dropping a hive seems legit is when a: the hives are already taken, or b: you already have two hives and the third hive is pretty much just icing on the cake.
I really see no purpose at all for an early onos. They aren't the uber-race that can take on any heavily defended base alone. All they can really do is find rambos and gore them or find electrified RTs. Sadly, skulks are better at anti-rambo with their mobility and price and bilebombing gorges are better at anti-RT. For 100 res, you could easily drop a hive, three movement chambers, go gorge, then get adren/regen. Hell, skulks are even better anti-base at the start of a game since all of the TFs aren't electrified yet, and they can get behind that blindspot and nibble away.
Now think for a moment: How many times do you see people say "Saving for Onos" at the start of a game, and how many say "Saving for hive?" It's pretty obvious that everyone wants to be the killer.
<!--QuoteBegin--BOBDOLOL+Oct 4 2003, 03:20 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BOBDOLOL @ Oct 4 2003, 03:20 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--|2ed |2ebel+Oct 4 2003, 11:29 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (|2ed |2ebel @ Oct 4 2003, 11:29 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> 6-8 RTs and a few kills and you'll have 50 res in no time. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> If the marines let the aliens get 6-8 rts, then they've already lost. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Hah, very true.
<!--QuoteBegin--Nefilim+Oct 4 2003, 06:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nefilim @ Oct 4 2003, 06:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I just don't see the use of early-game fades/onos.
A couple of regen/adren lerks can take out those LA marines better than an acid-rocketless fade and bile-bomb gorges are better at getting those RTs. When it boils down to it, a team of hive-two aliens is a lot more valuable than a single fade. Hive two means a second upgrade, leap, bile bomb, and umbra for the low life-forms. The only time going fade instead of dropping a hive seems legit is when a: the hives are already taken, or b: you already have two hives and the third hive is pretty much just icing on the cake.
I really see no purpose at all for an early onos. They aren't the uber-race that can take on any heavily defended base alone. All they can really do is find rambos and gore them or find electrified RTs. Sadly, skulks are better at anti-rambo with their mobility and price and bilebombing gorges are better at anti-RT. For 100 res, you could easily drop a hive, three movement chambers, go gorge, then get adren/regen. Hell, skulks are even better anti-base at the start of a game since all of the TFs aren't electrified yet, and they can get behind that blindspot and nibble away.
Now think for a moment: How many times do you see people say "Saving for Onos" at the start of a game, and how many say "Saving for hive?" It's pretty obvious that everyone wants to be the killer. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh man, I couldn't disagree more. Seriously, so many games I've commed have been destroyed by one or two absolute monsters going fade and kicking the crap out of my marine teams, no matter what we do to try to stop them.
<!--QuoteBegin--Nefilim+Oct 4 2003, 06:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nefilim @ Oct 4 2003, 06:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> A couple of regen/adren lerks can take out those LA marines better than an acid-rocketless fade and bile-bomb gorges are better at getting those RTs. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I don't know about that. A <i>GOOD</i> fade will do WAY more damage than a a couple of lerks, imo. The fade will take down electrified rts and marine outposts, and completely own all LA lmg marines. And you also have to remember, a hive takes 3 minutes to build. Fades will take out those electrified rts way faster, and contain the rines much easier than lerks ever could.
We don't need res ****, we need intelligent team players.
A good fade or onos player who tells the team what he's doing, so the rest of us can ACT on it, is much better than some tard who hoards all his res and tells noone.
