Bring back old AV and make it the default... Then make the current default vision the optional vision choice.
This way 95% of the time people will be using the default vision, and the optional vision has situational uses (is there a shadow to hide in, is there a hole in this window...)
I used the old standard vision a lot more then this new puke inducing vision...
Why was it changed when there was nothing wrong with it in the first place?
so that you are forced to appreciate the artwork
so that you are forced to see people's costumes
because gameplay is secondary to these things
what about:
so that you are given the option to see the game in full colour, without massively gimping yourself by not having hive sight/marine highlight.
that could mean increasing the utility of the one and not decreasing the utility of the other.
but apparently UWE design team thinks that the art is more important than the gameplay.
AV was so fundamental to effective alien play, that that one change alone could swing the Alien/marine balance. it is not something you change in the midst of 1000 other balance changes and additions. I don't feel like the designers have a great understanding balancing.
@biz the levels are pretty, my black armour is sweet, and when your wall jumping at speed 11 you can't appreciate any of it.. Next nerf alien speed so they have time to stop and smell the roses... After that spores/fade vision/GL spam must go...
There is a time and place to appreciate the artistic details, when I'm skulking trying to get that next bite is not the time
I am NOT thinking "wow this guy has that deluxe visor, man they did a good job".
I was thinking "die @&$& die ahahah". Now I'm thinking
Now I'm thinking "where'd he go?" Or "I'm blind oh it hurts turn off the lights"
After I got my input lag problem finally sorted (well actually the input still feels a bit weird), I ran into the other obstacle the new pathces have introduced, which is the new AV.
Generally aliens are moving a lot faster than marines, so everything becomes a blur and it becomes hard to distinquish separate moving objects from the background.
This illusion of speed is further enhanced by the size of skulks: the closer you are to the ground the faster it seems to be moving. Also the skulk FOV is so small that jumping marines now have even easier time evading skulks at their feet.
Maybe I'm just spoiled with the old, high-contrast AV, but I think that the thin orange outline just isn't enough. This is probably the biggest nerf the aliens have seen in a while.
I would love the old alien vision back. I loved the style of it. Also i think it's not bad that aliens had the advantage with old alien vision. Marines can attack from a distance. Aliens have to come close which is allready a disadvantage.
What i really hate about the new one is that when power is off in eastwing for example then there is still light in the hallway which hurts my eyes. Also when someone umbra's you it get much harder to see since it's so bright.
I really hope there are a lot of old alien visions servers a.s.a.p.
Also this is a really interesting video by UWE where they experiment with the alien vision:
Also, the old alien vision could also be a upgrade (shade hive).
If devs want us to use the new AV maybe an idea could be to remove specular while activate. A more flat/unlit render could make the image more easy to read. Actually, the only think that make me fell bad when I try to play with it is the shininess of the material making the game noisy and really difficult to understand.
Also, some people with chromatic deficiency, kind of color blindness (a friend is), just cant see what is front or what is back which it wasn't the same before cause of the depth Z usage.
NS2 Alien View Mode Experiments: “That looks so cool looking, we have to figure out way to put that in there.” This is the kind of thinking that is destroying game play. Also testing these kinds of things out on maps that are for combat anyone.
Literally just made an account specifically to say this
I used to play NS2 fairly frequently and came back because of the new Reinforcement hoopla. New alien vision is 100% garbage. Completely worthless in absolutely every sense. It completely blinds the user and subjects aliens to actually being nearly as blind as marines are in the dark. Marines are reduced to unnoticable orange outlines that blend in with all the other orange/yellowish outlines of the rest of the screen. At least with normal vision, the orange outline sometimes contrasts with the palette of the map. In alt-vision? It only serves to make everything blend together, which is absolutely retarded for a race devoted to fast paced 3 dimensional melee combat
And before anyone spews such retardation as "well the original vision was OP," the entire point is that a melee-centric race should have excellent vision, because that's how they orient themselves during the crazy wall-bounding maneuvers required to compete with marine ranged capabilities. The new outlines in normal vision are.. quaint, nice even, but a far cry from the excellent contrast old alt alien vision had
I sincerely hope they change it back, because it is godawful right now
The biggest issue for me is the strain on my eyes when trying to play alien.
