Mandatory shadows+Rich infestation

[email protected]N@uralBornNoobist Gorge-N-Freeman,2Gorges1Clog Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176138Members Posts: 137 Advanced user
edited September 2014 in NS2 General Discussion
Will we ever see shadows+Rich infestation being changed to non optional values?

Aliens=better stealthing,ambushing etc. "infestation=running along floors= more cover" "shadows=obvious cover"
Marines=more flashlight useage, less sneaky marines via having to have your light on...unless you eat ALOT of carrots.

With these off...significant advantages apply? + less dynamic gameplay?

Maybe ns3 will be darker...more gritty...less forgiving.

As the game stands...might as well have grey textured walls everywhere...just as good to hide in. "apart from textures where skulks are 50% camoed"

I know its a bit late to be "hoping" for "core" gameplay changes...LESS FPS NOW! I DEMAND IT!

Critical criticisms, fan boyz need not apply.


2nd topic, I used to play a game called Darkest Hour "ww2" they incorporated camera shake "judders" when bullets were flying past/striking the ground near them, very realistic. Clearly this would lead to unbalance...how much do teeth chomping shake a marines POV>? "not to say fade swipes/onos movements wouldnt = camera shake.

Pointless stuff all this...I totally get it. I am 1 view...not necessarily the hands down...final say...just things to consider?

Post edited by [email protected] on
MuckyMcFly
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Comments

  • Dictator93Dictator93 Join Date: 2008-12-21 Member: 65833Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 657 Fully active user
    In a few years when people dont have horrible low end PCs, yes IMO this should be necessary.
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    I have a pretty good pc, and I still keep shadows off because I gain a bunch of fps.
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • [email protected]N@uralBornNoobist Gorge-N-Freeman,2Gorges1Clog Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176138Members Posts: 137 Advanced user
    edited September 2014
    STOP ADJUSTING THE GAMMA ON YOUR MONITOR! gamma hax.

    not even valves anti cheat BAN HAMMER can stop that.

    looking at a white screen...sure if it gives me 5 more headshots per spawn.
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts Posts: 2,829 admin
    -I first turned off Atmospherics because the other marine's flashlights pissed me off. Why the hell does it look like that by default???
    -Later, I turned off Bloom, because Lava Falls... seriously WTF? You can't see ANYTHING back between the falls if you have bloom on.
    -Finally, I turned off high infestation... because I can only blink into an infestation-covered wall so many times before I realize that's not the small opening 2 feet away I thought it was.
  • simbasimba Join Date: 2012-05-06 Member: 151628Members Posts: 191 Fully active user
    I have played other games where this kind of thing was tried to be forced for all players. The problem is that many of these effects are generated by custom graphics card operations that can be toggled on and off from outside the game, in say nvidia settings. Also, players can always adjust their own gamma and other settings as well.

    Some players will do these things and have huge advantages. It's undetectable and unenforceable. So instead of having only a few people with the right hardware having the good settings, just let everyone do it. Unless this becomes an arcade game where the hardware and software are packaged together.
  • MoFo1MoFo1 United States Join Date: 2014-07-25 Member: 197612Members Posts: 728 Advanced user
    While it is annoying (and in a way cheating) to adjust settings simply to make it easier to spot enemies, it is sort of necessary for some people to turn certain things down/off in order to get the game running smoothly... For example on my old GFX card I had to keep most of the graphics turned down/off to get over 60fps. Force people with weaker PC's to have stuff on and you could potentially drive them away... which is the last thing we need considering how small this community is already.

    Plus the real problem isn't minimal infestation or lack of shadows, it's the lame rejects who tweak their monitor and gfx card settings in order to make it so they can see aliens (especially through level 3 cloak) so easily it's as if they were highlighted... Which unfortunately you can't do anything about, so just laugh at how pathetic they are.


    I personally would just be happy if they could fix the rich infestation so it was somehow "smart" enough to not block off certain things like vent openings. If they did I'd set it back to rich in a heartbeat.
    lwfBeigeAlertArthurDent
  • lwflwf Join Date: 2006-11-03 Member: 58311Members, Constellation Posts: 486 Fully active user
    Rich infestation has anticompetitive properties (see a previous rant) and shadows are too expensive. At least they were, I couldn't use them due to the performance hit, but I know they're different now because they look a lot nicer. Hopefully they run faster too, because they used to be terrible... But even then I suspect too many players are already struggling too much with their FPS anyhow.

