Give the game away free (not f2p)

ns2isgoodns2isgood Join Date: 2013-04-16 Member: 184847Members
edited May 2014 in NS2 General Discussion
Not sure if anyone saw, but Red Orchestra 2 recently did a very cool thing last week. They gave away their game entirely free for a day on a Thursday. If you redeemed a copy that day, it's free for you forever. After the free day ended, they put the game immediately on a free weekend promo and sale Friday-Sunday. It was a brilliant move.

The hype it generated from being free carried over into the weekend promo to help promote it and push sales. It was all over a bunch of blogs, websites, reddit, etc. It stayed a trending game the entire weekend. The game went on to break it's peak concurrent player count during this promotion. Tripwire went on to later say "bloody hell" about the entire event, so it sounds like it was a huge success. If you haven't noticed, L4D2 also did a similar promotion earlier this year in which Tripwire copied. Seems like it may be a new marketing strategy.

I think this would have been an awesome move if they had done it with the Kodiak update, but the sale and DLC update barely generated any new players when looking at steamcharts.

Check it out - http://www.pcgamesn.com/tripwire-sum-results-red-orchestra-2-steam-giveaway-bloody-hell

ps: red orchestra 2 was in a very similar position like ns2 with the struggling playerbase

1o2dt42.jpg
«1

Comments

  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    The game has been given away for free* many of times.

    Right before the game released everyone who had pre-ordered before the Steam release was given a free gift copy for whatever purpose. The game had a few free weekends, and even was a part of a humble bundle so people got it for $1. Plus Tripwire had a big dlc expansion for people to buy into during the weekend so it isn't exactly comparable.
  • NezzyNezzy UK Join Date: 2014-01-08 Member: 192789Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    There is no doubt that this massively has boosted the playerbase I do not understand how you can say that, if we could potentially achieve something that RO2 has managed in the last week then it would be simply amazing.
    The only thing I can see is the fact that NS2 has a much steeper learning curve than RO2.
  • ns2isgoodns2isgood Join Date: 2013-04-16 Member: 184847Members
    edited May 2014
    The game has been given away for free* many of times.

    No, it hasn't.
    Right before the game released everyone who had pre-ordered before the Steam release was given a free gift copy for whatever purpose.

    That's not free upfront. Someone has to spend money to get a free copy. And it was a pre-order incentive/promotion to help push pre-order sales.
    The game had a few free weekends, and even was a part of a humble bundle so people got it for $1.

    Free weekends won't get you much exposure, that's the whole point of this marketing tactic as the one outlined in the OP. Being on a free weekend of humble bundle isn't going to give you front page articles on IGN, Joystiq, Gamespot, PC World, Game Informer, PC Gamer, etc all on the same day. It was literally on every major gaming publication on the web.
    Plus Tripwire had a big dlc expansion for people to buy into during the weekend so it isn't exactly comparable.

    First off, it wasn't "big" it's 1 DLC with a few maps and weapons. Second off, the DLC content is free to everyone just like NS2, you just don't have all the weapons unlocked on the maps. You can play all the DLC maps in RO2 with the stock rifle which is the best weapon anyways. So it's very comparable, silly.
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    ns2isgood wrote: »
    First off, it wasn't "big" it's 1 DLC with a few maps and weapons. Second off, the DLC content is free to everyone just like NS2, you just don't have all the weapons unlocked on the maps. You can play all the DLC maps in RO2 with the stock rifle which is the best weapon anyways. So it's very comparable, silly.

    It's not comparable because the DLC isn't all cosmetic stuff, it's already completely different. Unless the weapons all had the same stats which you said they didn't, then game balance would be changed because of it regardless if the weapons are even considered useless.
  • ns2isgoodns2isgood Join Date: 2013-04-16 Member: 184847Members
    edited May 2014
    ns2isgood wrote: »
    First off, it wasn't "big" it's 1 DLC with a few maps and weapons. Second off, the DLC content is free to everyone just like NS2, you just don't have all the weapons unlocked on the maps. You can play all the DLC maps in RO2 with the stock rifle which is the best weapon anyways. So it's very comparable, silly.

