<!--QuoteBegin-Ryo-Ohki+Feb 14 2004, 09:00 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ryo-Ohki @ Feb 14 2004, 09:00 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> By bringing up the Nazism example, I simply wished to try and show that opinions and views are very much shaped by location and time. We, the citizens of western democratic nations, naturally think our way is best. But who's to say that we are the best, or that our way is right? Neither of you answered that question; you started off with the viewpoint that we are the best so everyone else naturally should agree with us. What's better than democracy you ask? Whatever you want. Democracy, just like every other governing system, is neither better or worse than any others. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> You simply wished to try and show that opinions and views are very much shaped by location and time?!? And you used Nazism to show that? That is really, really pathetic. Nazism is on the far opposite spectrum of what is being discussed. Nazism adds absolutely nothing to this discussion.
You think we didn't answer your question? Well, maybe you should answer ours first. Find something that is better than democracy ( and don't just use US democracy, because I've said it multiple times thus far that democracy can take many forms ). Find something that is better. Don't say whatever you want. That doesn't cut it. That isn't an answer. Democracy, by its very nature, is freedom. More freedom than any other system can offer. People want freedom... And if their government does not give them that, then how can that be what they want?
You still do not get it... We've given them freedom... Democracy follows that naturally. The core concept to democracy is that everyone is represented. That everyone has freedom. Its not being forced on them.... That is the way they wanted to go. They wanted freedom. They now have it. They wanted the ability to choose. They now have it. They wanted to be able to speak without fear of reprisal. They now have it.
Now answer the question... What else is better for the people? This does not mean what those in power want. What do the people want?
Why should these people have democracy? Because it is best. Because it is what they want.
What makes my opinion that democracy is best right? Because I do not believe it is wrong. Because democracy will give all the people of Iraq the freedom they desire, deserve and have been denied for three decades.
What evidence is there to show that the Western democracies have it wrong? None. What evidence is there to show that other's have it wrong? Plenty. Lets start with Nazism... Or communism... Or dictatorships...
Once more, since it seems to escape so many. Freedom is the pre-cursor to democracy. Democracy, by its very nature cannot be forced on a people. That goes against the very ideals of democracy.
This is all any people would want that has been oppressed for 30 years. This is why I would welcome an invasion if it freed my people ( but afterwards the invaders better get the heck out ).
Stop jumping around the issue and start saying why democracy is not best for people. Why democracy is not the best system out there. Reasons... Not rhetorical non-sense.
Ok, ok, fine. I've given my answer to the question posed at the start of the thread, so I will now go. I've no more desire to continue this discussion. You win, congratulations.
Comments
You simply wished to try and show that opinions and views are very much shaped by location and time?!? And you used Nazism to show that? That is really, really pathetic. Nazism is on the far opposite spectrum of what is being discussed. Nazism adds absolutely nothing to this discussion.
You think we didn't answer your question? Well, maybe you should answer ours first. Find something that is better than democracy ( and don't just use US democracy, because I've said it multiple times thus far that democracy can take many forms ). Find something that is better. Don't say whatever you want. That doesn't cut it. That isn't an answer. Democracy, by its very nature, is freedom. More freedom than any other system can offer. People want freedom... And if their government does not give them that, then how can that be what they want?
You still do not get it... We've given them freedom... Democracy follows that naturally. The core concept to democracy is that everyone is represented. That everyone has freedom. Its not being forced on them.... That is the way they wanted to go. They wanted freedom. They now have it. They wanted the ability to choose. They now have it. They wanted to be able to speak without fear of reprisal. They now have it.
Now answer the question... What else is better for the people? This does not mean what those in power want. What do the people want?
Why should these people have democracy? Because it is best. Because it is what they want.
What makes my opinion that democracy is best right? Because I do not believe it is wrong. Because democracy will give all the people of Iraq the freedom they desire, deserve and have been denied for three decades.
What evidence is there to show that the Western democracies have it wrong? None. What evidence is there to show that other's have it wrong? Plenty. Lets start with Nazism... Or communism... Or dictatorships...
Once more, since it seems to escape so many. Freedom is the pre-cursor to democracy. Democracy, by its very nature cannot be forced on a people. That goes against the very ideals of democracy.
This is all any people would want that has been oppressed for 30 years. This is why I would welcome an invasion if it freed my people ( but afterwards the invaders better get the heck out ).
Stop jumping around the issue and start saying why democracy is not best for people. Why democracy is not the best system out there. Reasons... Not rhetorical non-sense.