O Karl, We Hardly Knew Ye

DubbilexDubbilex ChumpMembers Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
QUOTE
MSNBC Analyst Says 2nd Source Confirms Karl Rove as Plame Leaker

By Greg Mitchell


Published: July 02, 2005 1:00 PM ET



NEW YORK Now that Time Inc. has turned over documents to federal court, revealing who its reporter, Matt Cooper, identified as his source in the Valerie Plame/CIA case, speculation runs rampant on the name of that source. Lawrence O'Donnell, senior MSNBC political analyst, now claims that at least two sources have confirmed that the name is top White House mastermind Karl Rove.

O'Donnell first offered this report Friday night on the syndicated McLaughlin Group political talk show. Today, he went beyond that, writing a brief entry at the Huffington Post blog:

"I revealed in yesterday's taping of the McLaughlin Group that Time magazine's e-mails will reveal that Karl Rove was Matt Cooper's source. I have known this for months but didn't want to say it at a time that would risk me getting dragged into the grand jury.

"McLaughlin is seen in some markets on Friday night, so some websites have picked it up, including Drudge, but I don't expect it to have much impact because McLaughlin is not considered a news show and it will be pre-empted in the big markets on Sunday because of tennis.

"Since I revealed the big scoop, I have had it reconfirmed by yet another highly authoritative source. Too many people know this. It should break wide open this week. I know Newsweek is working on an 'It's Rove!' story and will probably break it tomorrow."

Here is the text of what O'Donnell said on Friday:

"What we're going to go to now in the next stage, when Matt Cooper's e-mails, within Time Magazine, are handed over to the grand jury--the ultimate revelation, probably within the week of who his source is.

"I know I'm going to get pulled into the grand jury for saying this but the source of...for Matt Cooper was Karl Rove, and that will be revealed in this document dump that Time magazine's going to do with the grand jury."

Other McLaughlin Group panelists then joined in discussing whether, if true, this would suggest a perjury rap for Rove, if he told the grand jury he did not leak to Cooper.

Besides his career at a TV journalist, O'Donnell has served as a producer and writer for the series "The West Wing."

According to published reports, Patrick Fitzgerald, the special prosecutor in the case, has interviewed President Bush and Vice President Cheney and called Karl Rove, among others, to testify before the grand jury.

"The breadth of Fitzgerald's inquiry has led to speculation that it has evolved into an investigation of a conspiracy to leak Plame's identity," the Chicago Tribune observed on Friday, "or of an attempt to cover up White House involvement in the leak."



SOURCE



In a nutshell, this means that Karl Rove will likely be tried for treason and, if convicted, will be incarcerated in federal prison for his involvement as a CIA leak in the Valerie Plame Case; Rove, in secretly leaking her name, effectively 'outed' her and ended her career.

Even more worrisome is the fact that Plame was the metaphorical 'good cop' - her life's work concerned the controlled proliferation of Nuclear weapons and other WMDs. Just what, exactly, were Rove's motives in forcing her off the road? With this and the The Downing Street memo emerging in the same few months, this Iraq business becomes shadier and shadier all the time. Were the liberal nutjobs right? Stay tuned!

This'll probably be all over the headlines, as mentioned in the article, within the week - watch for it and stay informed!
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Comments

  • reasareasa Members, Constellation Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Posts: 2,367
    QUOTE (Dubbilex @ Jul 2 2005, 02:47 PM)
    This'll probably be all over the headlines, as mentioned in the article, within the week - watch for it and stay informed!

    Meh it might make the little scroller on CNN if the Aruba case takes a little longer to break.

    However if Tom Cruise goes crazy again or some kid in Utah gets lost on a bike ride you can forget about it.
  • MantaManta Members Join Date: 2005-01-12 Member: 35056Posts: 255
    So sad and so true, reasa. sad-fix.gif
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    edited July 2005
    Its worse than that. Most news organizations were complicit in trying to keep this a secret in order to respect the integrity of their anonymous sources. I don't think this will get to be nearly as big as it should.
  • cshank4cshank4 Members Join Date: 2003-02-11 Member: 13425Posts: 1,668
    So this is considered treason...

    And the punishment for treason is public execution...


