The pre BT fade was ridiculous. Even I could own happily all day long in any pub server with that fade, and that was back when I'd had only a handful of competitive hours of NS2. It was so easy for anyone with even a modicum of skill that it desperately needed the changes it got. The present incarnation of the fade still has a very high skill ceiling - I'm not sure that anyone has actually reached it yet - I've certainly seen some unbelievable moves, but it is more fragile and less of an unkillable lightning tank that it was back during the shadowstep movement days. Yes, of course fades died back then, but they were undeniably much more forgiving to play than they are now, at pretty much every level, too. The fade ball was a real thing, and it indicated that there was a problem.
I'm sure we'd all secretly and selfishly love to have that fade back just for ourselves, but @mattk50 you have to recognise how broken it was, and how even relatively low skilled players were able to dominate with it as long as they didn't overextend massively.
I still miss shadowstep as an option. Would rather metab relegated to a skill-slot-only-skill and have SS back on shift when researched.
I always had this personal fantasy (and I bet you guys do too ) of fades having SS/blink as optional, a stylistic choice. Something they either evolve, or simply the comm must research SS or Blink at the hive for 10 tres or something nice and cheap.
I still miss shadowstep as an option. Would rather metab relegated to a skill-slot-only-skill and have SS back on shift when researched.
The situation where I really miss SS is when fighting Exos, especially in confined places. Together with the Exo buff, and the Vortex-Stab combination removed, the Fade-vs-Exo balance is now too much in favor of the Exo IMO.
It's Super Effective!Join Date: 2012-08-28Member: 156625Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
edited August 2014
I we were to compare PRES values and gameplay role, then technically the Onos should be on par with an Exo not a Fade, and let's be honest, even the Exo isn't entirely on par with Onos anyways.
I still miss shadowstep as an option. Would rather metab relegated to a skill-slot-only-skill and have SS back on shift when researched.
The situation where I really miss SS is when fighting Exos, especially in confined places. Together with the Exo buff, and the Vortex-Stab combination removed, the Fade-vs-Exo balance is now too much in favor of the Exo IMO.
So we have a subtle Exo buff? Sounds fine to me, really
Metabolize in NS1 was crazy strong, much stronger than this one - it had no cooldown and no attack delay so you could literally hold it down mid-combat and switch back right at the moment of swiping. This one feels more fair since you have to be careful about your timing in combat or you'll miss a swipe, and if you mismanage your energy you can't use it to save yourself from an empty bar. It would be perfect if you could hold Shift to use it continuously, since watching the cooldown manually feels tedious. Also, just remove it from the weapon selection because the weird hacky auto-weapon-switch thing that it does when you press Shift has messed up for me a few times.
twilitebluebug stalkerJoin Date: 2003-02-04Member: 13116Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
edited August 2014
Advanced Metabolize feels very boring for an alien "ability upgrade". Rather than being an additional useful ability, it is effectively minimal additional Regen upgrade for the Fade alone.
Although Ad. Metabolize works and feels balanced, and helps to reduce the Fade's dependence on Crag and Shift hive upgrades (with Fade being a creature affiliated with the Shade tech tree), the removal of both late game Fade movement abilities (ShadowStep & Vortex) undermined the Fade's unique identity and possible fun skill "combo"s.
Look at UT's and Tribes' range of unique weapon and abilities. NS2 needs more exciting weapons and attacks, not more boring, albeit "balanced" ones.
Advanced Metabolize feels very boring for an alien "ability upgrade". Rather than being an additional useful ability, it is effectively minimal additional Regen upgrade for the Fade alone.
It's primary benefit is the energy regen if I am interpreting it correctly- it's there so your time spent engaging marines is limited by your HP, and if you're low on energy but have full health you don't have to find a shift/hive/ wait ages for energy to regen, you can just pop round the corner, metab, and carry on fighting until you take a meatshot or two to the face
I still miss shadowstep as an option. Would rather metab relegated to a skill-slot-only-skill and have SS back on shift when researched.
The situation where I really miss SS is when fighting Exos, especially in confined places. Together with the Exo buff, and the Vortex-Stab combination removed, the Fade-vs-Exo balance is now too much in favor of the Exo IMO.
So we have a subtle Exo buff? Sounds fine to me, really
Would be true if exos already had problem fighting fades.
Skulks are the big doodoo.
AurOn2COOKIES! FREEDOM, AND BISCUITS!AustraliaJoin Date: 2012-01-13Member: 140224Members, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Forum staff
@coolitic
One of them is twice as dangerous as a single frackin onos. onos big - easy to hit. skulk small, fast, hard to hit with perfect hit rego - let alone ns2 hit rego (insert hitreg complaint here - im only going on memory)
Im looking forward to seeing @meatmachine in action with Metabolize. Better start practicing my aim.
