Supposed "911 Conspiracy Smoking Gun"
RyoOhki
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12789Members
Join Date: 2003-01-26 Member: 12789Members
in Discussions
<div class="IPBDescription">Were explosives used?</div> <a href='http://www.911uncovered.com/twintowers.html' target='_blank'>Link with lots of videos (warning 56kers)</a>
I'm not saying I support what this site has said. Nor am I really convinced by their evidence. But I'm curious as to how others might see this. It's one of the better 911 conspiracy stories I've seen.
I'm not saying I support what this site has said. Nor am I really convinced by their evidence. But I'm curious as to how others might see this. It's one of the better 911 conspiracy stories I've seen.
Comments
Basically? There's so much BS and plotholes that any point that they may actually have is completely missed. The bottom line is, nothing like this has happened before. Those "geysers" are interesting, but certainly do not nessesarily point to controlled explosions. To them? It can be nothing else. After all, more fuel for their fire.
Pretty much my thoughts as well.
Ive seen some long discussions of this around, and theres a number of interesting points which hint towards odd or not fully explainable goings on... (vertical fall? steel melting? etc...)
and the things which happened at the pentagon didnt help this situation (the size of the hole etc..)
however the part where this idea falls down in my opinion is that there would have had to have been a series of explosive devices placed in an office environment without any of the people there (including the firefighters) noticing.
Appart from being a logistic nightmare, I'm having trouble believing anyone could allow somthing like this to happen (although thats hardly proof of anything)
Ive heard people talk of proving the case either way, and it seems in a case like this where there are multiple anomalies, that we cant really say anything without knowing much more about what happened (somthing the Bush admin has been trying to stall/ pervert at every step of the way, Max Cleland anyone?).
anyway, without trying to drag this into another reason to bash bush, Ill sum up by saying I dont believe Bush or anyone in the admin plotted to make these events happen, however they certainly capitalised on what happened to further their politcal ideas and ambitions, and the jury is still out on wether their inaction at the critical moment was deliberate.
The shaped charges that are supposedly going off do raise some doubts, but the siesmic readings *before* the towers collapsed is something that I find shocking.
The buildings do appear to bulge out and then crumble inwards, I'm still looking at the site
either way it's interesting
Example: "You can see the shaped charges going off!"
Rebuttal: "6,000 tons of concrete pancaking a floor is going to produce a ton of air pressure, with very little place to go. Of course it's going to blow out the windows. It's not going to go down to the floor below. It's not going to shoot out the roof. It only has one place to go: Out the windows. In some places, a lot went out only a few windows first. In others, it blew out parts of the whole floor. Dumb ****."
Example: "There were seismic shocks before they collapsed!"
Rebuttal: "Anyone who has ever demolished a building will tell you the same thing: It's LOUD. TNT or 'shaped charges' or whatever you call it doesn't just go 'POOF'. It produces a VERY loud 'crack'. The amount of explosives required on each floor to bring it down would've filled the city of New York with the sound of firecrackers. Footage of a building being demolished miles away, you can hear the 'POP POPPOP POW' of the charges. The WTC had cameras in the air, on the ground, very close... and you hear... NOTHING. Furthermore, the seismic shocks can easilly have been caused by parts of the interior collapsing first."
Example: "The second plane hit no where near the center to melt the central column!"
Rebuttal: "So wait... the first plane hit dead on... and that building collapsed straight down. The second plane almost missed and took out the side... and that building collapsed out the side and slid off. So you're saying the FBI / CIA / NSA / whoever ran up there, readjusted all the explosives, and made it slide off the side. Furthermore, all the post-9/11 structural investigations shows that the central column actually had very little to do with the collapse, but it was the FLOORS ATTACHED TO THE EXTERIOR that broke, causing enough weight to drop floor after floor onto each other, evidenced by the fact that you see the CENTER of the building collapse LAST, and the EXTERIOR collapse FIRST. Finally, this idea that it 'missed' and 'couldn't have caused the collapse' utterly contradicts your idea that they used explosives: All your 'evidence' says that the charges can be seen going off... on the EXTERIOR of the building. So if the second plane blowing up on the outer edge wasn't ever going to collapse the building, then why the hell would some explosives going off on the outside do it either?"
Finally, they act under the impression that the FBI is a super-secret government agency, a misconception caused by watching the X-Files too much. The FBI is simply a government-funded police force, nothing more.