    So no, it's not viable to do this to NS2, it is however entirely possible to have a server enforce mandatory settings if there's a demand for it.
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind you Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Members Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    If the game had been more optimized (though UWE performed very well for their first game engine) then this would be worth considering.

    In reality, this argument is probably not worth considering.
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


    ArthurDent
  • Dictator93Dictator93 Join Date: 2008-12-21 Member: 65833Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 657 Fully active user
    Shadows are a wholly in engine implementation/ in game setting (Nvidia drivers cannot turn them off or anything). Not every game allows players to wholly turn off shadows.

    If the cvar were locked, you could not turn them off no matter what you did.

    To get at the point why I think it should one day be mandatory is because it has obvious competitive advantages. In the eventuality of life and this game's future people will/should have PCs which can run the game with shadows on and get 60 fps or above. Easily.

    While more graphical Cvars are great, I really dislike the idea of graphical cvars offering different inherent competitive advantages. There should be a baseline or everyone IMO (not now, in the future)

  • RapGodRapGod Not entirely sure... Join Date: 2013-11-12 Member: 189322Members Posts: 799 Fully active user
    No. My computer will explode.
    Don't ever ''get ban''.

    Respect - Justice

    If my posts don't make sense, blame it on my bipolar and carry on. It happens.
    AurOn2ArthurDent
  • PoNeHPoNeH Join Date: 2006-12-01 Member: 58801Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester Posts: 184 Advanced user
    Did he really just mention NS3? Yeah... that's gonna happen.
    RapGod
  • SebSeb Melbourne, AU Join Date: 2013-04-01 Member: 184576Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Retired Community Developer Posts: 514 mod
    Dumbest thread. Infestation is different client to client so that just eliminates that one right off the bat. I don't understand why people feel the need to whine about being disadvantaged to people that have different settings than them. You can turn off/on those settings as well? You can't seriously claim that because YOU WANT to play with rich infestation that means that its unfair if everyone else uses minimal. What is happening to these forums...
    AnzestralbonageAurOn2elodea
  • d0ped0gd0ped0g Join Date: 2003-05-25 Member: 16679Members Posts: 782 Advanced user
    I'm pretty sure it's a troll/joke thread:
    STOP ADJUSTING THE GAMMA ON YOUR MONITOR! gamma hax.

    not even valves anti cheat BAN HAMMER can stop that.

    looking at a white screen...sure if it gives me 5 more headshots per spawn.

    See... Surely this isn't serious.

    AurOn2
  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 1,551 Advanced user
    edited September 2014
    Infestation bubbles could be kept consistent across machines without additional communication-based load by using seeded RNG to determine their position and size rather than the total randomness they currently use.
    Technically it's quite possible.
    Post edited by meatmachine on
    Too weird to live, yet too rare to die
    VetinariUncleCrunchMrFangs
  • [email protected]N@uralBornNoobist Gorge-N-Freeman,2Gorges1Clog Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176138Members Posts: 137 Advanced user
    edited September 2014
    Spotting skulks adds another dimension in terms of skill level "not just...oh look a skulk around the corner"...in the corner...lets get creative with camp spots.

    Just because you dont want to spot skulks...50% of the other people might find this adds to the dynamics of the game.

    Every1 knows the flashlight is op...too stronk...skulks eyes glow with anger, 5 dps trickle dmg.

    Neoken...oh you...you know too much. the Keeper of justice+everything wholesome. Agreed though...I had my 5 minutes of fun.

    kibosh time.
  • NeokenNeoken Bruges, Belgium Join Date: 2004-03-20 Member: 27447Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Playtester Posts: 1,305 Advanced user
    Close this one already. 8-}
    ArthurDent
  • OtsOts Join Date: 2003-07-30 Member: 18577Members, Constellation Posts: 780 Fully active user
    I would like mandatory shadows on my browser so these kind of topics would look better than they actually are.
    AurOn2caperp
  • soccerguy243soccerguy243 Join Date: 2012-12-22 Member: 175920Members, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 515 Advanced user
    i used to try to hide in the infestation.. until i learned people were turning it to minimal...
  • RaZDaZRaZDaZ Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167331Members, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 465 Fully active user
    edited September 2014
    Troll thread but its still relevant in some cases.

    If you even have the most basic of comprehension in regards to competitive games like NS2 and Starcraft, unless you gain some sort of advantage for having higher settings that don't compromise performance too much, ALWAYS SET YOUR GRAPHICS TO MINIMUM. Resolution is debatable, many play at 1080 but I play at 900 and some even lower. More FPS is always better and is extremely important especially if your computer is not top of the range.

