Outdoor MAP

B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
<div class="IPBDescription">Sorry if I am running over a dead horse</div>Sorry if I am running over a dead horse but........

Are there any ideas if they would be making any kind of outdoor map?
Half-life indeed had many outdoor maps.

Just an Idea!

-BS
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Comments

  • PaiSandPaiSand Join Date: 2005-01-07 Member: 33487Members
    Yes, BS, well said...
    Please use the search function (if it works)
  • lunsluns Join Date: 2010-12-05 Member: 75502Members
    i'm sure after they fix the elephant in the room bugs, something will come along.
  • AlignAlign Remain Calm Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5216Forum Moderators, Constellation
    Don't think anyone has tried. Why don't you have a go?
  • ShiloriusShilorius Join Date: 2011-01-14 Member: 77445Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    outdoor maps would be interesting.... skulks ahre hiding in the trees ... marines take cover in a wooden hut.
    Or maybe on some strange planet with stange vegetation.

    But at the momend there are no models and textures to create such a level.
    And I guess designing a outdoor map wpould be a pain in the ass because you have to create barriers for the map which can't be climbed or flew over... and the barriers again have to feel natural.

    I guess that would be very hard to design...
  • SatanLovesYOuSatanLovesYOu Join Date: 2004-05-03 Member: 28410Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Not to mention to keep the skulks from sticking to the skybox....
  • KarrdeKarrde Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16264Members
    I think it could be done if several barriers could be overcome.

    1. A ceiling above which nothing can pass. Might be able to create some kind of marine restriction field to prevent spread of the infestation (thus boxing in the entire play area)
    2. You'd have to create something to replace corridors such that skulks would have walls and ceilings to work with. Some of this could be done with natural geometry and bunkers and whatnot.
    3. Vents would need to be covered. You could have holes in the ground, or blown out walls, or external ventilation access, etc.

    Really, the key would be to alter the aesthetic without altering the functionality. It could be done, but it'd need more careful planning than the average map.
  • TigTig Join Date: 2010-05-08 Member: 71674Members, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver
    what's goin on in here?
  • ShiloriusShilorius Join Date: 2011-01-14 Member: 77445Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited February 2011
    <!--quoteo(post=1832474:date=Feb 15 2011, 11:29 PM:name=Karrde)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Karrde @ Feb 15 2011, 11:29 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832474"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I think it could be done if several barriers could be overcome.

    1. A ceiling above which nothing can pass. Might be able to create some kind of marine restriction field to prevent spread of the infestation (thus boxing in the entire play area)
    2. You'd have to create something to replace corridors such that skulks would have walls and ceilings to work with. Some of this could be done with natural geometry and bunkers and whatnot.
    3. Vents would need to be covered. You could have holes in the ground, or blown out walls, or external ventilation access, etc.

    Really, the key would be to alter the aesthetic without altering the functionality. It could be done, but it'd need more careful planning than the average map.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    You mean a kind of dome like in <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biosphere_2" target="_blank">Biosphere 2</a>?
    That would be indeed a great idea for a natural feeling barrier.
    An instead of vents skulks could jump from tree to tree or walk in some pipelines.
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    Biodomes/spheres would be cool with the alien infestation taking over the earth like enviroments.
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    Think of barriers on a map like blood gulch from halo. Or as on the new halo, hemorrhage. But instead of an open field have jungle like terrain with paths and all.
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832467:date=Feb 15 2011, 02:09 PM:name=Shilorius)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shilorius @ Feb 15 2011, 02:09 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832467"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->outdoor maps would be interesting.... skulks ahre hiding in the trees ... marines take cover in a wooden hut.
    Or maybe on some strange planet with stange vegetation.

    But at the momend there are no models and textures to create such a level.
    And I guess designing a outdoor map wpould be a pain in the ass because you have to create barriers for the map which can't be climbed or flew over... and the barriers again have to feel natural.

    I guess that would be very hard to design...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Watch this video of NS2HD and skip to 9:20

    Seems like they have some sort of idea on outdoor textures.
    Maybe put those in an outdoor setting?