There's worlds of difference between the two, much like rambos and ninjas.
okay, it seems what some people are missing about early fade
an early fade, IF he is good, not only has the ability to harass - but completely disrupt marine movements anywhere, in addition to taking down res nozzles.
and while the fade is doing this (singlehandedly), it opens up the rest of the team to do what they need to do. much like how a marine pressuring team works in throwing the alien gameplan off-balance, the fade does the same thing, only singlehandedly.
remember that a fade can cover a map faster than any other unit, is more evasive in combat (slash with blink) than any other unit, can retreat and heal back to full health in ~15 seconds (without any support), can fly near-infinitely along the ceiling (think refinery hive) and heal (while marines continually continually shoot at a distraction).
played as a harasser class, the fade is far more effective than skulk (low life), lerk spores (just avoid them) or gorge; the fade is hard to kill, almost invincibly elusive, and a lethal threat to the marines
the things that a fade CAN do aren't easily measured by resources, or even kills - and as many NS players know, you can affect the game a lot without even getting a single kill.
above all, early fade is a risk - and like the better half of the most effective strategies in NS, reaps rewards if you don't lose on the gamble.
and hell, while the marines are all tied up, why not put up the second hive?
The point you miss is that GOOD FADES understand TEAMPLAY and let people know what they're doing. A competent fade who DOES NOT COMMUNICATE will not benefit his team, as they CANNOT ACT ON INFORMATION THEY DO NOT HAVE.
A good fade clears it with the team, lets them know what he's doing, goes fade, tells them he's harassing an area so that OTHER aliens, and gorges, can take advantage of that.
If he hoards silently, doesn't tell anyone he's fading, goes fade, and dies or harasses in SILENCE......... then he's a rubbish fade and he's doing the team no good. No matter how many kills he gets or how harassing he's being.
<!--QuoteBegin--RabidWeasel+Oct 4 2003, 03:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RabidWeasel @ Oct 4 2003, 03:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Forlorn, the bind is for those who use the mousewheel to change weapons, where hud_fastswitch 1 makes no difference. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Dude, no, hud_fastswitch 1 works with mousewheel as well, you cycle through your weapons instantly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->and hell, while the marines are all tied up, why not put up the second hive? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Exactly</b>. What most people fail to realize that hardcore teching on either side will most likely result in rapage unless you are dominating them.
Having 1-3 fades early on is crucial against a good marine team. After holding back the marines and crushing their outposts, you can then put up hives in the meantime.
Another huge misconception is that having 2 hives is nessesary to win the game. False. 2 hives are there for two reasons:
1. You didn't get D chambers first. You need D upgrades to win the game against any half-competant marine team. Period. 2. You need higher tech to cope with higher marine tech, such as JP/HA/HMG. Stompt and getting two upgrade chambers will make your team strong enough to cope with these abilites.
If you got D first, and the marine team doesn't have higher tech, then by all means get the fades to exploit their weaknesses. 2.
If a fade named NSPlayer goes fade you won't get much out of it. But someone like Frosty (best fade i've seen) will benefit the whole team <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Dude, no, hud_fastswitch 1 works with mousewheel as well, you cycle through your weapons instantly<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching.
Got a question for you all. If aliens were INTENDED to have such a highlevel of teamwork then why were they given individual res pools? With individual res pools comes freedom of choice. It's got nothin' to do with teamwork. Alien players act individually. They <i>can</i> do all the afermentioned "teamwork" thing like attacking from 5 directions and decoys and stuff but it is not required. The thing is, you can't deny the aliens design and their purpose - individuality. There is no way people could force others into spendin' their res/currency into doing something they do_not want to do or risk being banned. It's all fine and dandy if you're a marine coz you DO require teamwork but aliens are completely different.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Got a question for you all. If aliens were INTENDED to have such a highlevel of teamwork then why were they given individual res pools? With individual res pools comes freedom of choice. It's got nothin' to do with teamwork. Alien players act individually. They can do all the afermentioned "teamwork" thing like attacking from 5 directions and decoys and stuff but it is not required. The thing is, you can't deny the aliens design and their purpose - individuality. There is no way people could force others into spendin' their res/currency into doing something they do_not want to do or risk being banned. It's all fine and dandy if you're a marine coz you DO require teamwork but aliens are completely different. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Great point. But, one problem with the argument: you only covered the base of resource-spending. Aliens SHOULD be able to spend res on whatever they want... the lifeforms are perfectly balanced so that in most games, by endgame, you have a balanced mix of aliens (by the way, compliments to Flay for that detail!). Though, aliens cannot win the game without coordinated attacks. Granted, nobody should be forced to evolve to a certain species or a certain evolutionary trait, but they all should attack as a team.
