Natural Selection 2 News Update - NS2 Build 160 released

MaxMax Technical Director, Unknown Worlds Entertainment Join Date: 2002-03-15 Member: 318Super Administrators, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
Please post comments on the topic Natural Selection 2 News Update - NS2 Build 160 released here
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  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    edited December 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1817972:date=Dec 21 2010, 09:37 PM:name=Max)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Max @ Dec 21 2010, 09:37 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817972"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Please post comments on the topic Natural Selection 2 News Update - NS2 Build 160 released here<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    You're late, my ninja skills served me well in updating the tutorial map to meet build160 before the news post <img src="http://members.home.nl/m.borgman/ns-forum/smileys/tongue.gif" border="0" class="linked-image" />

    "Eggs!"
    Yay!

    "Improved the blood and flamethrower effects"
    I really like these new FX!

    "Added afterburner jets for MAC"
    Saw them on NS2HD's playtest vids, they're awesome!

    "Removed the jetpack from the UI until it's released"
    Odd, I still see it on localhost...
  • PaiSandPaiSand Join Date: 2005-01-07 Member: 33487Members
    edited December 2010
    So far so good, game load faster, still trying to find a not full server =)
  • AvalonAvalon Join Date: 2007-03-04 Member: 60224Members
    So many little nuances fixed, I get the feeling this is going to add up to a big experience change when I get to play it after work :D
  • peregrinusperegrinus Join Date: 2010-07-16 Member: 72445Members
    edited December 2010
    ;P

    Fixed players being <b>blineded</b> when they were hit by the flamethrower
    Added pre-game where players are <b>forozen</b> during countdown

    The sweet new alien minimap, and new res node in rockdown for those who haven't seen it:
    <a href="http://img832.imageshack.us/i/ns22010122117224679.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/4194/ns22010122117224679.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>

    The red square commander alerts are too big
    <a href="http://img214.imageshack.us/i/ns22010122117260712.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/5103/ns22010122117260712.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>

    Messed up alien UI won't go away even when switching teams
    <a href="http://img233.imageshack.us/i/ns22010122118355330.jpg/" target="_blank"><img src="http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/8305/ns22010122118355330.th.jpg" border="0" class="linked-image" /></a>
  • ThaldarinThaldarin Alonzi&#33; Join Date: 2003-07-15 Member: 18173Members, Constellation
    It looks really good in the movie, it's amazing what playing a game on LAN does for your impression compared to online play.
  • SoulzzSoulzz Join Date: 2010-05-02 Member: 71597Members
    I will test it out when I get back from work :).
  • BreadManBreadMan Join Date: 2002-12-15 Member: 10854Members, Retired Developer
    <!--quoteo(post=1817973:date=Dec 21 2010, 04:02 PM:name=Kouji_San)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Kouji_San @ Dec 21 2010, 04:02 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817973"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->"Improved the blood and flamethrower effects"
    I really like these new FX!<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    They're just small tweaks for now. Effects are gonna have a big pass done all across the board once Charlie finishes the new implementation system.
  • spellman23spellman23 NS1 Theorycraft Expert Join Date: 2007-05-17 Member: 60920Members
    edited December 2010
    I can't find the patch notes.

    EDIT: I r stupid... found it.
  • RUben1RUben1 Join Date: 2010-11-24 Member: 75246Members
    <!--quoteo(post=1817993:date=Dec 21 2010, 11:41 PM:name=BreadMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BreadMan @ Dec 21 2010, 11:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817993"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->They're just small tweaks for now. Effects are gonna have a big pass done all across the board once Charlie finishes the new implementation system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Indeed, flames should not move with the gun obviously. But that's known already.

