Alright guys the reason for Day 1, no one died, and Day 2 no one died. The following things could have happened. Day 1 OR Day 2, guardian saved someone. And also Day 1 or Day 2 Wizard's 50% chance to survive a wolf attack and reveal himself to the wolves worked.
Or Wolf attacked a guarded person 2 times in a row (different person each time). Well you guys know what could have happened. Remember a guardian CANNOT guard the person who was just successfully guarded twice in a row.
Yes, Petco. However, it is our job as players to work that out, not your job as host to tell us. Of course, we would probably figure that out ourselves, but you should give the wolves the benefit of a doubt. You're aiding the humans, when you should be impartial.
<!--QuoteBegin-BadKarma+Jul 8 2005, 02:40 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (BadKarma @ Jul 8 2005, 02:40 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Still, 2 days and nobodies dead, cept for Hellfire. This might be a bit unbalanced. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Well, if the guardian has made two saves now, the wolves are probably in trouble, yes. But if they found their wizard on either of the nights, WE might be the ones that are in trouble.
ByekaName changed from Freak83TorontoJoin Date: 2003-03-13Member: 14484Members, Constellation
Well, Guardian if you have saved someone twice in a row. Very good job, I am proud of you. If you have only managed to save someone once, well still good job.
I won't deny im lost the pleasure of being able to place his vote first for the day, so I hold my vote.
hmmm, by next year we'll have a full file of disclaimers regarding the circumstances of various votes and we'll each be signing them each and every day.
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible.
Current votes:
im lost - 1 (lolfighter) lolgither - 1 (Fatal Error)
thansal pmed me with that data in the event of his death. Of course if he's lying I'm just repeating the same lies, if it's the truth, same truth, you get the idea.
ByekaName changed from Freak83TorontoJoin Date: 2003-03-13Member: 14484Members, Constellation
If anyone wants to know what those suspiciens are:
<BadKarma> alright, lay it on me brother <[sA]Freak83> what i said on day 1 <[sA]Freak83> you jumped onto CMEast <[sA]Freak83> then i never said anything but you jumped right onto Hellfire later <[sA]Freak83> that i'm not as suspicious of, more so as you jumped onto CMEast <BadKarma> the big post triggered the spidey senses, and I saw he wasnt gonna get the vote, so might as well kill Hellfire <[sA]Freak83> but why, it was obvious at that point Hellfire was going to die with or without your vote <BadKarma> why not? <BadKarma> hurry the lynch i figger <[sA]Freak83> right then <BadKarma> good then
<!--QuoteBegin-Theslan+Jul 7 2005, 10:23 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Theslan @ Jul 7 2005, 10:23 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Alright... time to release what I know.
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Wait, if hellfire contacted you claiming to be the guardian, but he obviously <u>isn't</u> the guardian (he was lynched, but the guardian guarded another person last night), there are three possible situations:
1. Hellfire was a wolf trying to trick you
2. Hellfire's role is unknown (he could even have been the real guardian), but there was no killing last night because the wolves have found the wizard.
3. Hellfire was a mouthpiece for the real guardian, which is unlikely. I say unlikely because the only way Hellfire would have been chosen as the mouthpiece during day 1 is if he was protected by the guardian on night 1, and I don't think he was a high-profile target.
Now, regarding im lost, there are again three situations:
1. im lost is the guardian
2. im lost is the mouthpiece for the guardian, meaning he was saved night 1
3. im lost is a wolf trying to confuse you, and the <u>real</u> guardian has yet to actually contact you.
Of course, all of these situations assume that the person who contacted you wasn't impersonating another player, which is possible. I'd say it's unlikely, because if I were in the wolves' position I'd prefer to remain anonymous to my contacts as long as possible, to avoid problems with conflicting stories and the like.
And of course lastly, Theslan could be a wolf and just making all of this up. Unlikely, because he probably would have wolfed im lost before citing him as the guardian, so im lost couldn't defend himself.
All in all, nothing that I've said is conclusive, but it's just interesting stuff to think about. My vote for the moment will sit on <b>BadKarma</b>, more to emphasize the lesson that PULLING THE LYNCH TRIGGER EARLY IS BAD FOR HUMANS, AND YOU SHOULD NEVER THINK THAT WAY IN THIS GAME. However that vote will most likely change as I ponder the above situations, especially when I hear im lost's answer.
Ok... I can see why people can misread my post. These are the TARGETS that the guardians have saved, not the guardian themselves.
So, obviously, Hellfire3k cannot be confirmed whether he was a guardian in the post. Nor could he be confirmed whether he was in contact with the guardian.
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Wait, if hellfire contacted you claiming to be the guardian, but he obviously <u>isn't</u> the guardian (he was lynched, but the guardian guarded another person last night), there are three possible situations:
1. Hellfire was a wolf trying to trick you
2. Hellfire's role is unknown (he could even have been the real guardian), but there was no killing last night because the wolves have found the wizard.
3. Hellfire was a mouthpiece for the real guardian, which is unlikely. I say unlikely because the only way Hellfire would have been chosen as the mouthpiece during day 1 is if he was protected by the guardian on night 1, and I don't think he was a high-profile target.