- With AV off the speed I am moving at makes it hard to focus intently on environment surroundings.
- With AV on I can spot the marines easier, but my eyes are getting hammered by the brightness constantly...even with no enemies in sight.
This also makes it incredibly hard to continually switch between the two modes to try to get the best of both worlds.
For me personally, I can't run around with AV off constantly because I miss marines too easily when I'm travelling around. I also can't run around with it on all the time because after a few minutes my eyes are straining. I can't flick between the modes because the negatives of either side just make it not worth switching. It's like I have to choose to have it on 24/7 or off 24/7.
The biggest problem is:
AV on is WAY too hard on the eyes. I don't even play with my monitor/in-game settings that high in terms on brightness. It's just after looking at a fully-lit, bright orange screen with occasional bright white halos on it for a few minutes I can't go back to AV off. After 1 round as aliens I'm also ready to shut the game down for awhile, lie back and close my eyes.
If the changes were made for aesthetic reasons then there has to be a happy medium where you don't hurt a players enjoyment of the game just to show them map detail. One of the older AV mods I used before it got canned from the regular servers I played on was awesome. Still showed details but was much easier on the eye. I ended up removing the mod because I wanted to get used to playing under set conditions across every server but I have a screenshot:
Comparison My old modded AV Current AV
If the changes were made to show of the maps, make the contrast darker. If the changes were made to make AV viable in a specific circumstance then this isn't how it should be. You can't flick between the modes every 30 seconds because it's too jarring. There has to be another way to make AV not a 24/7 ON feature if that was the goal. Maybe reduce draw distance, have a 'adjustment' feature where switching on and off takes a few seconds to acclimatise or a few seconds to adjust between lights ON/OFF/EMERGENCY. Something!
I hate the new alien vision so much. It's disorientating when moving about quickly, marines are not easy enough to see in long dark halls, it's colour scheme is unpleasant to the eyes (and that's in the dark) and I'm sick of having to flick it on and off every 10 seconds depending on the part of the map I am in. Make it go away already!
Someone earlier in the thread said its the same for marines and flashlights. I disagree. In my experience marines turn on their flashlights, and leave them on, even in bright rooms. (Unless they have cranked their gamma way up, or are using some kind of wall hack or texture hack/mod) Only time you turn it off is when sneaking through a vent to not give your self away. There isn't really much of a downside to flashlights in lit rooms.
I don't care about looking at "artwork" I see that when I play as marine.
I don't think I'm going to be playing aliens until it's put back the way it was.
I think this is primarily about the colour. Choose green or blue with the same functionality would make the difference. I think it's about how the orange is unpleasant to the brain (psychology!)
I think this is primarily about the colour. Choose green or blue with the same functionality would make the difference. I think it's about how the orange is unpleasant to the brain (psychology!)
yeah, i'm pretty UWE is getting a kickback from the world ophthalmology society or something.
Generally aliens are moving a lot faster than marines, so everything becomes a blur and it becomes hard to distinquish separate moving objects from the background.
I know the answer. Always blur free CRT ..
I never liked old alian vision (ofc people like it cos its a way easier to see marines) and don't like new one. I was forced to use old alien vision because normal vision was too hard to see. Finally normal vision is great for aliens (like old huze alien vision) and I dont need to use "AV".. Well we need only alien vision tab to chose your right one or make it thru workshop (not the best idea but for public)..
Generally aliens are moving a lot faster than marines, so everything becomes a blur and it becomes hard to distinquish separate moving objects from the background.
I know the answer. Always blur free crt ..
