B6 -> Public

a_civilian · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (dhakbar @ Feb 27 2005, 02:58 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Well, the relative death of the competitive clan scene would seem potential evidence.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
So far this year, the North American clan scene has expanded significantly. Can't speak for the foreign ones, though.

Ots · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Feb 27 2005, 06:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Idle side note: Many of us, myself included, are not native English speakers. Still, I'd very much appreciate if you tried for good English. That excludes words such as 'u', 'ppl', and so on. Put more bluntly: If you want me to invest time into reading your points, present them in a legible format.
 </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Now im really curious, cuz i though you were british...WHAT ARE YOU !?! AN ALIEN!? :O

TOmekki · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ots @ Feb 27 2005, 10:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Feb 27 2005, 06:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Idle side note: Many of us, myself included, are not native English speakers. Still, I'd very much appreciate if you tried for good English. That excludes words such as 'u', 'ppl', and so on. Put more bluntly: If you want me to invest time into reading your points, present them in a legible format.
</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Now im really curious, cuz i though you were british...WHAT ARE YOU !?! AN ALIEN!? :O  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showuser=75' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?showuser=75</a>

TommyVercetti · February 2005

NS will never die as long as the TerranGrunt is around.

I may be alone on the last server, but I'll be there <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' />.

Also, B6 is a very nice version, if you don't mind a ton of bugs in ns_veil. But they will be fixed before release.

To the people who say aliens have no chance: on every map in B6 aliens have more wins than Marines, at least according to the GamerPlanet stats.

Zunni · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>If it was unclear to me, it was likely unclear to others as well.
Thanks for the explanation though. When you're speaking of randomness, then yes, I agree.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Actually let me pubically apologize to you for that out-burst.. it was uncalled for.. my apologies.. bad night last night <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' />

Zunni · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Feb 26 2005, 10:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Travis Dane @ Feb 26 2005, 03:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Classic clanners go, and retarded combat players come in. That is not a good sign. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Love that attitude. Got any facts to back it up? </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Well, the relative death of the competitive clan scene would seem potential evidence.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Considering there are more CAL clans now then there was at the start of CAL this year, I'd say that suggests the opposite...

keep_it_Gangsta · February 2005

I dunno why you guys are trying to argue with my post

just hit refresh on your server browser

Laggasaurus · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Zunni @ Feb 27 2005, 11:16 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Nemesis Zero @ Feb 26 2005, 10:38 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Travis Dane @ Feb 26 2005, 03:30 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Classic clanners go, and retarded combat players come in. That is not a good sign. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Love that attitude. Got any facts to back it up? </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Well, the relative death of the competitive clan scene would seem potential evidence.</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>

Considering there are more CAL clans now then there was at the start of CAL this year, I'd say that suggests the opposite...</td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Ever thought of the world outside America... If you look at the European leagues it is just depressing seeing how many clans have become inactive/disbanded.

And Nemezis Zero by Competitive Clan scene he means those who play to better themselves and others therefore creating/maintaining a large high standard of clan play.

Secondly on the lack of people getting into the clan scene/learning to play NS in an advanced way, what happened to things like the NS Draft League?

Diablus · February 2005

I heard rumors about Pt's and Consties not playing b6 anymore. I hope this isn't true <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' />

Nemesis_Zero · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Laggasaurus @ Feb 27 2005, 06:33 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> And Nemezis Zero by Competitive Clan scene he means those who play to better themselves and others therefore creating/maintaining a large high standard of clan play.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
I am well aware of that. I'm just noting that not all clans are out there for the competition.

Diablus, there're usually filled servers, though the turnout is naturally lower than back when CM testing was the only way of playing Combat. PTs have scheduled game times.

ultranewb · February 2005

Don't confuse these two terms: changing and dying

Most NS scenes are <i>changing</i>, and the pesimist deems change as death. If you're seeing "more nubs" in general pub play, part of that is your perception because you've become a better player: congratulations. The other part is because the player base is not static - players will come and go - and combat has added another layer.

I'd hazard to guess that the easier-to-learn combat mode has attracted more new players. When an mixed mode NS server finally has enough for classic NS, there are going to be some players on that are currently mainly combat players. Then, the server empties after a poor round lacking in teamplay and rich in general chaos. It takes a heavy 'regular players' server base to counter-act this cycle.

Aaron · February 2005

BSD IS DYING

wait... what forum is this again...

Mystiqq · February 2005

...aaand back to waiting for NS:S... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd-fix.gif' />

Swiftspear · February 2005

aaron, you rock

devicenull · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TommyVercetti @ Feb 27 2005, 11:42 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> NS will never die as long as the TerranGrunt is around.

I may be alone on the last server, but I'll be there <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif' />.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
I'll be there with you.

The one thing I can ask of the dev's though, if NS truely dies (where its not being played by many people, the state of Science and Industry now), release the source! We have a very nice modding community, and I'd rather have 15 versions of it floating around then none at all.

KoniaX · February 2005

DEATH TO COMBAT!!!! FOR GODS SAKES ITS RUNING NS GAMES. IF YOU DONT BELIEVE JOIN A COMBAT ONLY SERVER AND WATCH THE CS PLAYERS STREAM IN AND CUSS OUT EVERYONE.

*ugh, im done with my rant now...*

Flyingcow · February 2005

combat mode removes a lot of blame a team can get. usually its " retards, no gorge"

or "retards no welder"

it reduces the whining after the end game.

i think its fun that i dont have to depend on my team or a commander.

Curlydave1 · February 2005

I'll be honest: I can't stand CO and my favorite servers runnign too much of it was a huge contributin to my long break from NS. The only time I find it appropriate is when there are fewer than 6 people in a server, which gives the alien team a significant advantage over the marines. Combat was initially advertised as a simple solution to this problem, but it's overgrown its purpose and in turn has spread NS to the masses-for better and for worse. The masses include many people who I do not wish to play NS with... That, and I don't find combat mode fun.