    As for barriers I mentioned a map like blood gulch, or hemorrhage.
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    For those of you who do not play halo here is what I mean when I refer to hemorrhage or blood gulch.



    <img src="http://images.wikia.com/halo/images/7/71/HaloReach_-_Haemorrhage.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    <img src="http://www.4news.it/images/stories/games/ms/HaloReach/ForgeWorld/Hemorrhage/HaloReach_MP_Hemorrhage01.JPG" border="0" class="linked-image" />


    And this is a perfect video of the map. So barriers such as this but more of a jungle map!

    <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1rf8ejOKsw" target="_blank">Hemorrhage map</a>
  • AlignAlign Remain Calm Join Date: 2002-11-02 Member: 5216Forum Moderators, Constellation
    The problem isn't barriers on the sides, its barriers in the sky we're worried about.
  • SnougarSnougar Join Date: 2007-12-31 Member: 63301Members
    edited February 2011
    It would be cool to see some sort of biodome or out-doorsy maps.

    The only problem I can think of is aliens not having enough in the way of cover. Maybe a dense forrest type map, set at dusk or near night :D
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    edited February 2011
    *cough* <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=62266" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index....showtopic=62266</a>


    -still quite relevant...
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832497:date=Feb 15 2011, 03:39 PM:name=Align)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Align @ Feb 15 2011, 03:39 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832497"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The problem isn't barriers on the sides, its barriers in the sky we're worried about.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    There is a sky barrier just tells you that you are jet packing/ flying too high. Idk just a cool dense forest jungle map would be cool! or Maybe even a map that is based on the alien planet! we always see maps on Earth but what if the marines invade an alien territory?
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832499:date=Feb 15 2011, 11:41 PM:name=Snougar)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Snougar @ Feb 15 2011, 11:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832499"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It would be cool to see some sort of biodome or out-doorsy maps.

    The only problem I can think of is aliens not having enough in the way of cover. Maybe a dense forrest type map, set at dusk or near night :D<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    A large artifical domed area would probably be the best way to do it.

    You can make it have natural terrain, and bright lighting, but you can also have a practical explanation for the invisible walls, by making them not invisible.
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1832514:date=Feb 15 2011, 05:22 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Feb 15 2011, 05:22 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832514"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->*cough* <a href="http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=62266" target="_blank">http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index....showtopic=62266</a>


    -still quite relevant...<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    True, but theres a lot of source engine stuff about optimization or NS1 abilities (new vs. old blink) that aren't relevant anymore. As I see it, outdoor maps need
    1. Lots of cover (for melee aliens)
    2. Some way to prevent unrealistic skulk sky-walking, lerk/jp hitting the 'skybox'