    It's not comparable because the DLC isn't all cosmetic stuff, it's already completely different. Unless the weapons all had the same stats which you said they didn't, then game balance would be changed because of it regardless if the weapons are even considered useless.

    I think you might be confusing the words identical and comparable. I also never said anything about weapon stats, but sure!
  • RapGodRapGod Not entirely sure... Join Date: 2013-11-12 Member: 189322Members
    Exactly the same and close to the same?!
  • Goliath VietnamGoliath Vietnam Join Date: 2013-01-07 Member: 178080Members
    UWE >> Small Studio (not company) , if they give too many Free Copies >>> They will die because .... Natural Selection you know ? Food chain :D

    TripwareInteractive >>> Know with famous Killing Floor and Rising Storm as you know >>> Medium size company with lots $$$$$ , they can easily marketing --- give away to atract players on Facebook , Youtube :))

    Its not "The Same" like you think , try to creat something and sell it for people , you will see it hard >>> Big fish eat small fish >> Big company eat small studio ( Activision >> Sledgehammer MW3 , InfinityWard MW2..vv)
  • BensonBenson Join Date: 2012-03-07 Member: 148303Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Might be a good idea.

    I wouldn't imagine that too many copies of NS2 are still being sold, so an infusion of players might actually cause more copies to be sold.

    It might be even better to do something like this closer to when the Subnautica beta opens to attract more players to UWE as a whole (if there is even going to be one)
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    ns2isgood wrote: »
    Not sure if anyone saw, but Red Orchestra 2 recently did a very cool thing last week. They gave away their game entirely free for a day on a Thursday. If you redeemed a copy that day, it's free for you forever. After the free day ended, they put the game immediately on a free weekend promo and sale Friday-Sunday. It was a brilliant move.

    Yes it seems like a brilliant thing to do if you're trying to get people to play your game no matter the cost... instead of you know... trying to eat every day.
  • dragonmithdragonmith Join Date: 2013-02-04 Member: 182817Members, Reinforced - Diamond
    This also happened for Left 4 dead 2. Does anyone remember that? While it causes a small stir for a bit, numbers still die down :(
    Also, didn't NS2 go to Humble Bundle twice?

    Let's see what direction they go for Subnautica too (who can say what the tide will bring).

  • GrissiGrissi Join Date: 2003-08-28 Member: 20314Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    More players that play the game > more sales > more monies.
    Less players in that play the game > less sales > no monies.
    = Do something to to increase the playerbase and then maintain it so word by mouth sells the game. If announced correctly this could be a really good idea.
  • BensonBenson Join Date: 2012-03-07 Member: 148303Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    dragonmith wrote: »
    This also happened for Left 4 dead 2. Does anyone remember that? While it causes a small stir for a bit, numbers still die down :(
    Also, didn't NS2 go to Humble Bundle twice?

    Let's see what direction they go for Subnautica too (who can say what the tide will bring).

    I sea what u did there.
  • CalegoCalego Join Date: 2013-01-24 Member: 181848Members, NS2 Map Tester
    I remember Valve doing something like this for Portal 1 one weekend. A few weeks later Portal 2 went on sale (genius marketing). It's not the same but I get the idea.
  • It's Super Effective!It's Super Effective! Join Date: 2012-08-28 Member: 156625Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    Just for the sake of brainstorming and theorycrafting...

    On the ever so popular topic of "NS2 and F2P" to what extent should NS2 go F2P?

    From the last few responses that I've seen from the UWE team, it's generally revolved around, "X effort in, max revenue out" which is understandable because they are a small team, time and resources are limited, and they ARE a business that operates to generate profit.

    This topic has been stirring in my mind for a while too so here's how I see possible directions.

    The easiest effort vs. profit path might simply be... have steam nix (remove) the price. NS2 = Free on Steam, forever.

    Similar to this topic OP, the revenue would have to come from Reinforcement, Kodiak, whatever DLC comes in the future.