There's nothing more satisfying that watching a team of fades die because not one, NOT ONE OF THEM would drop a chamber.
I suppose they just "chose" to lose the game? LMAO, if you think individual res means Army of Rambos then you've still not figured out the core strategy of NS.
Once you've gone gorge, then your resources are at the team's whim. A gorge is there to bring the team together and put down what the team needs.
And if nobody goes gorge, then your hive mind will pester you until you get yourself killed in a fit of madness. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--RabidWeasel+Oct 5 2003, 05:22 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RabidWeasel @ Oct 5 2003, 05:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Dude, no, hud_fastswitch 1 works with mousewheel as well, you cycle through your weapons instantly<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> For me, hud_fastswitch seems to be on for switching in one direction, but not the other (I can't remember which direction it works for). However, this is the case with hud_fastswitch set to 0 or 1. They are completely independent, apparently.
Me too. I have it set to 1, and when I do mouse down ( next weapon, I think), it cycles, but if I do mouse up, it just comes to the image of the next weapon and never selects it.
i dont mind much when people rush fade as long as they get the kills. what gets me worked up is when the team is vary short of res and someone goes fade and dosent play an active role ("protecting our hive" comes to mind)
basicly, if your team is lacking something thats important and you spend your money on whatever the team has a surplus of that people should be upset
<!--QuoteBegin--MrMojo+Oct 5 2003, 03:19 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MrMojo @ Oct 5 2003, 03:19 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Me too. I have it set to 1, and when I do mouse down ( next weapon, I think), it cycles, but if I do mouse up, it just comes to the image of the next weapon and never selects it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> This happened to me as well, however I checked my configs and found that mwheelup (or was it down?) was bound to impulse 1....
<!--QuoteBegin--RabidWeasel+Oct 5 2003, 06:22 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (RabidWeasel @ Oct 5 2003, 06:22 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Dude, no, hud_fastswitch 1 works with mousewheel as well, you cycle through your weapons instantly<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> It definatly works. Something's wrong on your end pal.
Also, hud_fastswitch doesn't switch to your knife for some reason, so if it only works for mwheeldown, then that's all you need, because it goes pistol/LMG only.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Also, hud_fastswitch doesn't switch to your knife for some reason, so if it only works for mwheeldown, then that's all you need, because it goes pistol/LMG only. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When using my mouse to scroll, I do bring up the knife, whether I am scrolling to the next weapon and it automatically comes up or I am scrolling to the previous weapon and have to click to select it.
I seriously think some of you guys are taking this way too seriously and personnally. Your also basically trying to force your opinions. We've got to stick to the facts here. Generally speaking, there is no right or wrong answer, and looking either way can cause a win. The way I see it is there is a happy medium. You cant go either way and expect to win. To think so is abit naive. You really need to constantly assess the situation and make an informed decisions based on what you know and WHAT YOUR TEAM KNOWS. Your team is important. You need them and they need you , more or less. The Fades/Oni fight the battles, the gorgs build infrastructure. It how it works. You cant neglect either. YOU CANT. And you cant argue otherwise. The idea is to find that very happy meduim where everyone has a role, knows what it is and/or knows what roles need to be filled. If your team is lacking gorgside its YOUR responciblity to fix it. Its YOUR responciblity to have the BALLS to think to yourself "hey, I hate gorging , but i also hate losing..." and do what you have to do. Now we cant make you take a hit for the team. We cant call the NS police and have them gang-rape you infront of your family or anything.
To quote Sun-Tzu "No plan ever survives execution." You cant form an idea about how these sort of things should be done and follow it to a 'T'. It usually wont work, you just have to be flexible and deal with it when you get there. To always res **** is completely lame. Do what you have to do , not what you want to do.