Now, regarding im lost, there are again three situations:
1. im lost is the guardian
2. im lost is the mouthpiece for the guardian, meaning he was saved night 1
3. im lost is a wolf trying to confuse you, and the <u>real</u> guardian has yet to actually contact you.
Of course, all of these situations assume that the person who contacted you wasn't impersonating another player, which is possible. I'd say it's unlikely, because if I were in the wolves' position I'd prefer to remain anonymous to my contacts as long as possible, to avoid problems with conflicting stories and the like.
And of course lastly, Theslan could be a wolf and just making all of this up. Unlikely, because he probably would have wolfed im lost before citing him as the guardian, so im lost couldn't defend himself.
All in all, nothing that I've said is conclusive, but it's just interesting stuff to think about. My vote for the moment will sit on <b>BadKarma</b>, more to emphasize the lesson that PULLING THE LYNCH TRIGGER EARLY IS BAD FOR HUMANS, AND YOU SHOULD NEVER THINK THAT WAY IN THIS GAME. However that vote will most likely change as I ponder the above situations, especially when I hear im lost's answer. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Pissoff lesson. It was sit around and wait for the next day or lynch him and get it overwith. It's not like it was a dead heat, the cat had 5 votes fore I put mine on him.
Alright... now things get a lot more interesting here, so let's cut through all the confusion, first.
I was only contacted by one guardian. I made up the guardian that protected hellfire3k. Why? It was a tool to get more people to communicate, and possibly through the wolves in confusion. There's a two guardians... so who do we know is real? Second, if the true guardian never contact me, I was hoping by now he would in order to clear up the facts. I figure it was a win-win situation, watching how people reacted to the fake guardian that protected hellfire3k.
Now I did not lie about the emails though, I did receive some and will post them here, which begins the unraveling of the role of the wizard:
<b><u>To Me:</u></b>
1) Yes I did save someone 2) The person saved was im lost.
<b><u>To Guardian (on the next day):</u></b>
I recommend you to send me another email, whether today you managed to save another person again.
<b><u>To me:</u></b>
Today I didn't save anyone. Since no-one has died the wolves and wizard now know who each other are.
I don't know who they attacked either, it could have been anyone. If they went for im lost again he could have been the wizard. I was slightly suspicious of him being the wizard, and if he is this is bad because he knows who I am and I'll be the next person to be wolfed. However I have no proof that im lost is the wizard. If you can get contact with the Seer however, he might be worth scoping out.
<b><u>To the Guardian:</u></b>
I need to know who you protected the previous few days. With that in mind, I, also, am the only one that knows about it, so far. This could be bad in so many ways. That could mean a good amount... so you really need to be sure that im lost is the wizard. Keep responding me on this email, if you will, but I am not confident that you are the actual guardian. You may want to start trusting people, before you go out, because if the wizard indeed is connected to the wolves, we are in big trouble.
<b><u>To Me:</u></b>
Reading your response in the thread about being contacted by another "Guardian" makes me consider two things.
1) You are a wolf, trying to get me to show myself to you in order to kill me on the next night 2) You have been contacted by another fake guardian as you claim. Why im lost denies every being contacted is beyond me unless he is the Wizard as I however much suspect. As for Hellfire, I know nothing about him.
<b><u>To Me (again):</u></b> Oh yes,
night 1 - Nil IQ & im lost
night 2 - <<b>censor to avoid wolves getting a 100% confirmed kill</b>>
And yes, if Petco's rules are as he states, then the Wizard and Wolves do know who each other are right now.
PS: Think about what the other "guardian" said to you. Saying Hellfire was saved night 1 creates the perfect cover story doesn't it considering he can't be questioned.
<b><u>To the Guardian:</u></b>
Uh huh... unfortunately, I do need a name. If you truly believe that im lost is indeed a wizard, can you come to me as the guardian? I'm on IRC, just contact me.
I suspect that you were going to guard me as well, and it was a good idea, which means that my death, unfortunately, will be next round.
So chances are that you will be guessed, and I will be wolfed. That's how it stands right now. The wizard probably will seer someone random.
I agree that I'm probably suspicious as well, and this is a pretty brute way to get the guardian talking. All I can say is that I'm human (as much as that helps), and I truly want get rid of the wizard. I'm about 80% sure im lost is the wizard, and I believe you are the guardian.
To give you another info, I believe I know who you are. I believe you to be <<b>censored</b>>, though it's really an educational guess. I have not told this to anyone, in fear that it may taint their thoughts.
Keep talking to me this way, we may get to an agreement somehow. But I truly believe you to be who you claim. Now... the part of you trying to believe me as a regular human...
At this point I had guessed the identity of the Guardian, shortly after sending this email I recieved an IRC message which turned into quite a conversation....