    A bold risk, all the advantages and consequences come with that move. Could have a massive surge of players (of varying quality) who knows how long they'll stay, and generate enough demand of community content creators to continue down this path.
    Or it could just end up being a failed desperate act, as a few other topics have mentioned, this maximizes the audience NS2 can get, but only to the limited extent of issues that prevent/deter these new players from staying. (Learning Curve, Performance, Niche of Game)

    The much harder, but more profitable, would be the proper F2P system that almost every F2P game out there trends towards. This would include:
    - Progression System (NS2 kind of has this with HIVE levels)
    - Robust Matchmaking (more managable with more players I would suspect)
    - In-game store to purchase...skins, etc.
    - ( * ) In-game "credits" to unlock permanently/rent for X days variations of weapons earn able by completing games (X amount of credits for win, less for loss) encouraging players play their hardest.

    Of course this might mean we might have to remove the option to choose a team and force players to play each side once? (Man that would be long, and most people don't time for that)

    * By variations, I'm referring to stock weapons in games like Planetnet Side 2, Nosgoth, League of Legends that have variations of their stock weapons/heroes to appeal to different player styles. Example, we have NS2 Marine stock rifle and one that shoots slower, but harder, perhaps one that shoots in bursts, one that has higher capacity, but less damage? That would take a hell of a time to balance, but would give people reason to spend those in-game credits.

    Also, we all want to avoid the "pay to win" model, but it is possible, PS2 does an excellent job of this, but they took a while to do it, also they designed the game around F2P, making NS2 transition to this extreme level of perfect F2P would be very hard, almost like making entirely a new game.

    I don't think anyone here is an expert on how these systems work, and I'm sure that my post here has plenty of flaws or have issues of how it may or may not work for NS2, relax, these are simply my observations. Perhaps UWE could go the simple route, and gradually implement portions of a more robust system as we have already seen attempts.

    I am also realize that even though I write this post today, we should all know that UWE is working on Subnautica, and I fully don't expect them to even consider any of this until Subnautica is nearing completion. We all love NS2, but have respect for that. I would be surprised if we got a response to this trending topic.
  • BeigeAlertBeigeAlert Texas Join Date: 2013-08-08 Member: 186657Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    Not to mention, when Subnautica is finally release, surely there will be a little bump up for NS2. Not huge, considering they're wildly different genres, but still something at least.
  • ritualsacrificeritualsacrifice Join Date: 2012-11-14 Member: 171148Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited May 2014
    I think this could be a pretty good idea. I stopped playing on public servers for awhile because the community was so toxic. I know that's ironic coming from me, but I'm generally pretty well behaved in-game and usually try and help people learn. I recently got a few friends into the game for the first time, and they're loving it. I had a bunch of friends who bought the game at release, then uninstalled because of performance issues. I've convinced most of them to reinstall too, and they've been loving it. I think the community is in a pretty good place right now to accept a wave of noobs. Especially if there's an announcement made ahead of time letting us know, like there has been in the past.
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind you Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Members
    edited May 2014
    I would like to say no to this.

    In NS2's case it would be more like getting a free game but they probably wouldn't play it immediately (kind of like not playing games you get from steam sales). Since they wouldn't be too hyped to play it ASAP, they probably wouldn't give too much hype to people they know.
  • meatmachinemeatmachine South England Join Date: 2013-01-06 Member: 177858Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Supporter
    Ironhorse kinda hit the nail on the head. It's a good idea, but only if we add some tar to the slippery slope for newbies.
  • RadimaXRadimaX Join Date: 2013-02-05 Member: 182840Members
    last patch was all cosmetics apart from lokis epic map offcourse but i can still see where UWE is going...
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver
    I think if you want to go F2P, make sure the ingame purchases don't affect gameplay in any way except visually. Even if the weapons might be mathematically the same, as @ISE suggest - please not. While it's not pay2win, it will surely generate uproar because someone has a "better" rifle.
  • LocklearLocklear [nexzil]kerrigan Join Date: 2012-05-01 Member: 151403Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, WC 2013 - Shadow
    As I mentioned before.. people that generally play F2P games run games on a potato.

    NS2 does not really run that well on a potato :P
  • VetinariVetinari Join Date: 2013-07-23 Member: 186325Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver
    Locklear wrote: »
    As I mentioned before.. people that generally play F2P games run games on a potato.