    I'm also kind of interested in how the spark engine will deal with large, open areas, since NS2 is specifically designed for small, enclosed spaces. This is more relevant for potential modders than NS2.
  • TAPETRVETAPETRVE Join Date: 2011-02-08 Member: 80866Members
    edited February 2011
    The biggest problem I see with outdoor maps is the imbalance it would bring to some of NS2's key gameplay elements. While the aliens could breed and spread on pretty much every terrain, the Marines are restricted to specific land-use areas; they need an existing, functional power grid and prefab ground to build on. Sure, there are other game modes that don't need all the building stuff, but it would be a shame to have outdoor maps confined to mundane deathmatches and CTF, wouldn't it?
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    <!--quoteo(post=1832529:date=Feb 16 2011, 02:36 AM:name=ScardyBob)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ScardyBob @ Feb 16 2011, 02:36 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832529"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->True, but theres a lot of source engine stuff about optimization or NS1 abilities (new vs. old blink) that aren't relevant anymore. As I see it, outdoor maps need
    1. Lots of cover (for melee aliens)
    2. Some way to prevent unrealistic skulk sky-walking, lerk/jp hitting the 'skybox'<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Indeed, but some of those goldSRC optimization of a map is still good stuff to do in any case, even for a new engine. Also both points are covered in that guide. Heh, I might rewrite it someday for NS2, once the game is at final...
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832530:date=Feb 15 2011, 06:40 PM:name=TAPETRVE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TAPETRVE @ Feb 15 2011, 06:40 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832530"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Sure, there are other game modes that don't need all the building stuff, but it would be a shame to have outdoor maps confined to mundane deathmatches and CTF, wouldn't it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I agree with you and of course the map would need some tweeking and a lot of difference in terrain. But overall the idea of having and outdoor enviorment such as a juingle, forest, or alien planet would be a really cool idea!
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832530:date=Feb 16 2011, 02:40 AM:name=TAPETRVE)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (TAPETRVE @ Feb 16 2011, 02:40 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832530"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The biggest problem I see with outdoor maps is the imbalance it would bring to some of NS2's key gameplay elements. While the aliens could breed and spread on pretty much every terrain, the Marines are restricted to specific land-use areas; they need an existing, functional power grid and prefab ground to build on. Sure, there are other game modes that don't need all the building stuff, but it would be a shame to have outdoor maps confined to mundane deathmatches and CTF, wouldn't it?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    I dunno, it might well be possible to have the map be based around the marines operating between small technological enclaves set up in structures dotted around the map, while aliens place their hives in caves and things underground, and both sides fight over the neutral sunlit terrain.
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1832550:date=Feb 15 2011, 08:51 PM:name=Chris0132)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Chris0132 @ Feb 15 2011, 08:51 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1832550"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->I dunno, it might well be possible to have the map be based around the marines operating between small technological enclaves set up in structures dotted around the map, while aliens place their hives in caves and things underground, and both sides fight over the neutral sunlit terrain.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    +10000 for these ideas, good thinking with the cave and underground terrain.
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    Probably don't have an entire cave system under the normal map, but use caves and other natural areas of darkness and interiors to house the aliens, while marines use functional structures the same way.

    I assume there will be some way to block DI spread, so it shouldn't cover the entire map.
  • CodeineCodeine Join Date: 2010-11-22 Member: 75155Members
    Anyone seen the movie Pitch Black?

    Marines traversing through an area where theres all rock caves for skulks to get thru, the marines have to defend the power cells :p
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Members
    yes I was rather thinking you could make some nice rock equivalents to ventilation ducts.

    Might be a bit expensive on the polycount but it depends what rock props we get.

    But a cave riddled with tiny crawlspaces for skulks would be rather interesting.
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
  • PapayasPapayas Join Date: 2010-07-01 Member: 72219Members
    edited February 2011
    EVIL INFESTATION TREES THAT ATTACK MARINES!!!! YEAH

    Edit:
    I forgot to add EVIL VENUS FLY TRAP INFESTATION THINGYS.

    Now that would be awesome. A tad unfair though XD
  • B1ackSmokeB1ackSmoke Join Date: 2011-01-25 Member: 78855Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1833995:date=Feb 20 2011, 02:33 PM:name=Papayas)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Papayas @ Feb 20 2011, 02:33 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1833995"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->EVIL INFESTATION TREES THAT ATTACK MARINES!!!! YEAH

    Edit:
    I forgot to add EVIL VENUS FLY TRAP INFESTATION THINGYS.

    Now that would be awesome. A tad unfair though XD<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    It would be fun hah, like Jurassic park style
  • ZurikiZuriki Join Date: 2010-11-20 Member: 75105Members
    Wouldn't having a "no build zone" prevent spreading DI too far out. Also tree-tops would provide perfect alternative to vents for skulls! Until jetpacks arrive... anyway I think having enough buildings and clearing in a forest-type environment encased in a bio-dome would allow for outdoor gameplay that is reasonably balanced.

    You could use underground piping (water, sewage, etc) as an alternative to vents. With some open valves on the surfaces providing openings between structures. I would recommend having the hive stored inside a structure rather than a cave system for consistency reasons. Why would you have caves in a biodome?

    When we get tree props...
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