<censored> hello <Theslan> hi <censored> To give you another info, I believe I know who you <censored> are. I believe you to be <censored>, though it's really <censored> an educational guess. <censored> gotta give you credit <Theslan> hehe. <Theslan> you need to watch where you're posting. <Theslan> both times, I noticed you were on the thread when I got the email. <censored> i know, and i realised that you could notice too <censored> i was just wondering if you would be smart enough to <censored> you were <Theslan> I got lucky, I was on the computer when I received both emails. <Theslan> well... you are the guardian, correct? <censored> well now that you know who i am we can talk easier... i do believe you to be human and i hope i'm right <censored> yes <Theslan> ok. <Theslan> if this is all true and this isn't some huge elaborate trick, we're in trouble. <censored> petco emailed me night 1 <censored> telling me i had saved im lost <censored> i never got an email night 2 <censored>sorry not email <censored> forum PM <Theslan> ok, well... im lost for sure did say that he was not contacted. <censored> yes and that makes me unsure of him <censored> i'm going to PM you on the forums my convo with him <Theslan> and I'll give you some info: I made up hellfire3k. <Theslan> which means, you are the only person who contacted me. <censored> and why did you do that? <Theslan> but for now, I'm going to continue the ploy. <Theslan> Mainly, to get more people to converse, and to confuse the wolves a bit. <censored> man i hope you're a human =/ <censored> anyway <censored> he really didn't say much, it was like he was trying to hide something <censored> i'm gonna send it, hold on <Theslan> k <censored> it's sent ----------------------------------------------------- [BAt this point he sent me a log of a conversation he had with im lost after he saved him. Yet im lost clearly denied being contacted by him twice to me.[/B] ----------------------------------------------------- <censored> im lost has been rather quiet and suspicious acting this game. considering he's always been a human it makes sense he would act differently with any type of role <censored> and since he knows i'm the guardian i doubt he wouldn't tell me that he was the psychic or seer <Theslan> I'm waiting for the email <censored> i PM'd you <censored> on the forums <Theslan> oh <censored> not an email <Theslan> reading <Theslan> yeah, he didn't say much. He didn't try to leave something behind. Almost as if he knew he was going to be saved... in a way. <Theslan> Well, that's positive. I don't have a log, but im_lost definitely declare that he did not received an post from you <Theslan> I asked twice, showing him if he was protected, he had nothing to lose before dying. <Theslan> but he claimed he did not receive one. My guess he is expects you to stay away, keeping us apart. <censored> did i mention when i asked him if i should respond to your call for being contacted he told me not to? ---------------------------------------------------- <b>This was another interesting point, im lost actually told the Guardian not to contact me privately. It was as if he didn't want anyone else to have a chance at knowing who he is</b> ---------------------------------------------------- <Theslan> Argh. I hate this nagging feeling that you could be a wolf after all this disguise. <Theslan> wait, so he didn't want you to email me in the first place? <censored> that's right <Theslan> makes sense. Keeps him out of the way, then you die later without me knowing. <Theslan> So now... for sure, you're going to die, and I'm going to die. <censored> well if he's the wizard like we suspect yes <Theslan> and it's going to be tonight, because they get a free kill of guessing who the guardian is. <censored> no <censored> they only get to guess if someone was saved <Theslan> oh. <censored> they'll kill me tonight if im lost is the wizard <Theslan> well, that's slightly helpful. <Theslan> well, I'm about 80% sure he is. <censored> if i die tonight you have to post this <censored> i haven't told im lost anything <Theslan> I will, along with a fake block. <censored> a fake block? <censored> what's that? <Theslan> a fake block from the fake guardian I made up. <censored> oh <Theslan> If I reveal that I created the fake guardian, then... definitely I'll be voted off. One other person knows that, unfortunately, but I believe him to be human. <censored> we can't lynch im lost today though <censored> the only way it could successfully happen is for this entire log to be revealed <censored> and while i'm still alive it's not worth the risk <Theslan> correct. <Theslan> Ugh, I need to log this. <censored> me too <censored> ctrl + c <censored> ctrl + v in notepad <Theslan> done <Theslan> and... I just got permission to tell you that I'm in contact with the seer. <censored> really? that's helpful <censored> the seer gave you permission to tell me that? <Theslan> yes... I got lucky this round. <censored> does he know who I am? <Theslan> yes. We figured it doesn't matter, since if you know or not, I'm pretty much a dead target. <Theslan> he does not know. <Theslan> I'm still suspicious of him too, heh. <censored> well probably i'm dead first <Theslan> I'm next. If we take our information to the grave, im lost is safe. <Theslan> do you want me to reveal your name to him? <censored> to the seer? <Theslan> yes. <Theslan> He already knows I've been contacted. <censored> i don't know, that depends on how much you trust him <censored> if you trust him enough then you as may as well <Theslan> I trust him to a point, but eh... there's not much to go. It's either a wolf who's trying to trick me, or a human trying to trick me or the seer. <Theslan> I think we can eliminate the wizard out at this point. <censored> lol <Theslan> for now, I won't give a name. I think keeping it down to imlost and me knowing is good enough. <censored> i think we've tracked down who the wizard is <Theslan> so. How do we get im lost at all? <censored> well once i'm dead tomorrow you'll have to post this <Theslan> yes. <censored> and if you die it's going to be a problem <Theslan> They don't know you used up a turn protecting me. <Theslan> they could risk it... <censored> they could, they might think it would be obvious for me to protect you though <Theslan> yeah. <censored> i dunno <censored> well hopefully me and the seer will be able to work something out if that's the case <Theslan> hopefully. <Theslan> I could leave something for another person to say after I die to get you two connected. <Theslan> It wouldn't be hard at all. <censored> the seer has looked at 2 people right? <censored> obviously you were one of them <censored> night 1 or 2 <Theslan> no, trust me. I can make sure you two are connected with sign and counter-sign. -------------------------------------------------- <b>At this point we were trying to figure out the best way to inform everyone about all this. Our original plan was to wait until Day 3 when one of us was dead. But we eventually decided to risk it and post this now while we're both alive and have a chance. The way we see it, we're both dead next anyway.