    I really dislike the slow backwards walking, close combat for marines (without flamethrower) is a no go right now..
  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Members, Playtest Lead, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester, Retired Community Developer
    jeah, love the new backpedaling for marines :) good old ns1 times :)
  • IeptBarakatIeptBarakat The most difficult name to speak ingame. Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68107Members, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, NS2 Map Tester, Reinforced - Diamond, Reinforced - Shadow
    Awesome patch. You should really update the moddb/indiedb page with the new stuff and the 2 for 1 deal. I'm sure there would be lots of sales.
  • ComproxComprox *chortle* Canada Join Date: 2002-01-23 Member: 7Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Developer, Subnautica Playtester, Pistachionauts
    <!--quoteo(post=1817991:date=Dec 21 2010, 03:38 PM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Dec 21 2010, 03:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817991"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It looks really good in the movie, it's amazing what playing a game on LAN does for your impression compared to online play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Amazing how the majority of that footage was taken from online tests with people across the world.
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    edited December 2010
    <!--quoteo(post=1817993:date=Dec 21 2010, 10:41 PM:name=BreadMan)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BreadMan @ Dec 21 2010, 10:41 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817993"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->They're just small tweaks for now. Effects are gonna have a big pass done all across the board once Charlie finishes the new implementation system.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Small tweaks or not, they look good already. Can't wait for the new stuff then...


    <!--quoteo(post=1818018:date=Dec 21 2010, 11:03 PM:name=Comprox)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Comprox @ Dec 21 2010, 11:03 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1818018"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->Amazing how the majority of that footage was taken from online tests with people across the world.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. A pacific ocean for example is not a small thing D:
  • TrekTrek Join Date: 2009-05-09 Member: 67375Members
    edited December 2010
    Love the patch, much more stable. Only thing that is getting me is the marine speed reduction while walking backwards. Seems I can no longer try and dodge anything as the backwards speed makes it so I may as well stand in the same place or run at the guy. The fact that it also slows lateral movement while walking backwards really kicks my butt.

    I can see not being able to sprint backwards, but I do hope the reverse speed is increased a bit. I know I can walk backwards (well, at angles) while shooting in real life.
  • peregrinusperegrinus Join Date: 2010-07-16 Member: 72445Members
    The link posted on twitter links to an old news item about 158

    NS2 Build 160 patch notes released (and dev gameplay footage):
    <a href="http://bit.ly/gJAHfL" target="_blank">http://bit.ly/gJAHfL</a>
    about 1 hour ago via TweetDeck
  • PsiWarpPsiWarp Gifted Gorge Richmond, B.C., Canada Join Date: 2010-08-28 Member: 73810Members
    YESS!! The Gorge has been returned to his former glory :D

    I've yet to encounter Flamerthrowers, but from NS2HD's videos I can tell those won't be as rage-inducing as before. The explosion bug is still there, and infinite sparks come out of the MAC when a player holds +use on him (love the MAC responses btw)

    Thanks for putting out yet another patch, but don't work yourselves too hard :D
  • syprosypro Join Date: 2009-10-31 Member: 69195Members
    Great build guys, you are getting there. Can't wait for the day, that the game finnaly releases on Steam. I love your dedication so much it's unreal. I wonder what other studio's think of you Max. You are hardcore to the bone and remind me allot of Carmack. I just now found out you worked at Iron Lore, i played Ttitan Quest to dead.
  • ArakashArakash Join Date: 2010-01-07 Member: 69954Members, Reinforced - Supporter
    i didn't read anything about hydra optimisation, but NS2HD said, that they are spammable in this patch?
    can somebody confirm whether the hydra lag was fixed?
  • DeadzoneDeadzone Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17911Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1818042:date=Dec 21 2010, 07:54 PM:name=Arakash)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Arakash @ Dec 21 2010, 07:54 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1818042"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->i didn't read anything about hydra optimisation, but NS2HD said, that they are spammable in this patch?
    can somebody confirm whether the hydra lag was fixed?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->

