BT Mod Cup Discussion!

ChrisAUS · June 2013

Upcoming Matches:
Monday
Miau vs Duplex 20:00 CET twitch.tv/vindalo0, twitch.tv/ns2fr
Radical.eu vs YO Clan 20:30 TBA
Miau vs Moebius 22:00 CET twitch.tv/naturalselection2, twitch.tv/ns2fr
Helix vs Duplex 22:00 CET TBA

Places to Watch BT Cup Matches
Matches cast by Decoy : http://www.twitch.tv/beemorriscats/videos?kind=past_broadcasts
Aussie Casts : http://www.twitch.tv/ausns2/old
NSLTV broadcasts : http://www.twitch.tv/nsltv/videos?kind=past_broadcasts
Wasabi and Hugh: http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/416945096

Specific Games + Casters!
TW&T vs legendary snails (Gohanzeta & Aioros) : http://www.twitch.tv/gohanzeta/b/416508920
Potam vs TW&T (Hugh & Wasabi) : http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/416945096
Goðar vs Onslaught (Gohanzeta & Aioros) : http://www.twitch.tv/nsltv/b/416942795
Snx vs Onsl (Decoy and Bonage) : http://www.twitch.tv/beemorriscats/b/417522318
Snx vs Godar (Seb and Bonage) : Part 1: http://www.twitch.tv/ausns2/c/2432931, Part 2: http://www.twitch.tv/ausns2/c/2432945

Recommended Matches
Radical vs dn. (round 3 and 4) : Radical vs DN

Hey everybody.
Been awesome fun playing so far in the BT Cup. Had some cool games vs Americans so far. Been trying to find links to the Snx. vs eo | stream but I'm still looking. If someone could post up twitch links or post-match youtube locations that would be cool. Makes it easier to go back and have a giggle instead of trying to play the game at the same time.

Main things I've learnt so far are:
- Playing 2 minutes of BT Mod Fade in a solo server isn't really a good method of getting to know the movement system. First time in combat my Fade method of attack was: 1) Blink into a marine. 2) Hold LMB.
- Flame Throwers are scary as hell to play against haha.

Props to RAGE! and eo| for some fun games. Was really enjoyable. Best of luck in your remaining BT Cup games guys.
Overall really fun so far. Played against 2 US teams who seemed really nice and had some very interesting games compared to live version!

If there are any more links that have streams of BT Cup mod games post 'em up and I'll edit my post to include them. Cheers.

CrushaK · June 2013

Wasabi & Hugh: http://www.twitch.tv/naturalselection2/b/416945096

cyanide · June 2013

marine res/teching to op. needs a nerf somehow.

Tharos · June 2013

Match played so far

TWAT vs legendary snails (comments by Gohanzeta & Aioros)
Potam vs TWAT (comments by hugh & wasabi)
Goðar vs Onslaught (comments by Gohanzeta & Aioros)

Edit : Someone explain me why Team work and tactics (T W A T) is censored ?

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

Lol at the censor...

Syknik · June 2013

I'm actually looking forward to the teams actually trying to push BT mod to its limits. Seeing some teams still going crag hive and doing the same thing isn't really helping test the mod. Try to break it people, gosh. That's what this cup is for.

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

You're saying people should purposefully choose a tech tree that is inferior in a tournament for balance purposes..? You know that will never ever happen right?

Syknik · June 2013

The tournament is just a way to get people to play the mod so that sewlek can see where all the issues are, and fix them. The tournament doesn't 'mean' anything. All tech tree paths are viable on the alien side, teams just need to learn how to use them. Which they aren't because they stick with the same vanilla strats (for the most part)

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

You can't tell me that one option (crag/shift/shade) cannot be the best and that all are equally good if used correctly.

Xao · June 2013

Ghosthree3 wrote: »

You can't tell me that one option (crag/shift/shade) cannot be the best and that all are equally good if used correctly.

Wasn't this the entire point of the BT mod? Months and months and months worth of game updates delayed or held off that would shake the game back up from its 6 month stagnation of cara first, fade timing?

Golden · June 2013

Ghosthree3 wrote: »

You can't tell me that one option (crag/shift/shade) cannot be the best and that all are equally good if used correctly.

All are equally good if used correctly.

CrushaK · June 2013

Tharos wrote: »

Edit : Someone explain me why Team work and tactics (T W A T) is censored ?

Because it is used as derogative term for female genitalia or as stronger alternative to twit in order to insult someone.

cyanide · June 2013

Cara is needed, be it 1st or 2nd hive. Shift & shade are a "nice to have" depending on your teams play style.

thelawenforcer · June 2013

the only reason cara is really essential imo is because its disproportionately strong on the skulk, to the point of it being too strong imo. if that were no longer the case, i think you would see more people doing different starts - and perhaps even not using crag at all as it doesnt give such a huge boost to the higher lifeforms i think.

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

Xao wrote: »

Ghosthree3 wrote: »

You can't tell me that one option (crag/shift/shade) cannot be the best and that all are equally good if used correctly.

Wasn't this the entire point of the BT mod? Months and months and months worth of game updates delayed or held off that would shake the game back up from its 6 month stagnation of cara first, fade timing?

Yes, but there's always going to be a best choice, there's no way around that, the best you can do is make the other choices viable and not a suicide pill but a challenge at most.

Blarney_Stone · June 2013

Crag first is still definitely the strongest option, at least in my opinion.

ritualsacrifice · June 2013

I think crag is the worst of the three starting techs now, tbh. Especially considering how fast you can get umbra out.

Unless aura and celerity were nerfed recently and I didn't notice it.

ChrisAUS · June 2013

Had some good games earlier against Onslaught. Had some server issues which was annoying but the games were enjoyable.