</b> -------------------------------------------------- <Theslan> er... sorry about that. I misread something above while I was copying and pasting. -.-; <Theslan> yes, I am one of them. <censored> sorry, sidetracked by MSN <Theslan> np <censored> well not much more to say about that right now <censored> wow i'm actually sort of hoping i'll die =/ <Theslan> lol <censored> there's got to be something wrong with that <Theslan> I don't know how to blame him. <Theslan> There's enough evidence to turn against me, such as the fake guardian. <censored> the easiest way is if i die so this log can be posted <Theslan> yes <censored> well if you have to post this BOLD the parts that you want noticed <Theslan> and I'll leave some signs to get you two (the seer and guardian) to connect. <Theslan> ok, but I still don't know how we can ensnare him. <censored> the day doesn't end for a while now and i highly doubt we can get him today <censored> unless you really come out openly before the day is up and sort of announce what has been going on --------------------------------------------- <b>Sort of what we're doing now</b> --------------------------------------------- <Theslan> we can, if we want. <censored> but even so we're not 100% sure he is the Wizard <Theslan> The main problem is trying to convince. <Theslan> I think so... given you are who you are, and I am who I am. <Theslan> And the wolves aren't dumb. <Theslan> Since you protected im lost, it doesn't make sense for them to NOT get that free kill. <Theslan> and im lost lied about being contacted. <censored> he lied to you about being contacted <censored> that's 1 vote <Theslan> the wolves aren't dumb and would kill im lost twice. <Theslan> It all hinges on whether you are guardian. <Theslan> that's the thing... if ppl don't believe your data, then... pretty much in trouble. <censored> Well if I'm dead I don't see why they wouldn't have any reason not to believe <Theslan> If you're dead, then it comes down to 'I'm making it up.' <censored> if you post all of this? <Theslan> I would rather do this if we're both alive. <Theslan> probably not, I guess. <censored> ok then let's think about it <censored> if we can both come through this alive that's great <censored> unlikly as hell but great <Theslan> I doubt that. We're really marked. <censored> see the one problem i have is <censored> what if im lost ISN'T the wizard <censored> until your seer looks at him we can't be sure <censored> or until i'm dead <Theslan> well, we'll know for sure in one turn. <Theslan> Do we want to risk it? <censored> ok let's say you make a post <censored> "I've been contacted by the Guardian, I know who he is" <censored> "We talked a long time, im lost was originally saved on Night 1 and was contacted by the Guardian" <censored> "He acted really suspicious" (post the log, my name blanked out)
------------------------------------------
The above pretty much sums up everything we have against im lost. At this point, we just worked out posting this.
So to explain it again: - I have been contacted by 1 guardian. - The guardian says that he contacted im lost and told him about his role. - im lost told the guardian NOT to contact me amonynously - im lost flatly refused any knowledge of being contacted by the guardian, even though I asked him twice about it. - The wolves are stupid not to kill im lost the second night. The guardian did not and could not guard im lost the second night. Therefore, im lost was targetted, and survived. - Only the wizard can survive (with 50% chance). - This labels im lost as a wizard.
The wolves have to be connected to the wizard now, they're not stupid to target another target with chance of guardian block. I believe this is what's happening, and so does the guardian.
I'm going to be completely honest here, and say my first thought after reading that:
Man, that was a long post.
as for the content, I'm mulling it over in my mind (there's a lot in there), I might talk to Theslan tomorrow, he was going to sleep when I caught him in IRC.
Wow, I didn't realize I would create so much chaos. I was in fact contacted by someone claiming to be the guardian, saying that I had been guarded. Theslan, when you asked me whether I had been contacted, I guess I was being too protective of the information, didn't want to give away too much. I'm quite sure we talked to the same person. Anyway, it didn't seem like they wanted me to say much about the fact that I was protected. Here's part of a conversation I had with the guardian:
<concealed> so do you know who was guarded? <im_lost> no <concealed> i do... <concealed> the wolves tried to kill you but failed <im_lost> i see <im_lost> and now your first message to me makes more sense <concealed> yes <concealed> <b>i don't see any point of saying you've been informed about this unless you're in trouble</b> <concealed> i know your not a wolf
The guardian mentioned that I didn't want him to talk to you when he asked me about it. What actually happened is that I mentioned what happened last game briefly. I started anonymously contacting Legionnaired, then I told him who I was, then he reveals who I am to a wolf. Theslan, you and I know better than anyone else how close that game was to a wolf win.
Why am I still alive? I don't have the answer to that question. Maybe someone else stood out to them as having a role, and they were right, it just happened to be the wizard.