<!--QuoteBegin--Birdy+Oct 5 2003, 10:14 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Birdy @ Oct 5 2003, 10:14 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Really depends on who you playing with.
If a fade named NSPlayer goes fade you won't get much out of it. But someone like Frosty (best fade i've seen) will benefit the whole team <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I have to say... Birdy.. im touched *sniff*
Really i would love to see some players pick this up (other then me!!!) and start something moving throughout the alien loving community in NS. COME ON PEOPLE... if rines could standardise JP/HMG rushes in 1.0X WE CAN DO THIS!!!!
Yesterday i had a Game where i went Fade early (about minute 2 or 3) with def chamber as upgrade. I owned the hole Rine Base and killed about 30 Marines. All this was fine but the next Round nobody in the alien team spent their res in rt´s or something. Everybody saved for fade <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo--> and we lost the Game <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
So be carefull when you go early Fade and own not so much <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->
Comments
I was wondering why this wasn't making a difference. But the bind seems to be giving me grief as well.
Oh and yes I agree we need |2es \/\/hore's on the team, but the team <b>needs</b> to break down evenly. The reason all these people are "whining" is because it is not breaking down evenly. I think the breakdown should be like this, using a 12 player team as an Example.
(2) Saving up for ONOS. [Untill they are onii, count them in the skulk pool.]
(2) Early Fades. [Take down weak outposts / Take down elec structures.]
(2) Lerk. [Harrass lone marines / provide support to major attacks.]
(2) Skulks [Who stay skulks so they can parasite structures for reference and be fodder early game while Xeno-ing late game.
(4) Gorges. [One of which should follow any major attack from behind so that offensive aliens can run back and be healed. He may also set down some DC's / MC's / SC's out side the oupost/base being attacked for added benefit.
If the marines let the aliens get 6-8 rts, then they've already lost.
1. Marines have a lot of electrified rts
2. If aliens have around 6 rts
3. If aliens have more than 1 gorge
Or if the marines are just purely owning the aliens <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
+ If you are a really badass fade, like most better players...
One fade with regen can wipe out a whole marine team if given the time and space...
Fade is basically a skulk that dont die between laps...
I also find such binds troublesome to use, as the direction in which the wheel needs to be turned to move in a given direction through the wepon list seems to change frequently, which is why I reverted to using the number keys opposed to the theoretically superior mousewheel technique.
A couple of regen/adren lerks can take out those LA marines better than an acid-rocketless fade and bile-bomb gorges are better at getting those RTs. When it boils down to it, a team of hive-two aliens is a lot more valuable than a single fade. Hive two means a second upgrade, leap, bile bomb, and umbra for the low life-forms. The only time going fade instead of dropping a hive seems legit is when a: the hives are already taken, or b: you already have two hives and the third hive is pretty much just icing on the cake.
I really see no purpose at all for an early onos. They aren't the uber-race that can take on any heavily defended base alone. All they can really do is find rambos and gore them or find electrified RTs. Sadly, skulks are better at anti-rambo with their mobility and price and bilebombing gorges are better at anti-RT. For 100 res, you could easily drop a hive, three movement chambers, go gorge, then get adren/regen. Hell, skulks are even better anti-base at the start of a game since all of the TFs aren't electrified yet, and they can get behind that blindspot and nibble away.
Now think for a moment: How many times do you see people say "Saving for Onos" at the start of a game, and how many say "Saving for hive?" It's pretty obvious that everyone wants to be the killer.
If the marines let the aliens get 6-8 rts, then they've already lost. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Hah, very true.
A couple of regen/adren lerks can take out those LA marines better than an acid-rocketless fade and bile-bomb gorges are better at getting those RTs. When it boils down to it, a team of hive-two aliens is a lot more valuable than a single fade. Hive two means a second upgrade, leap, bile bomb, and umbra for the low life-forms. The only time going fade instead of dropping a hive seems legit is when a: the hives are already taken, or b: you already have two hives and the third hive is pretty much just icing on the cake.