The only reason why I still play this game on the very-dated Half-Life engine is because of the great unique, slow-paced and heavily team-based gameplay NS provides. The Combat gamestyle doesn't fit the mold. I'd rather just play HL2dm or ETF.

Traken · February 2005

What I find semi-funny is that a clan I play with (I'm not in it) plays CO 95% of the time. There's like 3 decent comms that ever play there (including me). And here's the kicker: They're trying to get ready for Cal... <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' />

kabab · February 2005

Clan scene in Australia is practicaly DEAD, the average player skill level in Pub server is just near pathetic now its very painful playing pub now. Since beta 5 NS in Australia has headed on a downward spiral, most of the experince player based has simply stopped playing until beta 6 comes out..

Beta NS3 was the worst thing ever to happen to NS from my perspective.

Toothy · February 2005

Why are people only counting 'skilled' players? Surely every player counts as 1, a player's skill at a game doesn't really indicate his or her value to it's popularity.

Swiftspear · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Toothy @ Feb 28 2005, 01:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Why are people only counting 'skilled' players? Surely every player counts as 1, a player's skill at a game doesn't really indicate his or her value to it's popularity.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
The clan scene of any given mod will be one of the leading forces for keeping the mod alive. A mod without a clan scene is aproaching critical mass, and probably does not have much of a lengthy existance left in store for it. If a mod isn't fun enough for groups of skilled players to master and play together, then it probably won't propagate indefintely amoung the lower levels of players for too long.

A clan scene isn't needed persay, a clan scene is just a sign that the game is still good, since all the people who have put the most time into the game deem that the game still can possibly remain fun for a seemingly indefinate ammount of time.

A game that hasn't attracted a clan scene will only do so because it is to boring to be worth mastering, or doesn't allow for multiplayer play.

kabab · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Toothy @ Feb 28 2005, 01:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Why are people only counting 'skilled' players? Surely every player counts as 1, a player's skill at a game doesn't really indicate his or her value to it's popularity.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
I'm sorry but i don't agree a healthy competative clan sence draws more people to the game the hight of popularity for Ns in Aus was V2.01 when the clan sence was super competative during this same period alot of new people got drawn to NS and the level of play in pubs was fantastic!

Soylent_green · February 2005

Combat was a big step backwards from my perspective. The number of NS players and servers has been roughly the same for a long time, but CO diluted the number of available populated servers with a game mode I cannot stand playing.

Kwil · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kabab @ Feb 28 2005, 01:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Toothy @ Feb 28 2005, 01:25 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Why are people only counting 'skilled' players? Surely every player counts as 1, a player's skill at a game doesn't really indicate his or her value to it's popularity. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
I'm sorry but i don't agree a healthy competative clan sence draws more people to the game the hight of popularity for Ns in Aus was V2.01 when the clan sence was super competative during this same period alot of new people got drawn to NS and the level of play in pubs was fantastic!  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
I call BS. A clan scene doesn't draw new players to the game. Hell, I didn't even know there was a clan scene when I started playing. What draws people to the game is, wonder of wonders, a good game.

A clan scene, as stated, is merely evidence that a good game exists.

That said, if you maintain the "good" game at only the clan level, you get some of what we're seeing now. As clan players naturally leave for other things there are fewer new players to replace them and keep the clan scene fully vitalized.

So what you wind up with is a number of 'elite' players who are unable to see the problems that the lower skill levels are having and proclaim "Nope! Nothing wrong here! Don't change a thing," which, if heeded, slowly morphs to "Man, what's happened to all the clans?" which eventually changes to "Hey.. remember that game.. what was it called?"

Just to repeat: A good clan scene does not make a good game. A good game makes a good clan scene.

Prometheus1 · February 2005

I play since 1.04 and I still see the same players around on the servers i play most,
of course people leave ns, hey it's 3 years old, but new players come.

But yes it's true a lot of players desperately wait for B6.

And don't forget everybody is a noob at the beginning, you only can improve if you play.

kabab · February 2005

The game is just not growing the player base is staying the same size or shrinking <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /> look at the growth CS enjoyed! if NS could only muster 1/4 of that it would be great for all!!

Lets see what beta 6 brings to the table.

Swiftspear · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (kabab @ Feb 28 2005, 08:04 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The game is just not growing the player base is staying the same size or shrinking <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad-fix.gif' /> look at the growth CS enjoyed! if NS could only muster 1/4 of that it would be great for all!!

Lets see what beta 6 brings to the table.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
NS came out so much later then CS I don't think a growthspurt of that size is really that plausable. Any mod sporting a five year old engine isn't going to attract that most massive raving fanbase in the world. It's wierd, but it's almost like half the gaming comunity doesn't really know what a "mod" is...

spinviper · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 28 2005, 05:00 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Combat was a big step backwards from my perspective. The number of NS players and servers has been roughly the same for a long time, but CO diluted the number of available populated servers with a game mode I cannot stand playing.  </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> 
Agreed

RaVe · February 2005

</div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (spinviper @ Feb 28 2005, 08:45 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> </div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Soylent green @ Feb 28 2005, 05:00 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Combat was a big step backwards from my perspective. The number of NS players and servers has been roughly the same for a long time, but CO diluted the number of available populated servers with a game mode I cannot stand playing. </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Agreed </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'>
Quoted because they took the words out of my mouth.

Combat has become mainstream now compared to Classic. Mainly because it is MUCH easier to play, and has a much better learning curve than Classic.

Amazing how a mode originally intended to be a sort of training mode and an alternate turns into mainstream <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' />

B6 -> Public

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