I would random vote for lolfighter for stealing my random vote, but he already has a vote, so I will go with <b>Nil IQ</b>. It's really Petco's fault for always putting the beginning of the day while I'm at work <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Comments
no one died...
two days in a row....
Everyone, we must thank the guardian and his vigilence and efforts in these troubled times.
Guardian, thank you.
(over the top, yes it was)
Or
Wolf attacked a guarded person 2 times in a row (different person each time). Well you guys know what could have happened. Remember a guardian CANNOT guard the person who was just successfully guarded twice in a row.
Well, if the guardian has made two saves now, the wolves are probably in trouble, yes. But if they found their wizard on either of the nights, WE might be the ones that are in trouble.
I won't deny im lost the pleasure of being able to place his vote first for the day, so I hold my vote.
<span style='font-size:7pt;line-height:100%'>Oh the irony...</span>
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible.
Current votes:
im lost - 1 (lolfighter)
lolgither - 1 (Fatal Error)
Standard disclaimer, subject to change.
Seems we have an interesting chain starting to form.
Standard disclaimer, not subject to change.
<BadKarma> alright, lay it on me brother
<[sA]Freak83> what i said on day 1
<[sA]Freak83> you jumped onto CMEast
<[sA]Freak83> then i never said anything but you jumped right onto Hellfire later
<[sA]Freak83> that i'm not as suspicious of, more so as you jumped onto CMEast
<BadKarma> the big post triggered the spidey senses, and I saw he wasnt gonna get the vote, so might as well kill Hellfire
<[sA]Freak83> but why, it was obvious at that point Hellfire was going to die with or without your vote
<BadKarma> why not?
<BadKarma> hurry the lynch i figger
<[sA]Freak83> right then
<BadKarma> good then
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait, if hellfire contacted you claiming to be the guardian, but he obviously <u>isn't</u> the guardian (he was lynched, but the guardian guarded another person last night), there are three possible situations:
1. Hellfire was a wolf trying to trick you
2. Hellfire's role is unknown (he could even have been the real guardian), but there was no killing last night because the wolves have found the wizard.
3. Hellfire was a mouthpiece for the real guardian, which is unlikely. I say unlikely because the only way Hellfire would have been chosen as the mouthpiece during day 1 is if he was protected by the guardian on night 1, and I don't think he was a high-profile target.
Now, regarding im lost, there are again three situations:
1. im lost is the guardian
2. im lost is the mouthpiece for the guardian, meaning he was saved night 1
3. im lost is a wolf trying to confuse you, and the <u>real</u> guardian has yet to actually contact you.
Of course, all of these situations assume that the person who contacted you wasn't impersonating another player, which is possible. I'd say it's unlikely, because if I were in the wolves' position I'd prefer to remain anonymous to my contacts as long as possible, to avoid problems with conflicting stories and the like.
And of course lastly, Theslan could be a wolf and just making all of this up. Unlikely, because he probably would have wolfed im lost before citing him as the guardian, so im lost couldn't defend himself.
All in all, nothing that I've said is conclusive, but it's just interesting stuff to think about. My vote for the moment will sit on <b>BadKarma</b>, more to emphasize the lesson that PULLING THE LYNCH TRIGGER EARLY IS BAD FOR HUMANS, AND YOU SHOULD NEVER THINK THAT WAY IN THIS GAME. However that vote will most likely change as I ponder the above situations, especially when I hear im lost's answer.
So, obviously, Hellfire3k cannot be confirmed whether he was a guardian in the post. Nor could he be confirmed whether he was in contact with the guardian.
Yes, I have been contacted by the guardian concerning the first night. Currently, two guardians have contacted me, which both have listed night 1 is a saved.
The two people that are listed is im lost and Hellfire3k.
Im lost has denyed ever being contacted by the guardian. Hellfire... couldn't be confirmed ('cuz he's dead!'), which is why I wished I thought of this one day earlier. I might have confirmed it with him before he died.
Because there was another save again, I urge both of the guardians to contact me again. Obviously, one is fake, but perhaps what they give me will reveal more.
I'm withholding my vote for the time being. And when the guardians report back to me, I'll let you guys know as soon as possible. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Wait, if hellfire contacted you claiming to be the guardian, but he obviously <u>isn't</u> the guardian (he was lynched, but the guardian guarded another person last night), there are three possible situations:
1. Hellfire was a wolf trying to trick you
2. Hellfire's role is unknown (he could even have been the real guardian), but there was no killing last night because the wolves have found the wizard.
3. Hellfire was a mouthpiece for the real guardian, which is unlikely. I say unlikely because the only way Hellfire would have been chosen as the mouthpiece during day 1 is if he was protected by the guardian on night 1, and I don't think he was a high-profile target.
Now, regarding im lost, there are again three situations:
1. im lost is the guardian
2. im lost is the mouthpiece for the guardian, meaning he was saved night 1
3. im lost is a wolf trying to confuse you, and the <u>real</u> guardian has yet to actually contact you.
Of course, all of these situations assume that the person who contacted you wasn't impersonating another player, which is possible. I'd say it's unlikely, because if I were in the wolves' position I'd prefer to remain anonymous to my contacts as long as possible, to avoid problems with conflicting stories and the like.