I really see no purpose at all for an early onos. They aren't the uber-race that can take on any heavily defended base alone. All they can really do is find rambos and gore them or find electrified RTs. Sadly, skulks are better at anti-rambo with their mobility and price and bilebombing gorges are better at anti-RT. For 100 res, you could easily drop a hive, three movement chambers, go gorge, then get adren/regen. Hell, skulks are even better anti-base at the start of a game since all of the TFs aren't electrified yet, and they can get behind that blindspot and nibble away.
Now think for a moment: How many times do you see people say "Saving for Onos" at the start of a game, and how many say "Saving for hive?" It's pretty obvious that everyone wants to be the killer. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh man, I couldn't disagree more. Seriously, so many games I've commed have been destroyed by one or two absolute monsters going fade and kicking the crap out of my marine teams, no matter what we do to try to stop them.
I don't know about that. A <i>GOOD</i> fade will do WAY more damage than a a couple of lerks, imo. The fade will take down electrified rts and marine outposts, and completely own all LA lmg marines. And you also have to remember, a hive takes 3 minutes to build. Fades will take out those electrified rts way faster, and contain the rines much easier than lerks ever could.
A good fade or onos player who tells the team what he's doing, so the rest of us can ACT on it, is much better than some tard who hoards all his res and tells noone.
There's worlds of difference between the two, much like rambos and ninjas.
an early fade, IF he is good, not only has the ability to harass - but completely disrupt marine movements anywhere, in addition to taking down res nozzles.
and while the fade is doing this (singlehandedly), it opens up the rest of the team to do what they need to do. much like how a marine pressuring team works in throwing the alien gameplan off-balance, the fade does the same thing, only singlehandedly.
remember that a fade can cover a map faster than any other unit, is more evasive in combat (slash with blink) than any other unit, can retreat and heal back to full health in ~15 seconds (without any support), can fly near-infinitely along the ceiling (think refinery hive) and heal (while marines continually continually shoot at a distraction).
played as a harasser class, the fade is far more effective than skulk (low life), lerk spores (just avoid them) or gorge; the fade is hard to kill, almost invincibly elusive, and a lethal threat to the marines
the things that a fade CAN do aren't easily measured by resources, or even kills - and as many NS players know, you can affect the game a lot without even getting a single kill.
above all, early fade is a risk - and like the better half of the most effective strategies in NS, reaps rewards if you don't lose on the gamble.
and hell, while the marines are all tied up, why not put up the second hive?
And most arent.
The point you miss is that GOOD FADES understand TEAMPLAY and let people know what they're doing. A competent fade who DOES NOT COMMUNICATE will not benefit his team, as they CANNOT ACT ON INFORMATION THEY DO NOT HAVE.
A good fade clears it with the team, lets them know what he's doing, goes fade, tells them he's harassing an area so that OTHER aliens, and gorges, can take advantage of that.
If he hoards silently, doesn't tell anyone he's fading, goes fade, and dies or harasses in SILENCE......... then he's a rubbish fade and he's doing the team no good. No matter how many kills he gets or how harassing he's being.
<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo-->
Dude, no, hud_fastswitch 1 works with mousewheel as well, you cycle through your weapons instantly.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->and hell, while the marines are all tied up, why not put up the second hive? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<b>Exactly</b>. What most people fail to realize that hardcore teching on either side will most likely result in rapage unless you are dominating them.
Having 1-3 fades early on is crucial against a good marine team. After holding back the marines and crushing their outposts, you can then put up hives in the meantime.
Another huge misconception is that having 2 hives is nessesary to win the game. False. 2 hives are there for two reasons:
1. You didn't get D chambers first. You need D upgrades to win the game against any half-competant marine team. Period.
2. You need higher tech to cope with higher marine tech, such as JP/HA/HMG. Stompt and getting two upgrade chambers will make your team strong enough to cope with these abilites.