I never liked old alian vision (ofc people like it cos its a way easier to see marines) and don't like new one. I was forced to use old alien vision because normal vision was too hard to see. Finally normal vision is great for aliens (like old huze alien vision) and I dont need to use "AV".. Well we need only alien vision tab to chose your right one or make it thru workshop (not the best idea but for public)..
NO the normal alien vision is not good now! It is absolutely horrible. Fine if you want to see the textures and clutter, go for it. But for God's sake give the rest of us the option of a simplified, clear screen. Without that option available, comp play will be completely dreadful.
Not liking the new alien bile vision myself, i like the hightlighted outline in normal vision mode, maybe a little buff to the outlines would be sweet but i have done away with the alien vision mode altogether its terrible. Every time i turned it on other than my eyes bleeding i am expecting to be Tango'd at any given moment.
Some one on another thread suggested replacing the alien vision with a kind of scent trail, givin that the aliens are predators this sounds like a great way to go, just be a little more creative instead of using some horrible orange filter.
Generally aliens are moving a lot faster than marines, so everything becomes a blur and it becomes hard to distinquish separate moving objects from the background.
I know the answer. Always blur free crt ..
I never liked old alian vision (ofc people like it cos its a way easier to see marines) and don't like new one. I was forced to use old alien vision because normal vision was too hard to see. Finally normal vision is great for aliens (like old huze alien vision) and I dont need to use "AV".. Well we need only alien vision tab to chose your right one or make it thru workshop (not the best idea but for public)..
NO the normal alien vision is not good now! It is absolutely horrible. Fine if you want to see the textures and clutter, go for it. But for God's sake give the rest of us the option of a simplified, clear screen. Without that option available, comp play will be completely dreadful.
Yeah, it's not like marines have to deal with all that clutter and textures...
Current AV could use a color and contrast change, but if they revert it, they might as well make it the default vision given how most people use it. There was literally no downside to using old AV and UWE could literally have painted all the aliens orange and most people wouldn't have noticed.
Not everyone cant agree with my opinion. If someone is colorblind (some of my friends are) its even harder get the right one. Thats why option tab would be great..
i hated AV before the update, because it literally made alien "RED MEANS GO, GREEN MEANS NO DERP HERP". but i can't say i like the new AV better since the update - because i only ever use it like 1% of the time in the pitch black vent/rooms. the rest of the time i find it totally unnecessary and bad contrast compared to the simple orange 'cell shaded' outline. in that sense i can sympathise with complaints... on a whole i prefer patch AV purely because of that orange outline.
on a slightly unrelated note... has marine flashlight been changed/nerfed? i play with slightly optimized graphics settings, but the flashlight only seems to go about 3 metres now - almost impossible to see aliens without room power.
And this is why players are screaming and ranting, at least 75% of the players hate the new alien vision flashlight but UWE won’t change it back due to “oh we will make you look at how pretty the game is.”
UWE removed hive sight for the alien commander when marines were walking on creep. UWE removed the cloaking ability from drifters. UWE made drifters expensive as fuck so they are no longer a viable means to detect marines. So this means aliens have to be constantly be roaming looking for marines and many times they will be in areas where the power was never built so the lights are always on.
Because of this there should be NO downside to using the alien flashlight otherwise the sensory aspect which should fall under the aliens as a plus actually falls under the marines.
Finally fixed my lag issues and got to play a real match. Wow. I mean I know I said in my last comment that I liked the fact that aliens could now be played with vision off, but the orange outline is just a mess especially when multiple marines, aliens, or structures are also in the field of view. Its a complete mindf--k of squiggly lines that make tracking a b--ch. When flamethrowers and explosions made there appearance it went from "mindf--k" to "why even bother"?
Aliens just are not fun to play anymore at all which is why I loved the game in the first place. Terrible.
If you can run the game in DX11 + maxed settings, try disabling Bloom.
I think the enhanced AV (the 2nd mode) looks much better that way, more contrast.