And of course lastly, Theslan could be a wolf and just making all of this up. Unlikely, because he probably would have wolfed im lost before citing him as the guardian, so im lost couldn't defend himself.
All in all, nothing that I've said is conclusive, but it's just interesting stuff to think about. My vote for the moment will sit on <b>BadKarma</b>, more to emphasize the lesson that PULLING THE LYNCH TRIGGER EARLY IS BAD FOR HUMANS, AND YOU SHOULD NEVER THINK THAT WAY IN THIS GAME. However that vote will most likely change as I ponder the above situations, especially when I hear im lost's answer. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Pissoff lesson. It was sit around and wait for the next day or lynch him and get it overwith. It's not like it was a dead heat, the cat had 5 votes fore I put mine on him.
I was only contacted by one guardian. I made up the guardian that protected hellfire3k. Why? It was a tool to get more people to communicate, and possibly through the wolves in confusion. There's a two guardians... so who do we know is real? Second, if the true guardian never contact me, I was hoping by now he would in order to clear up the facts. I figure it was a win-win situation, watching how people reacted to the fake guardian that protected hellfire3k.
Now I did not lie about the emails though, I did receive some and will post them here, which begins the unraveling of the role of the wizard:
<b><u>To Me:</u></b>
1) Yes I did save someone
2) The person saved was im lost.
<b><u>To Guardian (on the next day):</u></b>
I recommend you to send me another email, whether
today you managed to save another person again.
<b><u>To me:</u></b>
Today I didn't save anyone. Since no-one has died the wolves and
wizard now know who each other are.
I don't know who they attacked either, it could have been anyone. If
they went for im lost again he could have been the wizard. I was
slightly suspicious of him being the wizard, and if he is this is bad
because he knows who I am and I'll be the next person to be wolfed.
However I have no proof that im lost is the wizard. If you can get
contact with the Seer however, he might be worth scoping out.
<b><u>To the Guardian:</u></b>
I need to know who you protected the previous few
days. With that in mind, I, also, am the only one that
knows about it, so far. This could be bad in so many
ways. That could mean a good amount... so you really
need to be sure that im lost is the wizard. Keep
responding me on this email, if you will, but I am not
confident that you are the actual guardian. You may
want to start trusting people, before you go out,
because if the wizard indeed is connected to the
wolves, we are in big trouble.
<b><u>To Me:</u></b>
Reading your response in the thread about being contacted by another
"Guardian" makes me consider two things.
1) You are a wolf, trying to get me to show myself to you in order to
kill me on the next night
2) You have been contacted by another fake guardian as you claim. Why
im lost denies every being contacted is beyond me unless he is the
Wizard as I however much suspect. As for Hellfire, I know nothing
about him.
<b><u>To Me (again):</u></b>
Oh yes,
night 1
- Nil IQ & im lost
night 2
- <<b>censor to avoid wolves getting a 100% confirmed kill</b>>
And yes, if Petco's rules are as he states, then the Wizard and Wolves
do know who each other are right now.
PS: Think about what the other "guardian" said to you. Saying
Hellfire was saved night 1 creates the perfect cover story doesn't it
considering he can't be questioned.
<b><u>To the Guardian:</u></b>
Uh huh... unfortunately, I do need a name. If you
truly believe that im lost is indeed a wizard, can you
come to me as the guardian? I'm on IRC, just contact
me.
I suspect that you were going to guard me as well, and
it was a good idea, which means that my death,
unfortunately, will be next round.
So chances are that you will be guessed, and I will be
wolfed. That's how it stands right now. The wizard
probably will seer someone random.
I agree that I'm probably suspicious as well, and this
is a pretty brute way to get the guardian talking. All
I can say is that I'm human (as much as that helps),
and I truly want get rid of the wizard. I'm about 80%
sure im lost is the wizard, and I believe you are the
guardian.
To give you another info, I believe I know who you
are. I believe you to be <<b>censored</b>>, though it's really
an educational guess. I have not told this to anyone,
in fear that it may taint their thoughts.
Keep talking to me this way, we may get to an
agreement somehow. But I truly believe you to be who
you claim. Now... the part of you trying to believe me
as a regular human...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
At this point I had guessed the identity of the Guardian, shortly after sending this email I recieved an IRC message which turned into quite a conversation....
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<censored> hello
<Theslan> hi
<censored> To give you another info, I believe I know who you
<censored> are. I believe you to be <censored>, though it's really
<censored> an educational guess.
<censored> gotta give you credit
<Theslan> hehe.
<Theslan> you need to watch where you're posting.
<Theslan> both times, I noticed you were on the thread when I got the email.
<censored> i know, and i realised that you could notice too
<censored> i was just wondering if you would be smart enough to
<censored> you were
<Theslan> I got lucky, I was on the computer when I received both emails.
<Theslan> well... you are the guardian, correct?
<censored> well now that you know who i am we can talk easier... i do believe you to be human and i hope i'm right
<censored> yes
<Theslan> ok.
<Theslan> if this is all true and this isn't some huge elaborate trick, we're in trouble.