    When you watch pro Quake players, they always have minimum settings. Even with maximum they would be able to pull over 200fps but minimum simplifies the design of the environment and weapons, explosions don't block your view and everything is crystal clear in order to properly aim at your opponent.

    When you watch pro Starcraft players, again they always have minimum because that FPS and clarity are so important but also, minimum has extra benefits like being able to see moving cloaked units easier.

    Same applies to NS2, I quite often turn my flashlight on even in lit up rooms, makes it a little easier to spot skulks where one corner but might be a bit darker kinda like mineshaft, it's just something I've done since the beginning (although I do know when to turn it off) and people complain about it and I always respond "Why in gods name do you have atmospherics on?"

    Spotting skulks in corners is not even 1% of this game so that argument is irrelevant.

    TL;DR - Unless your PC is godlike and if it provides you with an advantage, increased settings should never be used unless maybe resolution.
    NS2 ID: RaZDaZ
    Old School AvP2 Vet
    ArthurDent
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind you Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Members Posts: 1,684 Advanced user
    edited September 2014
    sebb wrote: »
    Dumbest thread. Infestation is different client to client so that just eliminates that one right off the bat. I don't understand why people feel the need to whine about being disadvantaged to people that have different settings than them. You can turn off/on those settings as well? You can't seriously claim that because YOU WANT to play with rich infestation that means that its unfair if everyone else uses minimal. What is happening to these forums...

    It is? Well just another reason for us to remake infestation =P
    When life gives you lemons, throw it back and demand chocolate.


  • SebSeb Melbourne, AU Join Date: 2013-04-01 Member: 184576Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, WC 2013 - Silver, Retired Community Developer Posts: 514 mod
    coolitic wrote: »
    sebb wrote: »
    Dumbest thread. Infestation is different client to client so that just eliminates that one right off the bat. I don't understand why people feel the need to whine about being disadvantaged to people that have different settings than them. You can turn off/on those settings as well? You can't seriously claim that because YOU WANT to play with rich infestation that means that its unfair if everyone else uses minimal. What is happening to these forums...

    It is? Well just another reason for us to remake infestation =P
    Well, the bubbles and breathing are, not the spread I'm pretty sure.
    AurOn2elodea
  • [email protected]N@uralBornNoobist Gorge-N-Freeman,2Gorges1Clog Join Date: 2012-12-24 Member: 176138Members Posts: 137 Advanced user
    edited September 2014
    Was just conversing with Steve Jobs blueprint in Topo vents, he condems such opposing opinions..I hope all of you drop your iphone 6's down the crevice on summit.

    In all seriousness...I guess its not such a big deal.
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    Was just conversing with Steve Jobs blueprint in Topo vents, he condems such opposing opinions..I hope all of you drop your iphone 6's down the crevice on summit.

    In all seriousness...I guess its not such a big deal.

    Regardless of this thread, drop those iphones into crevice :stuck_out_tongue::smiley:
    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • RapGodRapGod Not entirely sure... Join Date: 2013-11-12 Member: 189322Members Posts: 799 Fully active user
    Can someone please ban this guy, or at least jail him.
    Don't ever ''get ban''.

    Respect - Justice

    If my posts don't make sense, blame it on my bipolar and carry on. It happens.
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver Posts: 3,466 Advanced user
    Neoken wrote: »
    Close this one already. 8-}

    formerly known as F0rdPrefect

    I am good Onos
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 4,771 Advanced user
    Neoken wrote: »
    Close this one already. 8-}

    From my perspective UWE has been trying to both with what little resources they have given to the game. They don't have an AAA budget, let alone an indie game budget. They have the budget of a game that has been out 6 years. I want to say, don't half ass two things, whole ass one thing. I just don't think they have the resources to do it. Unlike many of the people on the forums, I guess I am just happy they are at least trying even though I may not like what they end up doing.
  • TurbineTurbine Join Date: 2012-09-13 Member: 159160Members Posts: 172 Fully active user
    Hell no, not until the performance is actually half decent.

    Not everybody lives in the US or mainstream markets, I had to buy my laptop overseas from Australia for $200 just to get an nVidia 670MX and an i7 3630QM, blu-ray & 120hz monitor, 12gb ram, etc... And I still have to play it on low, maps have perform differently too. My desktop I need a new video card to replace its AMD 6670 as I've only upgraded the rest of it so far.

    At the end of the day, NS2 looks like rubbish on these settings and runs worse than far more impressive games, such as Skyrim.
    ArthurDentAurOn2
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