    FINALLY GOOD TELEVISION!
    IPB Image
  • lolfighterlolfighter Snark, Dire Members Join Date: 2003-04-20 Member: 15693Posts: 9,005 Advanced user
    Nah, no public execution. Too many wealthy and influential friends. Remember, we're all equal. Some are just more equal than others.
    Military cemeteries around the world are packed with brainwashed, dead soldiers who were convinced God was on their side.
    - George Carlin
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    I tell you, with the Downing Street memo and now this, all it is is a matter of time. Recall that Nixon didn't get in trouble until two years after he was elected for the second time. Support for the war is dropping every day, polls show, and there's even talk of an impeachment if it turns out Bush lied about Iraq. This thing is just the icing on the cake.

    Guess you can only run so far until you're right back where you started. The Bush administration is finally going to be held accountable for such things, and not even only by liberals. Now, it's just a question of when.
    what
  • Deus_Ex_MachinaDeus_Ex_Machina Members Join Date: 2004-07-01 Member: 29674Posts: 242
    QUOTE (Dubbilex @ Jul 2 2005, 04:09 PM)
    there's even talk of an impeachment if it turns out Bush lied about Iraq.

    If? confused-fix.gif
    QUOTE (Zig @ Jun 20 2004, 03:28 PM)
    PRECIPITATION MAKES ME SO F*ING HORNY OHHH GOD
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    QUOTE (Deus Ex Machina @ Jul 2 2005, 04:14 PM)
    QUOTE (Dubbilex @ Jul 2 2005, 04:09 PM)
    there's even talk of an impeachment if it turns out Bush lied about Iraq.

    If? confused-fix.gif

    Fair enough. When it turns out that Bush lied about Iraq tounge.gif

    The average young American still has no idea. Hell, the average young American doesn't even know who Karl Rove is unless they saw him on MTV.
    what
  • R_A_CR_A_C Members Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16273Posts: 631
    <----average young American without cable tv. Who's Karl Rove, what's the Plame case? i really need to pay more attention to current events
    R A C
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    Just found the Newsweek Article on MSNBC.
    what
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    QUOTE (R A C @ Jul 2 2005, 04:27 PM)
    <----average young American without cable tv. Who's Karl Rove, what's the Plame case? i really need to pay more attention to current events

    Karl Rove is the top advisor to President Bush. He's been his campaign strategist since the beginning.

    Here's everything about the Plame case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
    Basically, she was formerly a covert cia agent. Her husband was critical of the Bush administration, and someone in the Bush administration outed her to the press. That is a felony. It has just come to light that the person who released the information about her was Karl Rove.
  • reasareasa Members, Constellation Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Posts: 2,367
    QUOTE (moultano @ Jul 2 2005, 04:35 PM)
    Karl Rove is the top advisor to President Bush. He's been his campaign strategist since the beginning.

    Here's everything about the Plame case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
    Basically, she was formerly a covert cia agent. Her husband was critical of the Bush administration, and someone in the Bush administration outed her to the press. That is a felony. It has just come to light that the person who released the information about her was Karl Rove.

    I wish you would stop speaking in riddles and just say what you mean in plain English.
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    QUOTE (reasa @ Jul 2 2005, 04:40 PM)
    QUOTE (moultano @ Jul 2 2005, 04:35 PM)
    Karl Rove is the top advisor to President Bush. He's been his campaign strategist since the beginning.

    Here's everything about the Plame case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
    Basically, she was formerly a covert cia agent. Her husband was critical of the Bush administration, and someone in the Bush administration outed her to the press. That is a felony. It has just come to light that the person who released the information about her was Karl Rove.

    I wish you would stop speaking in riddles and just say what you mean in plain English.

    confused-fix.gif
    I thought it was clear enough.
  • im_lostim_lost TWG Rule Guru Members Join Date: 2003-04-26 Member: 15861Posts: 3,925
    reasa, what are you confused about? As moultano explained, Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent. To do her job, it needs to be a secret that she is a CIA agent. So, when Karl Rove revealed this, it ended her career.
    image
    QUOTE(CMEast @ Jun 4 2005, 10:54 AM)
    ... accusations are so... accusing.
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    QUOTE (im lost @ Jul 2 2005, 04:58 PM)
    reasa, what are you confused about? As moultano explained, Valerie Plame was a covert CIA agent. To do her job, it needs to be a secret that she is a CIA agent. So, when Karl Rove revealed this, it ended her career.