<censored> petco emailed me night 1
<censored> telling me i had saved im lost
<censored> i never got an email night 2
<censored>sorry not email
<censored> forum PM
<Theslan> ok, well... im lost for sure did say that he was not contacted.
<censored> yes and that makes me unsure of him
<censored> i'm going to PM you on the forums my convo with him
<Theslan> and I'll give you some info: I made up hellfire3k.
<Theslan> which means, you are the only person who contacted me.
<censored> and why did you do that?
<Theslan> but for now, I'm going to continue the ploy.
<Theslan> Mainly, to get more people to converse, and to confuse the wolves a bit.
<censored> man i hope you're a human =/
<censored> anyway
<censored> he really didn't say much, it was like he was trying to hide something
<censored> i'm gonna send it, hold on
<Theslan> k
<censored> it's sent
-----------------------------------------------------
[BAt this point he sent me a log of a conversation he had with im lost after he saved him. Yet im lost clearly denied being contacted by him twice to me.[/B]
-----------------------------------------------------
<censored> im lost has been rather quiet and suspicious acting this game. considering he's always been a human it makes
sense he would act differently with any type of role
<censored> and since he knows i'm the guardian i doubt he wouldn't tell me that he was the psychic or seer
<Theslan> I'm waiting for the email
<censored> i PM'd you
<censored> on the forums
<Theslan> oh
<censored> not an email
<Theslan> reading
<Theslan> yeah, he didn't say much. He didn't try to leave something behind. Almost as if he knew he was going to be saved...
in a way.
<Theslan> Well, that's positive. I don't have a log, but im_lost definitely declare that he did not received an post from you
<Theslan> I asked twice, showing him if he was protected, he had nothing to lose before dying.
<Theslan> but he claimed he did not receive one. My guess he is expects you to stay away, keeping us apart.
<censored> did i mention when i asked him if i should respond to your call for being contacted he told me not to?
----------------------------------------------------
<b>This was another interesting point, im lost actually told the Guardian not to contact me privately. It was as if he didn't want anyone else to have a chance at knowing who he is</b>
----------------------------------------------------
<Theslan> Argh. I hate this nagging feeling that you could be a wolf after all this disguise.
<Theslan> wait, so he didn't want you to email me in the first place?
<censored> that's right
<Theslan> makes sense. Keeps him out of the way, then you die later without me knowing.
<Theslan> So now... for sure, you're going to die, and I'm going to die.
<censored> well if he's the wizard like we suspect yes
<Theslan> and it's going to be tonight, because they get a free kill of guessing who the guardian is.
<censored> no
<censored> they only get to guess if someone was saved
<Theslan> oh.
<censored> they'll kill me tonight if im lost is the wizard
<Theslan> well, that's slightly helpful.
<Theslan> well, I'm about 80% sure he is.
<censored> if i die tonight you have to post this
<censored> i haven't told im lost anything
<Theslan> I will, along with a fake block.
<censored> a fake block?
<censored> what's that?
<Theslan> a fake block from the fake guardian I made up.
<censored> oh
<Theslan> If I reveal that I created the fake guardian, then... definitely I'll be voted off. One other person knows that,
unfortunately, but I believe him to be human.
<censored> we can't lynch im lost today though
<censored> the only way it could successfully happen is for this entire log to be revealed
<censored> and while i'm still alive it's not worth the risk
<Theslan> correct.
<Theslan> Ugh, I need to log this.
<censored> me too
<censored> ctrl + c
<censored> ctrl + v in notepad
<Theslan> done
<Theslan> and... I just got permission to tell you that I'm in contact with the seer.
<censored> really? that's helpful
<censored> the seer gave you permission to tell me that?
<Theslan> yes... I got lucky this round.
<censored> does he know who I am?
<Theslan> yes. We figured it doesn't matter, since if you know or not, I'm pretty much a dead target.
<Theslan> he does not know.
<Theslan> I'm still suspicious of him too, heh.
<censored> well probably i'm dead first
<Theslan> I'm next. If we take our information to the grave, im lost is safe.
<Theslan> do you want me to reveal your name to him?
<censored> to the seer?
<Theslan> yes.
<Theslan> He already knows I've been contacted.
<censored> i don't know, that depends on how much you trust him
<censored> if you trust him enough then you as may as well
<Theslan> I trust him to a point, but eh... there's not much to go. It's either a wolf who's trying to trick me, or a human
trying to trick me or the seer.
<Theslan> I think we can eliminate the wizard out at this point.
<censored> lol
<Theslan> for now, I won't give a name. I think keeping it down to imlost and me knowing is good enough.
<censored> i think we've tracked down who the wizard is
<Theslan> so. How do we get im lost at all?
<censored> well once i'm dead tomorrow you'll have to post this
<Theslan> yes.
<censored> and if you die it's going to be a problem
<Theslan> They don't know you used up a turn protecting me.
<Theslan> they could risk it...
<censored> they could, they might think it would be obvious for me to protect you though
<Theslan> yeah.
<censored> i dunno
<censored> well hopefully me and the seer will be able to work something out if that's the case
<Theslan> hopefully.
<Theslan> I could leave something for another person to say after I die to get you two connected.