It's so damn scary even trying to engage as a Fade now. One of the freakiest things is sitting on a Phase Gate when a bunch of Marines pour through haha. Cheers for the games guys! Good luck in your remaining matches.

I've been updating the OP with links other people are providing so thanks for that everyone.

CrushaK · June 2013

I wish Twitch wouldn't be such a pain in the butt for me, though. For GohanZeta's stream and NSLTV do I get no more than 100 kbps download rate (for the recorded streams), which means I am stuck buffering every two seconds. Beemorriscat's stream is just barely in the acceptable range and only makes me buffer for a little moment every 10 seconds. Solely the official stream with Hugh and Wasabi delivers a fluent download with 120-160 kbps download rate.
Don't even want to think about live streams that offer "1050+ hp" as only resolution available.

For the most part I have to wait for stuff to be mirrored on YouTube to be able to enjoy viewing it.

ChrisAUS · June 2013

^ lol. Sounds like me. I can't even watch most of the Aus cast/streamed games because they are usually in 480p and I can only manage 360p.

I think tonight the Snx v Godar match is being run at 360p and 620p.

Ghosthree3 · June 2013

Who the hell records at 620p!?

ezekel · June 2013

Ghosthree3 wrote: »

You're saying people should purposefully choose a tech tree that is inferior in a tournament for balance purposes..? You know that will never ever happen right?

Inferior? Wrong

RedSword · June 2013

@ChrisAUS

Thanks for the links

Aioros · June 2013

Matches Monday

Miau vs Duplex 20:00 CET twitch.tv/vindalo0 ][ twitch.tv/ns2fr

Radical.eu vs YO Clan 20:30 TBA

Miau vs Moebius 22:00 CET twitch.tv/naturalselection2 ][ twitch.tv/ns2fr

Helix vs Duplex 22:00 CET TBA

btw from the Sunday Matches your rly need to watch Radical vs DN Round 3 and 4, outstanding games. One of the best games so far and they got casted by Blind together with Men(d)zaps!.

These games showed how interesting the BT mod games are compared to vanilla. The week 2 games will hopefully as good as this !!!

Roobubba · June 2013

Searching for some fade play that doesn't involve fades dying instantly vs weapons 1 shotguns...

I'll hold off saying that it seems like the fade is totally broken until I've seen more matches (1h worth of matches watched so far).

Aioros · June 2013

@roobubba
most of the teams currently playing, have not masterd the new movement yet.
I can assure you, Snails vs Godar for example will show you some awesome fadeplay and what they r capable off.
Even they losse fades but after such a long time, that they just get another fade.

ChrisAUS · June 2013

Roobubba wrote: »

Searching for some fade play that doesn't involve fades dying instantly vs weapons 1 shotguns...

I'll hold off saying that it seems like the fade is totally broken until I've seen more matches (1h worth of matches watched so far).

Snx v Godar had some good Fade play on <G> side of things. Snx isn't near that level yet but you can see players like Valk using the Fade at a higher level than what I've personally seen during the cup so far.

http://www.twitch.tv/ausns2/c/2432931 (First round starts at about 15:20 into the stream).

Frozen · June 2013

If aura stays the way it is, then it's hard to discount sensory when level 1 gives you the full cloaking upgrade (albeit not very strong).

Aura, I think, is going to become an integral part of fading as a team. Lerk support included.

Syknik · June 2013

Aura is always going to be a great upgrade at any point in the game. It allows you to see who is weak, and if there are any ambushes that the marines are setting up, or if someone is trying to be sneaky.

joshhh · June 2013

Fade + Aura

Roobubba · June 2013

ChrisAUS wrote: »

Roobubba wrote: »

Searching for some fade play that doesn't involve fades dying instantly vs weapons 1 shotguns...

I'll hold off saying that it seems like the fade is totally broken until I've seen more matches (1h worth of matches watched so far).

Snx v Godar had some good Fade play on <G> side of things. Snx isn't near that level yet but you can see players like Valk using the Fade at a higher level than what I've personally seen during the cup so far.

http://www.twitch.tv/ausns2/c/2432931 (First round starts at about 15:20 into the stream).

@ChrisAUS thanks for the link, although the stream finishes just as godar get some fades up in their second alien round, and in their first it was won before the fade showed up. What I found most worrisome there was at 25 minutes when SnX had 4 fades defending warehouse but 2 were killed against 3 shotgun marines - they could barely do any damage. Now I know that they're against Godar who are phenomenal shots (and getting medpacked and there were some macs later too), but I've seen some of these aussie guys play in other matches and they're not exactly slouches themselves. If 4 fades and a lerk can't take any of 3 shotgun marines before losing 2 fades, there's something a little bit broken if you ask me! Especially given how much fades cost.

When it comes to the lowly likes of me, and perhaps even worse players (if any exist), then the fade is going to be a big no no.

@Aioros: point taken about time with the fade, but it's also important to keep it roughly balanced at the point in time when these changes go live. If the first couple of weeks with a fade are littered with instant death experiences, there's going to be a hell of a lot of whinging on these forums about how crap it is!
I haven't played fade in the BT in the last couple of weeks, so I'm not sure on the very latest state of it: I've mainly had a go at lerk most recently. I found the lerk flight completely horrible (clipping issues on absolutely everything, poor air control, very very very easy to die to any half-decent shot, even with as much dodging as possible), but I've posted about those specific points in the BT thread.

There's nothing specifically wrong with having glass cannon classes. The main problem arises when you have to wait 10 minutes to get that glass cannon, then lose it instantly through the fact that you have to get close to your enemy who almost certainly has a shotgun with upgrades at that time in the game - then you have to wait another 10 minutes before you can have another go. That's going to be boring for the less-than-godlike players imho.

It may just take a bit of number tweaking to fix, of course. I watch with interest.

BT Mod Cup Discussion!

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