Comments
This way 95% of the time people will be using the default vision, and the optional vision has situational uses (is there a shadow to hide in, is there a hole in this window...)
I used the old standard vision a lot more then this new puke inducing vision...
what about:
so that you are given the option to see the game in full colour, without massively gimping yourself by not having hive sight/marine highlight.
that could mean increasing the utility of the one and not decreasing the utility of the other.
but apparently UWE design team thinks that the art is more important than the gameplay.
AV was so fundamental to effective alien play, that that one change alone could swing the Alien/marine balance. it is not something you change in the midst of 1000 other balance changes and additions. I don't feel like the designers have a great understanding balancing.
There is a time and place to appreciate the artistic details, when I'm skulking trying to get that next bite is not the time
I am NOT thinking "wow this guy has that deluxe visor, man they did a good job".
I was thinking "die @&$& die ahahah". Now I'm thinking
Now I'm thinking "where'd he go?" Or "I'm blind oh it hurts turn off the lights"
guess I must try harder next time
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=174450196
That is a known issue.
I have tinkered with alien vision. For those who like the theme of the new alien vision can test it here:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=174440948
Generally aliens are moving a lot faster than marines, so everything becomes a blur and it becomes hard to distinquish separate moving objects from the background.
This illusion of speed is further enhanced by the size of skulks: the closer you are to the ground the faster it seems to be moving. Also the skulk FOV is so small that jumping marines now have even easier time evading skulks at their feet.
Maybe I'm just spoiled with the old, high-contrast AV, but I think that the thin orange outline just isn't enough. This is probably the biggest nerf the aliens have seen in a while.
I would love the old alien vision back. I loved the style of it. Also i think it's not bad that aliens had the advantage with old alien vision. Marines can attack from a distance. Aliens have to come close which is allready a disadvantage.
What i really hate about the new one is that when power is off in eastwing for example then there is still light in the hallway which hurts my eyes. Also when someone umbra's you it get much harder to see since it's so bright.
I really hope there are a lot of old alien visions servers a.s.a.p.
Also this is a really interesting video by UWE where they experiment with the alien vision:
Also, the old alien vision could also be a upgrade (shade hive).
No. Now that the surroundings aren't tinted green anymore, the marines have like a camouflage effect applied to them at all times.
BTW if you think there are no drawbacks, I guess you wouldn't mind if they brought back the old AV as the second mode?
Also, some people with chromatic deficiency, kind of color blindness (a friend is), just cant see what is front or what is back which it wasn't the same before cause of the depth Z usage.
(sorry for my English)
2. Use whatever alien vision mod you want from workshop
3. Profit
Yes, that would be an improvement. It's got good contrast and doesn't blind me. Id even take the music with it.
“That looks so cool looking, we have to figure out way to put that in there.” This is the kind of thinking that is destroying game play. Also testing these kinds of things out on maps that are for combat anyone.
I used to play NS2 fairly frequently and came back because of the new Reinforcement hoopla. New alien vision is 100% garbage. Completely worthless in absolutely every sense. It completely blinds the user and subjects aliens to actually being nearly as blind as marines are in the dark. Marines are reduced to unnoticable orange outlines that blend in with all the other orange/yellowish outlines of the rest of the screen. At least with normal vision, the orange outline sometimes contrasts with the palette of the map. In alt-vision? It only serves to make everything blend together, which is absolutely retarded for a race devoted to fast paced 3 dimensional melee combat
And before anyone spews such retardation as "well the original vision was OP," the entire point is that a melee-centric race should have excellent vision, because that's how they orient themselves during the crazy wall-bounding maneuvers required to compete with marine ranged capabilities. The new outlines in normal vision are.. quaint, nice even, but a far cry from the excellent contrast old alt alien vision had
I sincerely hope they change it back, because it is godawful right now
- With AV off the speed I am moving at makes it hard to focus intently on environment surroundings.
- With AV on I can spot the marines easier, but my eyes are getting hammered by the brightness constantly...even with no enemies in sight.