    The videos NS2HD keeps posting show considerable spam without server performance issues. That being said, it doesn't look like UWE is stopping there. Improving that stability is still on their "to-do" list as usual.
  • MaxMax Technical Director, Unknown Worlds Entertainment Join Date: 2002-03-15 Member: 318Super Administrators, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Forum Moderators, NS2 Developer, Constellation, Subnautica Developer, Pistachionauts, Future Perfect Developer
    <!--quoteo(post=1817991:date=Dec 21 2010, 03:38 PM:name=Thaldarin)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Thaldarin @ Dec 21 2010, 03:38 PM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1817991"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->It looks really good in the movie, it's amazing what playing a game on LAN does for your impression compared to online play.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    The recording was done by NS2HD, who was in Australia (the server is in our office in San Francisco). That said, we know the experience isn't smooth for everyone when playing online, so we're still working on it. There weren't too many performance/networking related changes in this patch, but that's only because we're working on some larger changes that take more than a week to finish.
  • Stele007Stele007 Join Date: 2004-07-23 Member: 30063Members
    edited December 2010
    I'm really digging this patch. The minimap makes it so much easier to manage stuff now. And all the games feel like actual games. I've mostly commanded marine games, so the main issue I noticed was an easy exploit. If you build a sentry (which are awesome now, btw), they cost 20 plasma, but when recycled return 10 carbon. It hopefully is an easy fix, but it's very exploitable when you need just a little more for upgrades and can sacrifice some carbon (in fact, with a coordinated team, multiple people could hop in the chair, drop some sentries, then recycle them for some very quick carbon).

    Additionally, if you have multiple MACs selected and attempt to build a sentry, it will drop a sentry for each MAC you have selected, all stacked on each other. It's rather annoying as deselecting units is buggy, and it burns all my plasma. Oh, and if there are several sentries near each other, I can't drop any buildings in a very large radius around them (larger than normal buildings). It's especially annoying when you have sentries guarding a res tower. If the res tower is destroyed but sentries are up, you have to recycle the sentries before dropping another tower.

    The flow of games is a little uneven. Marines rush to get a 2nd CC up, start researching 2nd tier, then can abandon/recycle the 2nd CC. As long as they can hold out, they can get GL/flamethrowers and eventually push back. It will be nice once sieges are in because aliens seem to have a tough time finishing off marines.

    Also, on Rockdown it's easy for aliens to just build 2 hives straight up (the central and western points) and lock the marines down. If marines can't take down a hive (which is tough), they're stuck with only tech 1.
  • SN.WolfSN.Wolf Join Date: 2010-03-29 Member: 71115Members
    Server is very unstable again (again)

    Bottlenecks like clock work about every 3 seconds spiking CPU and mem then crashes after about five minutes of this. I had no server issues with 159 so i dunno whats up with this one if anything has changes in the server.exe but it definitely isn't as stable for me on this build (160). Several clients noted lag spikes when server choked.

    Headless
    Dedicated Blade
    Q6600 Quad Core
    8GB Ram
  • yimmasabiyimmasabi Join Date: 2006-11-03 Member: 58318Members
  • MiniH0wieMiniH0wie Join Date: 2007-11-25 Member: 63013Members
    WAY laggyier than before. :(
    FT much improved although the flames are still a bit much.

    Found that Fade will blink out of the map in rockdown especially when trying to run away towards east wing. Happened many times.
  • weezlweezl Join Date: 2008-07-04 Member: 64557Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited December 2010
    praise:
    NOTICEABLY better fps, maybe 50% by feel i'd say - AWESOME!
    kick-ass minimap improvement


    major bugs:
    - had flamer (later, happened also with other wep), trying to buy other weps took away plasma but nothing happened
    - hydras attack scanner sweep
    - drifters can access areas through walls and build there
    - "duplicate (or something)" weps lying at armory after players bought, seen only from commander view, seemingly firing when player fires his "twin wep"
    - structures buildable on CC
    - MAJOR EXPLOIT: making sentries costs plasma, recycling them gives carbon!
    - GL projectile is oversized, and it's collision model seems grossly oversized.
    almost impossible to lob one into "the lerkvent" on rockdown (at expansion just at MS)