If you got D first, and the marine team doesn't have higher tech, then by all means get the fades to exploit their weaknesses.
2.
If a fade named NSPlayer goes fade you won't get much out of it.
But someone like Frosty (best fade i've seen) will benefit the whole team <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching.
If aliens were INTENDED to have such a highlevel of teamwork then why were they given individual res pools?
With individual res pools comes freedom of choice. It's got nothin' to do with teamwork. Alien players act individually. They <i>can</i> do all the afermentioned "teamwork" thing like attacking from 5 directions and decoys and stuff but it is not required.
The thing is, you can't deny the aliens design and their purpose - individuality. There is no way people could force others into spendin' their res/currency into doing something they do_not want to do or risk being banned.
It's all fine and dandy if you're a marine coz you DO require teamwork but aliens are completely different.
aliens with no teamwork/ communicaton will usually lose.
aliens with good teamwork/ comunication will usually win.
really... it be this simple.
If aliens were INTENDED to have such a highlevel of teamwork then why were they given individual res pools?
With individual res pools comes freedom of choice. It's got nothin' to do with teamwork. Alien players act individually. They can do all the afermentioned "teamwork" thing like attacking from 5 directions and decoys and stuff but it is not required.
The thing is, you can't deny the aliens design and their purpose - individuality. There is no way people could force others into spendin' their res/currency into doing something they do_not want to do or risk being banned.
It's all fine and dandy if you're a marine coz you DO require teamwork but aliens are completely different. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Great point. But, one problem with the argument: you only covered the base of resource-spending. Aliens SHOULD be able to spend res on whatever they want... the lifeforms are perfectly balanced so that in most games, by endgame, you have a balanced mix of aliens (by the way, compliments to Flay for that detail!). Though, aliens cannot win the game without coordinated attacks. Granted, nobody should be forced to evolve to a certain species or a certain evolutionary trait, but they all should attack as a team.
I suppose they just "chose" to lose the game? LMAO, if you think individual res means Army of Rambos then you've still not figured out the core strategy of NS.
And if nobody goes gorge, then your hive mind will pester you until you get yourself killed in a fit of madness. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
For me, hud_fastswitch seems to be on for switching in one direction, but not the other (I can't remember which direction it works for). However, this is the case with hud_fastswitch set to 0 or 1. They are completely independent, apparently.
basicly, if your team is lacking something thats important and you spend your money on whatever the team has a surplus of that people should be upset
This happened to me as well, however I checked my configs and found that mwheelup (or was it down?) was bound to impulse 1....
Might be the same problem for you...
I JUST tested this on my PC and it definitely doesn't work for me. I need to use a script for instantaneous mousewheel weapon switching. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
It definatly works. Something's wrong on your end pal.
Also, hud_fastswitch doesn't switch to your knife for some reason, so if it only works for mwheeldown, then that's all you need, because it goes pistol/LMG only.
When using my mouse to scroll, I do bring up the knife, whether I am scrolling to the next weapon and it automatically comes up or I am scrolling to the previous weapon and have to click to select it.
To quote Sun-Tzu "No plan ever survives execution." You cant form an idea about how these sort of things should be done and follow it to a 'T'. It usually wont work, you just have to be flexible and deal with it when you get there. To always res **** is completely lame. Do what you have to do , not what you want to do.
If a fade named NSPlayer goes fade you won't get much out of it.
But someone like Frosty (best fade i've seen) will benefit the whole team <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I have to say... Birdy.. im touched *sniff*
well may i point to my thread in the karaa strat forums?
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=21&t=47463' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...ST&f=21&t=47463</a>
Really i would love to see some players pick this up (other then me!!!) and start something moving throughout the alien loving community in NS. COME ON PEOPLE... if rines could standardise JP/HMG rushes in 1.0X WE CAN DO THIS!!!!
and we lost the Game <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo-->
So be carefull when you go early Fade and own not so much <!--emo&;)--><img src='http://www.natural-selection.org/forums/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif'><!--endemo-->