This also makes it incredibly hard to continually switch between the two modes to try to get the best of both worlds.
For me personally, I can't run around with AV off constantly because I miss marines too easily when I'm travelling around. I also can't run around with it on all the time because after a few minutes my eyes are straining. I can't flick between the modes because the negatives of either side just make it not worth switching. It's like I have to choose to have it on 24/7 or off 24/7.
The biggest problem is:
AV on is WAY too hard on the eyes. I don't even play with my monitor/in-game settings that high in terms on brightness. It's just after looking at a fully-lit, bright orange screen with occasional bright white halos on it for a few minutes I can't go back to AV off. After 1 round as aliens I'm also ready to shut the game down for awhile, lie back and close my eyes.
If the changes were made for aesthetic reasons then there has to be a happy medium where you don't hurt a players enjoyment of the game just to show them map detail. One of the older AV mods I used before it got canned from the regular servers I played on was awesome. Still showed details but was much easier on the eye. I ended up removing the mod because I wanted to get used to playing under set conditions across every server but I have a screenshot:
Comparison
My old modded AV
Current AV
If the changes were made to show of the maps, make the contrast darker. If the changes were made to make AV viable in a specific circumstance then this isn't how it should be. You can't flick between the modes every 30 seconds because it's too jarring. There has to be another way to make AV not a 24/7 ON feature if that was the goal. Maybe reduce draw distance, have a 'adjustment' feature where switching on and off takes a few seconds to acclimatise or a few seconds to adjust between lights ON/OFF/EMERGENCY. Something!
Someone earlier in the thread said its the same for marines and flashlights. I disagree. In my experience marines turn on their flashlights, and leave them on, even in bright rooms. (Unless they have cranked their gamma way up, or are using some kind of wall hack or texture hack/mod) Only time you turn it off is when sneaking through a vent to not give your self away. There isn't really much of a downside to flashlights in lit rooms.
I don't care about looking at "artwork" I see that when I play as marine.
I don't think I'm going to be playing aliens until it's put back the way it was.
yeah, i'm pretty UWE is getting a kickback from the world ophthalmology society or something.
I never liked old alian vision (ofc people like it cos its a way easier to see marines) and don't like new one. I was forced to use old alien vision because normal vision was too hard to see. Finally normal vision is great for aliens (like old huze alien vision) and I dont need to use "AV".. Well we need only alien vision tab to chose your right one or make it thru workshop (not the best idea but for public)..
NO the normal alien vision is not good now! It is absolutely horrible. Fine if you want to see the textures and clutter, go for it. But for God's sake give the rest of us the option of a simplified, clear screen. Without that option available, comp play will be completely dreadful.
Some one on another thread suggested replacing the alien vision with a kind of scent trail, givin that the aliens are predators this sounds like a great way to go, just be a little more creative instead of using some horrible orange filter.
Yeah, it's not like marines have to deal with all that clutter and textures...
Current AV could use a color and contrast change, but if they revert it, they might as well make it the default vision given how most people use it. There was literally no downside to using old AV and UWE could literally have painted all the aliens orange and most people wouldn't have noticed.
on a slightly unrelated note... has marine flashlight been changed/nerfed? i play with slightly optimized graphics settings, but the flashlight only seems to go about 3 metres now - almost impossible to see aliens without room power.
UWE removed hive sight for the alien commander when marines were walking on creep. UWE removed the cloaking ability from drifters. UWE made drifters expensive as fuck so they are no longer a viable means to detect marines. So this means aliens have to be constantly be roaming looking for marines and many times they will be in areas where the power was never built so the lights are always on.
Because of this there should be NO downside to using the alien flashlight otherwise the sensory aspect which should fall under the aliens as a plus actually falls under the marines.
Aliens just are not fun to play anymore at all which is why I loved the game in the first place. Terrible.
I think the enhanced AV (the 2nd mode) looks much better that way, more contrast.