    NS2 does not really run that well on a potato :P

    You don't have to run your potato on 1.1V, you know.
  • RaZDaZRaZDaZ Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167331Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited May 2014
    It really is not easy trying to sell a multiplayer only FPS without f2p on PC and for most, is a quick way to ensure financial failure. NS2 players are arguably only still around because of NS1. Loyal fans and hardcore fans that can't find any other alternative with a stable playerbase. How many multiplayer shooters have flourished on PC lately? Very few and even fewer that are A) multiplayer only and B) not F2P.

    The game struggles to get higher than 500-600 player concurrently even during peak times AFTER a minor DLC patch?! I know I'm of the minority on these forums but this game will continue to trickle and lose players if there is no future plan here. Either going F2P, a big sale that coincides with marketing or a free weekend or even as mentioned, a free game for a day or this community will be reduced to nothing but the hardcore players. That might be favorable to some but certainly not to all. Almost all the big sales and free weekends have coincided with a DLC patch that was buggy as hell.

    The free day/free weekend type concept only works with what @IronHorse has mentioned. If UWE can't find the time to enhance the tutorial with advanced stuff like alien movement then may I suggest asking a community modder to take a look at this? I don't know the logistics of game development but this is certainly something to consider if it is possible.

    The playerbase is at the moment, very slowly but surely reducing in size. It might be stable for the next year or so but down the line, it could become very dangerous. I only hope there's a plan and I hope combat is a big success but I very much doubt that.
  • xXxFRoDOxXxSwAGGiNsxXxFRoDOxXxSwAGGiNs USA Join Date: 2014-05-04 Member: 195800Members
    As @RaZDaZ and @Ironhorse have said, tutorials would go a long way to helping rookies acclimate themselves with the game. With UWE saying they don't want to spend any more man-hours on NS2, I think it's going to be up to a modder to do this, then have it be rolled out in the next official patch (hopefully sometime in June to coincide with Steam's summer sale). It'sSuperEffective (unsure of how to tag him because of the ' and spaces) has been, to my knowledge, the most prolific person who is producing tutorial videos for NS2. I wonder if he would mind creating some more videos for beginners, or at least be amicable to UWE using some of his videos in the video tutorial section. However, I think we need training levels to supplement those training videos, because the movement in NS2 really does take some getting used to. Perhaps some more advanced levels can even help experienced players with their movement.

    Not throwing players into an NS2 game with no idea of what's going on would go a long way to improve the retention rate I think. Since, judging by the Reinforced thread, we won't be seeing more performance optimizations any time soon, this is probably our next best option to keeping new players in the game. Hopefully someone at UWE is taking note of these suggestions @hugh @SteveRock @flayra
  • NordicNordic Long term camping in Kodiak Join Date: 2012-05-13 Member: 151995Members, NS2 Playtester, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Supporter, Reinforced - Silver, Reinforced - Shadow
    I wish we had more players, but we never drop below this magical 500 players that never leave. I really don't think we will drop below that. If we dropped to 250 I think the game would just spiral down to a true death with only a couple dozen people.
  • SteveRockSteveRock Join Date: 2012-10-01 Member: 161215Members, NS2 Developer, Subnautica Developer
    As @RaZDaZ and @Ironhorse have said, tutorials would go a long way to helping rookies acclimate themselves with the game. With UWE saying they don't want to spend any more man-hours on NS2, I think it's going to be up to a modder to do this, then have it be rolled out in the next official patch (hopefully sometime in June to coincide with Steam's summer sale). It'sSuperEffective (unsure of how to tag him because of the ' and spaces) has been, to my knowledge, the most prolific person who is producing tutorial videos for NS2. I wonder if he would mind creating some more videos for beginners, or at least be amicable to UWE using some of his videos in the video tutorial section. However, I think we need training levels to supplement those training videos, because the movement in NS2 really does take some getting used to. Perhaps some more advanced levels can even help experienced players with their movement.

    Not throwing players into an NS2 game with no idea of what's going on would go a long way to improve the retention rate I think. Since, judging by the Reinforced thread, we won't be seeing more performance optimizations any time soon, this is probably our next best option to keeping new players in the game. Hopefully someone at UWE is taking note of these suggestions @hugh @SteveRock @flayra


    I guess we didn't do a job of communicating this (apparently), but there is a basic interactive tutorial in there along with videos by...guess who? It'sSuperEffective! Yes, he made all the "tip videos" that are in there now.