<Theslan> It wouldn't be hard at all.
<censored> the seer has looked at 2 people right?
<censored> obviously you were one of them
<censored> night 1 or 2
<Theslan> no, trust me. I can make sure you two are connected with sign and counter-sign.
--------------------------------------------------
<b>At this point we were trying to figure out the best way to inform everyone about all this. Our original plan was to wait until Day 3 when one of us was dead. But we eventually decided to risk it and post this now while we're both alive and have a chance. The way we see it, we're both dead next anyway.</b>
--------------------------------------------------
<Theslan> er... sorry about that. I misread something above while I was copying and pasting. -.-;
<Theslan> yes, I am one of them.
<censored> sorry, sidetracked by MSN
<Theslan> np
<censored> well not much more to say about that right now
<censored> wow i'm actually sort of hoping i'll die =/
<Theslan> lol
<censored> there's got to be something wrong with that
<Theslan> I don't know how to blame him.
<Theslan> There's enough evidence to turn against me, such as the fake guardian.
<censored> the easiest way is if i die so this log can be posted
<Theslan> yes
<censored> well if you have to post this BOLD the parts that you want noticed
<Theslan> and I'll leave some signs to get you two (the seer and guardian) to connect.
<Theslan> ok, but I still don't know how we can ensnare him.
<censored> the day doesn't end for a while now and i highly doubt we can get him today
<censored> unless you really come out openly before the day is up and sort of announce what has been going on
---------------------------------------------
<b>Sort of what we're doing now</b>
---------------------------------------------
<Theslan> we can, if we want.
<censored> but even so we're not 100% sure he is the Wizard
<Theslan> The main problem is trying to convince.
<Theslan> I think so... given you are who you are, and I am who I am.
<Theslan> And the wolves aren't dumb.
<Theslan> Since you protected im lost, it doesn't make sense for them to NOT get that free kill.
<Theslan> and im lost lied about being contacted.
<censored> he lied to you about being contacted
<censored> that's 1 vote
<Theslan> the wolves aren't dumb and would kill im lost twice.
<Theslan> It all hinges on whether you are guardian.
<Theslan> that's the thing... if ppl don't believe your data, then... pretty much in trouble.
<censored> Well if I'm dead I don't see why they wouldn't have any reason not to believe
<Theslan> If you're dead, then it comes down to 'I'm making it up.'
<censored> if you post all of this?
<Theslan> I would rather do this if we're both alive.
<Theslan> probably not, I guess.
<censored> ok then let's think about it
<censored> if we can both come through this alive that's great
<censored> unlikly as hell but great
<Theslan> I doubt that. We're really marked.
<censored> see the one problem i have is
<censored> what if im lost ISN'T the wizard
<censored> until your seer looks at him we can't be sure
<censored> or until i'm dead
<Theslan> well, we'll know for sure in one turn.
<Theslan> Do we want to risk it?
<censored> ok let's say you make a post
<censored> "I've been contacted by the Guardian, I know who he is"
<censored> "We talked a long time, im lost was originally saved on Night 1 and was contacted by the Guardian"
<censored> "He acted really suspicious" (post the log, my name blanked out)
------------------------------------------
The above pretty much sums up everything we have against im lost.
At this point, we just worked out posting this.
So to explain it again:
- I have been contacted by 1 guardian.
- The guardian says that he contacted im lost and told him about his role.
- im lost told the guardian NOT to contact me amonynously
- im lost flatly refused any knowledge of being contacted by the guardian, even though I asked him twice about it.
- The wolves are stupid not to kill im lost the second night. The guardian did not and could not guard im lost the second night. Therefore, im lost was targetted, and survived.
- Only the wizard can survive (with 50% chance).
- This labels im lost as a wizard.
The wolves have to be connected to the wizard now, they're not stupid to target another target with chance of guardian block. I believe this is what's happening, and so does the guardian.
This makes my vote <b>im lost</b>.
i) The wolves screwed up, since the guardian can't protect the same person twice in a row.
ii) We're screwed, since it means the wizard's with his l'il lupine lads.
Man, that was a long post.
as for the content, I'm mulling it over in my mind (there's a lot in there), I might talk to Theslan tomorrow, he was going to sleep when I caught him in IRC.
<concealed> so do you know who was guarded?
<im_lost> no
<concealed> i do...
<concealed> the wolves tried to kill you but failed
<im_lost> i see
<im_lost> and now your first message to me makes more sense
<concealed> yes
<concealed> <b>i don't see any point of saying you've been informed about this unless you're in trouble</b>
<concealed> i know your not a wolf
The guardian mentioned that I didn't want him to talk to you when he asked me about it. What actually happened is that I mentioned what happened last game briefly. I started anonymously contacting Legionnaired, then I told him who I was, then he reveals who I am to a wolf. Theslan, you and I know better than anyone else how close that game was to a wolf win.
Why am I still alive? I don't have the answer to that question. Maybe someone else stood out to them as having a role, and they were right, it just happened to be the wizard.
I would random vote for lolfighter for stealing my random vote, but he already has a vote, so I will go with <b>Nil IQ</b>. It's really Petco's fault for always putting the beginning of the day while I'm at work <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->