If you take ANY of this seriously... man, you have problems.
If you take ANY of this seriously... man, you have problems. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Seconded.
People have a way of letting their imaginations run wild then accidentally making it out to be fact.
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->It's one of the better 911 conspiracy <b>stories</b> I've seen. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I missed this the first time around. Your right it is a nice story, ending needs some work though. But it is not true.
Which is exactly why this thread needs Eviscerator to stay alive.
What happened to him anyway....did the government finally get around to killing him? <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
the debris consistent with a mid air explosion.
Looks pretty sufficient for damage a plane would cause to a building like the Pentagon, let’s not forget that this building was built like a fortress, by military engineers. The side that the plane had hit was also recently coated with a special kevlar substance, as part of a large restoration that had been going on throughout the entire building.
But the simplest way to prove that a plane, and nothing but a plane hit the Pentagon, is the fact that people on that plane are in fact dead.
<a href='http://renovation.pentagon.mil/Phoenix/Press%20Archive/01-09-12_cnn_pentagon.htm' target='_blank'>http://renovation.pentagon.mil/Phoenix/Pre...nn_pentagon.htm</a>
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Barbara Olson, a conservative commentator and lawyer, was on board that flight, and she alerted her husband, Solicitor General Ted Olson, that the plane was being hijacked, Ted Olson told CNN.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
So she was on board that cruise missile making a call to her husband?
These idiots that made that site overlooked the simplest of evidence that refutes their claims 100%.
Edit: Consider your conspiracy story pwnd.
<a href='http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/09/11/pentagon.olson/' target='_blank'>http://www.cnn.com/2001/US/09/11/pentagon.olson/</a>
<a href='http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.center/victims/AA77.victims.html' target='_blank'>http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2001/trade.cen...77.victims.html</a>
Appart from being a logistic nightmare, I'm having trouble believing anyone could allow somthing like this to happen (although thats hardly proof of anything)<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Not to mention how they managed to put missile "pods" on the aircraft before takeoff
<!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
/off-topic
It's interesting that the same can be said of those who still claim there were WMDs in Iraq <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Melatonin does raise a good point; regardless of whether Bush was involved in the S-11 attacks (and I don't believe he was), he certainly capitalised upon it.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
/off-topic
It's interesting that the same can be said of those who still claim there were WMDs in Iraq <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html//emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Melatonin does raise a good point; regardless of whether Bush was involved in the S-11 attacks (and I don't believe he was), he certainly capitalised upon it. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Off-topic it may be, but these are more important issues than this conspiracy. Hell, as far as the evidence goes, the Weapons of Mass Destruction expounded upon over and over again by the Bush Administration is just as much of a fiction as the missile theory of this conspiracy theory is. Bush certainly did Capitalize on the 9-11 attacks, to the point that when it was all said and done, and his profit ratios from Afganistan turned out to be poor, he turned his crosshairs on Iraq and invented a reason to attack it.
Yes Saddam Hussein is a criminal and a monster for what he did to his own people. A political leader's duty, and this is my firm belief, is to <b>serve his people</b>. Hussein and his ungodly children broke this rule on far too many levels.
But it is also my firm belief that Bush and indeed too many of <i>my fellow American's</i> have little to no respect for the Iraqi civilians they are trying to save. I mean, Afganistan's people are viewed the same way, now the country is left to its own devices, but while life is better than it was under the Taliban regime, the people are neglected after the war, women's rights are horribly horribly trampled upon still for example.
Sorry for my explosion, but while we focus on conspiracies, we deny other very important matters the time they deserve. Perhaps this belongs in another thread. Tell me, and I shall start my own, but I think that it is quite a conspiracy that the mainstream media does not bother to do much coverage on these matters. (Except of course, good old NPR, who I can still trust to be a kind hearted soul.)
Prior to the attacks, sections of the Pentagon were being remodeled and new office systems were being installed. My company was supplying a good share of the furniture. I even saw a video that summer that included a foam rubber encased keyboard tray that I helped design. Good times.
Anyway, the project leader for our systems was running late that day. She had passed through security, driven around looking for a place to park, and then took some time getting her bags and such out of her car. She was standing in the parking lot when the plane hit. If she had been on time that day she might have been working in that exact area.
There is no theory regarding that plane hitting the side of the Pentagon.
Which is the reason people support these things even with many solid facts proveing them wrong.