    More advanced tutorial levels to focus on things definitely would be cool, but yeah, at this point it needs to be up to the community and SamusDroid basically.
  • cooliticcoolitic Right behind you Join Date: 2013-04-02 Member: 184609Members
    @RaZDaZ, plenty of multiplayer-only games are not f2p and go quite well. I have never played NS1 before but still stick with NS2. This game has also been out for quite some time, so it's a bit normal that player count is how it is. For example, Crysis Warhead has been around since 2008 yet it still had enough servers with a good-enough amount of players (unfortunately, gamespy is shutting down and so is it's multiplayer).
  • SaltlickSaltlick Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177347Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Just look at the charts and compare: RO2, NS2. All I can see is that there is no magic bullet to increase the playerbase, but occasionally giving it out for free does provide temporary bumps. That said, please don't make it F2P. It would dilute everything I love about this game.
  • RaZDaZRaZDaZ Join Date: 2012-11-05 Member: 167331Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited May 2014
    @SteveRock I knew about the tutorial I even did it myself but that's nice to hear from a developer, thank you. I do love ISE's contribution to NS2 and the community, it is nothing short of amazing but when people play games, unless they understand what they are getting into (and assuredly, most don't when it comes to NS2), very few are going to pay attention to them. As much as I love ISE, the videos do not ease the learning curve for most players and that can be said for many guides in any game. You can watch a boss fight tutorial in World of Warcraft all you want but you won't get better without doing it yourself and most people in NS2 don't get that far.

    In psychology, the best way to actually learn something and improve is to actually do it yourself, applying experience and knowledge to a practical setting. Just as in a professional environment, actual first-hand experience is key rather than an instruction booklet/video telling you what to do. An instructional process that directly involves and places an individual in a practical and sometimes stressful situation is the most effective way in this regard. A video showing someone how to skulk hop is largely useless compared to an actual fleshed out tutorial in-game. This isn't the only variable at play I know but I can logically assume, it is a large confounding variable in player retention and teaching.

    @coolitic I don't argue that there aren't any non-f2p multiplayer only games that are successful, what I specifically stated was shooters are going to have a harder time and although I didn't specify what type, I mean more competitive shooters like NS2. Most successful shooters particularly on PC that are successful and are multiplayer only like TF2, CS, etc are also funded and marketed by large developers or already have a large established legacy such as Quake Live or other variables such as ARMA2's success due to DayZ. How many indie studios do you know that are considered huge successes in regards to shooters of this model? I'm not saying NS2 is not a success, it already is as the development of SubNautica is evident of that but it certainly is not flourishing or growing at this point in time and from what I see, it is slowly dying.

    Searching steam top 100, I can't find a single shooter there that is A) multiplayer only and B) not F2P. Some games are currently on sale or recent sales so not an entirely accurate representation but even if the results were confounding in some way, there is still support for this argument. Yes I'm aware not every game is on steam.

    I'm not asking that NS2 become the next MOBA in terms of success but having a decent selection of servers, a continuously refreshing playerbase and not seeing those player numbers drop month after month might not be so depressing. I came from AvP2, never heard of NS1 before I found NS2 on steam (didn't bother much with HL mods) but the 1000 hours I've spent the past year and a half have been nothing short of amazing, I would just love this game to grow rather than slowly wither away.

    I personally don't have much patience after instructing and 'dealing' with rookies during sales to the point where I just get burnt out and I just want an organised game, going F2P or sale day isn't my idea of having fun and certainly doesn't directly benefit me (terrible I know but I'm not rude to new players). I'm thinking long term but if F2P or a small marketing campaign that coincides with a free sale day/free weekend is something that can increase the games longevity at the expense of more hardcore and organised play? Sign me up.

    I hope NS2 Combat Standalone is a great success, I would love indie paid multiplayer shooters to thrive and affect the market but I don't see it anywhere at the moment.

    What people 'THINK' what is best for them sometimes (from a long-term and developer PoV) is not always what is best for them.
Sign In or Register to comment.