Haha this made me laugh. Anyone remember when @meatmachine called himself the best mechanically-skilled fade in the game, directly to Fana on these forums? Those were good times.
It would be perfect if you could hold Shift to use it continuously, since watching the cooldown manually feels tedious.
I've used Metabolize by holding Shift (not having to tap it) and it kept regenerating my energy back to full. o.O I was surprised when this happened since all I've read on the forums was the need to spam it.
It would be perfect if you could hold Shift to use it continuously, since watching the cooldown manually feels tedious.
I've used Metabolize by holding Shift (not having to tap it) and it kept regenerating my energy back to full. o.O I was surprised when this happened since all I've read on the forums was the need to spam it.
This doesn't work for me, I need to release and press shift again. However, just holding M1 with attack 2 automatically repeats it... :-?
I'd say both way should work just by holding, as you'd never use it like this in combat anyway. Outside of combat, being forced to tap a key is just annoying without adding any gameplay depth.
Although I have to say that Blink-traveling is becoming an exercise on its own: Hold/tap shift (metabolize) + control (crouch for smaller collision box) + W, and on top of that, use A/D as needed... 8-} Good thing we have five fingers, right?
It would be perfect if you could hold Shift to use it continuously, since watching the cooldown manually feels tedious.
I've used Metabolize by holding Shift (not having to tap it) and it kept regenerating my energy back to full. o.O I was surprised when this happened since all I've read on the forums was the need to spam it.
This doesn't work for me, I need to release and press shift again. However, just holding M1 with attack 2 automatically repeats it... :-?
I'd say both way should work just by holding, as you'd never use it like this in combat anyway. Outside of combat, being forced to tap a key is just annoying without adding any gameplay depth.
Although I have to say that Blink-traveling is becoming an exercise on its own: Hold/tap shift (metabolize) + control (crouch for smaller collision box) + W, and on top of that, use A/D as needed... 8-} Good thing we have five fingers, right?
I think the crouch thing was removed quite a few patches ago.
Im looking forward to seeing @meatmachine in action with Metabolize. Better start practicing my aim.
Haha this made me laugh. Anyone remember when @meatmachine called himself the best mechanically-skilled fade in the game, directly to Fana on these forums? Those were good times.
Well, I'm glad you got a laugh out of that, even if the actual intended humour of the statement went completely over your head :P
Comments
I'm sure we'd all secretly and selfishly love to have that fade back just for ourselves, but @mattk50 you have to recognise how broken it was, and how even relatively low skilled players were able to dominate with it as long as they didn't overextend massively.
I always had this personal fantasy (and I bet you guys do too
Hey look, its Coolitic jr. Keep preachin brother. Keep preachin.
So we have a subtle Exo buff? Sounds fine to me, really
Come up with something better than Metabolize for Fade because atm as far as good feedback is concerned - you're doing a fucking horrible job.
Although Ad. Metabolize works and feels balanced, and helps to reduce the Fade's dependence on Crag and Shift hive upgrades (with Fade being a creature affiliated with the Shade tech tree), the removal of both late game Fade movement abilities (ShadowStep & Vortex) undermined the Fade's unique identity and possible fun skill "combo"s.
Look at UT's and Tribes' range of unique weapon and abilities. NS2 needs more exciting weapons and attacks, not more boring, albeit "balanced" ones.
I was wondering when people would make the reference.
Would be true if exos already had problem fighting fades.
Skulks are the big doodoo.
The skulks mobility, small size, and dps actually makes 2-3 of them almost/as dangerous as an onos to the exo, depending on the circumstances.
It also isn't too uncommon to see a skulk successfully 1v1 an exo. (then again, the exo shouldn't be by itself =P)
One of them is twice as dangerous as a single frackin onos. onos big - easy to hit. skulk small, fast, hard to hit with perfect hit rego - let alone ns2 hit rego (insert hitreg complaint here - im only going on memory)
Well, it would be fun seeing a flying piggy in the air, vomiting bile from the front and farting spores at the back. Carpet bombing deluxe.
Haha this made me laugh. Anyone remember when @meatmachine called himself the best mechanically-skilled fade in the game, directly to Fana on these forums? Those were good times.
I'd say both way should work just by holding, as you'd never use it like this in combat anyway. Outside of combat, being forced to tap a key is just annoying without adding any gameplay depth.
Although I have to say that Blink-traveling is becoming an exercise on its own: Hold/tap shift (metabolize) + control (crouch for smaller collision box) + W, and on top of that, use A/D as needed... 8-} Good thing we have five fingers, right?
I think the crouch thing was removed quite a few patches ago.
edit: No, wait, that only was for bullets, right?
8-|