    Not only did it end her career, but it is also a felony which is punishable by ten years in federal prison.
  • Fog_cartoonsFog_cartoons Members Join Date: 2003-09-08 Member: 20658Posts: 361
    I thought Treason only applied if you conspired against a King or Queen, maybe I should look up the real meaning of it
    IPB Image
    QUOTE(Snidely)
    QUOTE(DrSuredeath)
    The British Army was defeated by a French girl once
    Then the French burnt her, and they never won any significant battle against us afterwards. Good game, guys. Way to eject a winning com
  • cshank4cshank4 Members Join Date: 2003-02-11 Member: 13425Posts: 1,668
    Actually, if the law hasn't changed, execution is the punishment for Treason, not ten years.
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  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    QUOTE (cshank4 @ Jul 2 2005, 05:04 PM)
    Actually, if the law hasn't changed, execution is the punishment for Treason, not ten years.

    I'm not sure if legally it is strictly treason. I certainly consider it to be, but the wording of the law is probably different.
  • Speed_2_DaveSpeed_2_Dave Members Join Date: 2002-11-15 Member: 8788Posts: 1,375
    worst case scenario Rove gets a presidential pardon and goes his merry way.

    "best case" scenario some runaway bride shows up that is actuallly attractive, distracts the population, they quickly and quietly have a trial where rove is found pseudo-responsible, but is punished with some sort of fine or jail term served under probation for all of a year.

    Everyone who is screaming and pointing fingers during this is just caught up in the hype, mostly brought from schemers like Karl Rove. Remember how much of a flip-flopper Kerry was? At least Bush always sticks with his plans, even after his reasoning for said plans has flip-flopped.

    The only people who deserve to be yelled at and have fingers pointed at them are the people who believed Iraq had WMD that would be found. Nobody's dumb enough to get caught with their pants down, especially when you have the US for an enemy. This news report will most likely just be a footnote in 2005.
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    According to less-than-objective sources (one of the first places I saw with the story was some Canadian environmentalist rag) it's at least treasonous. Perhaps it's not treason, per se. Anyways, there is no mandatory minumum sentence or anything. I figure his punishment will be based upon what the judge deems appropriate.

    (I don't think execution is applicable here - if indeed it does qualify, this is barely anything more that the Ralph Nader of treason. Small-time, get it?)

    Anyways, if our awesome legal system has anything to say about it, nobody famous ever gets in trouble. And if they do - here's looking at you, Martha Stewart - they go away to celebrity prison (read: a resort).

    Still, the current administration's credibility decreases more each and every day. Since this ties in with all the Downing Street razzmatazz, it's pretty apparent that the liberal-and-proud-of-it parts of the media will lock their teeth around this thing's neck and make it an icon. Just like the Downing Street memo, this won't be an easy thing to bury.
    what
  • Deus_Ex_MachinaDeus_Ex_Machina Members Join Date: 2004-07-01 Member: 29674Posts: 242
    QUOTE (reasa @ Jul 2 2005, 04:40 PM)
    QUOTE (moultano @ Jul 2 2005, 04:35 PM)
    Karl Rove is the top advisor to President Bush. He's been his campaign strategist since the beginning.

    Here's everything about the Plame case: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valerie_Plame
    Basically, she was formerly a covert cia agent. Her husband was critical of the Bush administration, and someone in the Bush administration outed her to the press. That is a felony. It has just come to light that the person who released the information about her was Karl Rove.

    I wish you would stop speaking in riddles and just say what you mean in plain English.

    What's the problem reasa? Is it that time of month or are you just flustered because your idol turned out to be a traitor? moultano's posts are quite easy to understand if you speak English.
    QUOTE (Zig @ Jun 20 2004, 03:28 PM)
    PRECIPITATION MAKES ME SO F*ING HORNY OHHH GOD
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    I don't think Reasa appreciates being lumped in with the Bushies.

    (but then, I don't think moultano appreciates being lorded, either)
    what
  • The_FinchThe_Finch Members Join Date: 2002-11-13 Member: 8498Posts: 661
    It's possible, maybe, perhaps a smidgen, that Reasa was being sarcastic.
    QUOTE (X Stickman)
    America's Army taught me that I'm more likely to be shot in the back by my own teammates, then have my sexuality insulted as well as accusations made towards my mother's sex life. If it's a recruitment tool, it's a damn poor one.
  • Omega_DeathOmega_Death Sith apprentice to a box of Cereal Members Join Date: 2003-08-06 Member: 19042Posts: 558 Advanced user
    NO I refuse to believe it. I refuse to believe that anyone in the Bush administration will be held responsible for their crimes/misdoings. That's not how this works....
    QUOTE (Reasa)
    Some people need a good slap in the back of the head...with a cinder block.
  • reasareasa Members, Constellation Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 8010Posts: 2,367
    QUOTE (The Finch @ Jul 2 2005, 06:33 PM)
    It's possible, maybe, perhaps a smidgen, that Reasa was being sarcastic.