    minor bugs:
    - MAC stacking (not as bad as marine stacking in ns1 though ;)
    - a MAC-stack of 5-10 can repair a powernode in just a few secs. while 3-4 would fit with collision.
    - sentry stack, when building having multiple MACs selected
    - close-buy-menu-key (X) on armory doesn't work, make it closeable by pressing use again
    - MAC pathfinding is very coarse
    - sometimes, an additional thin flame from flamer


    major issue: lerk spike attacks should be NERFED!
    taking down sentry in a few secs, same with marine.
    snipe should cost more and/or much longer cooldown!
    spikes should cost more plus be MUCH LESS effective against buildings!
  • SN.WolfSN.Wolf Join Date: 2010-03-29 Member: 71115Members
    As i played a few rounds then watched the beta video again i realized....still no power node in rockdown hive? Am i missing something as the three rounds i played ended with armory next to hive with 4 flamethrowers going nuts hard boiling the eggs.

    I'm not saying the flamethrower is overpowered but when stacked with multiple players using them it's a real bear to hatch into. Maybe a team limit or something? Assuming the flamethrower was introduced specifically to battle DI then why is it even implemented for balance if there is no way to fully understand what the balance of it is exactly.

    Not complaining here,just wondering what exactly they where originally meant to balance against? Is the onos the answer? acid rockets for fade? Give me something to go on here as i can't sell the game to friends if flamethrowers look like a weapon hack. (general NS1 players are really turned off by them).

    One other observation. When there is no commander we should have a visual indicator showing so. Not audible like "we need builders" but a simple "!" flashing small in the corner of our view.
  • thecowsaysmoothecowsaysmoo Join Date: 2008-02-02 Member: 63557Members
    edited December 2010
    wow, can definitely feel the difference this time. Just played 3 awesome games in a row, some servers still laggy even with good ping though.
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
    <!--quoteo(post=1818192:date=Dec 22 2010, 04:27 AM:name=SN.Wolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SN.Wolf @ Dec 22 2010, 04:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1818192"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As i played a few rounds then watched the beta video again i realized....still no power node in rockdown hive? Am i missing something as the three rounds i played ended with armory next to hive with 4 flamethrowers going nuts hard boiling the eggs.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
    Yeah, they plan to make it impossible to build in the main hive for marines. But adding that powernode for now seems like a good temporary fix...
  • DeadzoneDeadzone Join Date: 2003-07-03 Member: 17911Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    <!--quoteo(post=1818192:date=Dec 22 2010, 12:27 AM:name=SN.Wolf)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (SN.Wolf @ Dec 22 2010, 12:27 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1818192"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->As i played a few rounds then watched the beta video again i realized....still no power node in rockdown hive? Am i missing something as the three rounds i played ended with armory next to hive with 4 flamethrowers going nuts hard boiling the eggs.

    I'm not saying the flamethrower is overpowered but when stacked with multiple players using them it's a real bear to hatch into. Maybe a team limit or something? Assuming the flamethrower was introduced specifically to battle DI then why is it even implemented for balance if there is no way to fully understand what the balance of it is exactly.

    Not complaining here,just wondering what exactly they where originally meant to balance against? Is the onos the answer? acid rockets for fade? Give me something to go on here as i can't sell the game to friends if flamethrowers look like a weapon hack. (general NS1 players are really turned off by them).

    One other observation. When there is no commander we should have a visual indicator showing so. Not audible like "we need builders" but a simple "!" flashing small in the corner of our view.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->


    Maybe some life forms can be given a hard counter to flamethrowers. To be honest, the skulk and onos look more armored than half the alien structures, so maybe they should be given a high resistance to fire. This allows marines to use flamethrowers against specialty alien units and for clearing structures/DI, while allowing a core alien and a powerhouse alien to counter the flamethrower rush.
  • CerebralCerebral Join Date: 2003-06-25 Member: 17689Members
    I"m enjoying the feature additions in this build but the performance feels either equal or worse. Latency is really bad and thing seemed to get really jittery in a 14-16 person game until the server crashed. Also a great deal of my textures aren't rendering (rails, walls, etc.) where they did last build. Oh and the rifle sound loop bug is still present for me or has returned somehow.
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