    Neeeeeeeevvvvar
  • DubbilexDubbilex Chump Members Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9799Posts: 2,016 Advanced user
    I think he's thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiis drunk!
    what
  • moultanomoultano Creator of ns_shiva. Members, NS1 Playtester, Contributor, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Gold, NS2 Community Developer, Pistachionauts Join Date: 2002-12-14 Member: 10806Posts: 4,219 Advanced user
    QUOTE (reasa @ Jul 2 2005, 07:01 PM)
    QUOTE (The Finch @ Jul 2 2005, 06:33 PM)
    It's possible, maybe, perhaps a smidgen, that Reasa was being sarcastic.

    Neeeeeeeevvvvar

    I think the rest of us are just too serious. smile-fix.gif
  • CommunistWithAGunCommunistWithAGun Local Propaganda Guy Members Join Date: 2003-04-30 Member: 15953Posts: 7,651 Advanced user
    QUOTE (Speed 2 Dave @ Jul 2 2005, 05:18 PM)
    worst case scenario Rove gets a presidential pardon and goes his merry way.

    "best case" scenario some runaway bride shows up that is actuallly attractive, distracts the population, they quickly and quietly have a trial where rove is found pseudo-responsible, but is punished with some sort of fine or jail term served under probation for all of a year.

    Everyone who is screaming and pointing fingers during this is just caught up in the hype, mostly brought from schemers like Karl Rove. Remember how much of a flip-flopper Kerry was? At least Bush always sticks with his plans, even after his reasoning for said plans has flip-flopped.

    The only people who deserve to be yelled at and have fingers pointed at them are the people who believed Iraq had WMD that would be found. Nobody's dumb enough to get caught with their pants down, especially when you have the US for an enemy. This news report will most likely just be a footnote in 2005.

    Yeah because plowing into 10 school children instead of a brick wall when your bus goes out of control is a very honorable thing to do.


    "Oh that bus driver was such a great man, even when faced with most certain doom he stood his course!"
    user posted image

    #BATTERY
  • Crono5Crono5 Members Join Date: 2003-07-22 Member: 18357Posts: 1,855
    edited July 2005
    QUOTE (CommunistWithAGun @ Jul 2 2005, 11:37 PM)
    QUOTE (Speed 2 Dave @ Jul 2 2005, 05:18 PM)
    worst case scenario Rove gets a presidential pardon and goes his merry way.

    "best case" scenario some runaway bride shows up that is actuallly attractive, distracts the population, they quickly and quietly have a trial where rove is found pseudo-responsible, but is punished with some sort of fine or jail term served under probation for all of a year.

    Everyone who is screaming and pointing fingers during this is just caught up in the hype, mostly brought from schemers like Karl Rove.  Remember how much of a flip-flopper Kerry was?  At least Bush always sticks with his plans, even after his reasoning for said plans has flip-flopped.

    The only people who deserve to be yelled at and have fingers pointed at them are the people who believed Iraq had WMD that would be found.  Nobody's dumb enough to get caught with their pants down, especially when you have the US for an enemy.  This news report will most likely just be a footnote in 2005.

    Yeah because plowing into 10 school children instead of a brick wall when your bus goes out of control is a very honorable thing to do.


    "Oh that bus driver was such a great man, even when faced with most certain doom he stood his course!"

    CWAG, that'd be the bus driver changing his plan, not his reasoning.

    EDIT: On second thought, I'm a retard. A sleep deprived retard.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
    image

    "See the bulletproof dress hanging from the clothesline?\See the medical chart with the random zig-zag?\Now I'll help it decide\I palindrome, I"
  • TommyVercettiTommyVercetti Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow Join Date: 2003-02-10 Member: 13390Posts: 2,510
    Didn't Jon Stewart say something along the lines of "With the Nixon administration they were trying to seal the well to make sure no leaks got out, with this administration it seems almost as if they're trying to... poison the well."

    The truth isn't powerful enough any more, even when people listen to it. Hearing is not enough. There has to be some thought involved.
    The above post is the result of sleep deprivation and something known as "teh awesumsawce."
    user posted image
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