<!--QuoteBegin--Smoke Nova+Dec 17 2003, 08:44 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Smoke Nova @ Dec 17 2003, 08:44 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Never judge the movie completely on the theatrical release. Wait till the extended till you really pass judgement. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> you like DX2, too? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
it was teh **** awesome GFG!!!during the movie i felt like standing up and yelling
"FOR *****!!!!! (put * because it might be a spoiler) i managed to hold my self back ^^ i thought the ending was a little carried out...i was wanting to get out of there. AWESOME MOVIE GO SEE IT NOW!!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->yeah, that and the shire not being taken over by dudes. i was a little disappointed by that. however, by then, i didn't care much.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Well Jackson knew that the Scouring of the Shire was an important part of the storyline, but when you try and make books into a screenplay, you can see that some things just don't work. The Shire is one of those parts. The natural climax of the movie is the destruction of the Ring and the downfall of Sauron; putting in a tiny battle scene and a bunch of hobbit-stuff after that leaves the audience saying "Why?". After seeing the sheer scale of the Battle of Pellanor Fields, the Scouring would just seem weak, or worse, make people laugh. I am glad though that apparently the Grey Havens are in the movie.
Personally I think Jackson has done a superb job. I havn't seen the 3rd movie yet, but if it's anything like the first two it will be awesome. Translating Tolkien's work into the medium of film is a daunting task to say the very least, but Jackson managed it, and in the process captivated audiences all the way around the world.
LikuI, am the Somberlain.Join Date: 2003-01-10Member: 12128Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Renegade+Dec 17 2003, 12:27 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Renegade @ Dec 17 2003, 12:27 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--Liku+Dec 16 2003, 08:02 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Liku @ Dec 16 2003, 08:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--MrPink+Dec 16 2003, 08:11 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MrPink @ Dec 16 2003, 08:11 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> it sucked like all the other lotr's <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> You're a man of taste, have a cool point.
I'm waiting for Maddox to p!ss all over it. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh dear god. Not Maddox <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> Damn Teenangsters. Where's MonsE when you need him? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I forgot when 20+ is teen... Hmm... ~_^
SPOILER!
The Shire becoming taken over was taken out!? What about everyone leaving Middle Earth?
It was splendid. It seems that finally Peter Jackson has finally broken the Part 3 curse, making a film that is beautiful, powerful, and pleasing to all the fans and all the critics. My goodness, the battle scenes (two of them) were awesome! Think Braveheart, now multiply be three. But there's one other CG creation that steals the show: Shelob. The first time you see her, you're saying to yourself: "She is NOT CG". Maybe she isn't. Regardless, it's probably the trilogy's most scariest monster, swift and deadly. I also like how close to the book this film is. It's nice that Shelob is now in RotK, because that's how things are timeline-wise. But there are more exact plot points and dialogue that seemed to be ripped right out of the pages, especially the final shot with Samwise. Music was, of course, great with two new themes: the Gondor them (played with splendour as Gandalf rides up the seven levels of Minas Tirith) and a new Hero theme that is sung in the credits. Minas Tirith is beautiful. If I ever want a vacation home, that'll be it. It's all about SCALE! All the actors are very good, nobody ruins it (not even Elijah). I'm afraid Legolas and Gimli are pushed a bit in the back (though Gimli delivers some excellent lines, and you get to see Legolas do some "cool shizzle" again). Any gripes? Well, Arwen seems to pop in and out, in and out. The film is long (3hrs 20min., not including credits); although I didn't mind, some might. The ending is tier-ed. There are copious amounts of fade-to-blacks, and you're just about to give a standing ovation when it continues. I've never seen this before, so it was awkward for me. But I guess a trilogy of this scope deserves "multiple endings" (as Yahoo! has coined it). And the fact that it has ended: what is bound to be one of the greatest trilogies of all time, saddens me. Peter Jackson has truly delivered something magnificent that will no doubt stand the test of time. It will join Star Wars and Indiana Jones as some of the best and unforgettable cinema we have seen or have come to imagine. Props to the Cast and Crew.
Ok, here's my logic: If this film does not get at the very least a best director Oscar, I shall forever condemn the event! With that out of the way, here are the Oscars it should deserve. <b>Best Picture Best Director: Peter Jackson Best Cinematography: Andrew Lesnie Best Art Direction Best Production Design Bets Special Effects: WETA Best Musical Score: Howard Shore Best Supporting Actor: Sean Astin as Samwise Gamgee Ah heck, just sweep the darn thing already! </b>
Some responses to fellow forum mates (SPOILERS): I believe that the theatrical release is the one to be judged. Peter Jackson does not have a Director's Cut, the Extended Editions are purely for the true fans who just want more. Jackson is at heart a film-maker, he knows when he needs to cut.
Aragorn's "army" has a part in the Battle of the Pelennor Fields in the novel as well.
Everyone leaving Middle Earth? You must mean the Elves, and they showed that. As for the Scouring being left out, it was anti-climatic, a BIG no-no in film. Once again, as much as Jackson would like to please fans, he is still a film-maker by heart and by profession.
The Shire becoming taken over was taken out!? What about everyone leaving Middle Earth?
SPOILER! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> SPOi..... frick that, if you haven't seen the movie, why are you posting in "reflections on rotk" anyway?
anyways, no, that's there. just the shire part was takin out.
I'll probably end up seeing RoTK next week in Michagan and I'm hoping it's as bad a** as it seems.
Great reviews guys, I feel I can always trust any review given in this forum more then any other, there are just less Matrix fanboys I guess... or maybe alot more LoTR fanboys. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> Whatever, thanks for taking your time to post your review, especially those of you who did it right after you saw the midnight screening. My hat off to you. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Javert+Dec 17 2003, 06:57 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Javert @ Dec 17 2003, 06:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Ok, here's my logic: If this film does not get at the very least a best director Oscar, I shall forever condemn the event! With that out of the way, here are the Oscars it should deserve. <b>Best Picture Best Director: Peter Jackson Best Cinematography: Andrew Lesnie Best Art Direction Best Production Design Bets Special Effects: WETA Best Musical Score: Howard Shore Best Supporting Actor: Sean Astin as Samwise Gamgee Ah heck, just sweep the darn thing already! </b> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> I know how you feel. I still haven't forgiven them for giving the Oscar to Adrian Brody instead of Daniel Day Lewis.
<!--QuoteBegin--Javert+Dec 18 2003, 02:57 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Javert @ Dec 18 2003, 02:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> It will join Star Wars and Indiana Jones as some of the best and unforgettable cinema we have seen or have come to imagine. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> This is actually something I've been thinking of for a fair share of time by now: What'll be this 'generations' (horribly overused term, I know) Star Wars? Star Wars disqualified itself early on (no 3rd part, no matter how good, will make me forgive the Midichlorians), Matrix started strong, but then turned into this generations 'Highlander' (one great movie, two so-so sequels); LotR stands alone. I hope Jackson will continue to make The Hobbit, which is in many aspects a lot easier to convert into a movie. Oh, and if he gets to convert some of the more interesting parts of the Silmarillion, I wouldn't be too angry, either <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->When Aragorn said "No my friends, you bow to no one." I almost cried tears of joy.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Absolutely. The scene is built up making your realize that Aragorn is now pretty much sovereign of the whole of Middle Earth, and then this. Just beautiful.
By the way, what are your favorite scenes? To me, it was Aragorns "For Frodo." - line for reasons I think are obvious.
tankefuglOne Script To Rule Them All...Trondheim, NorwayJoin Date: 2002-11-14Member: 8641Members, Retired Developer, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue
Best part: The counter-attack lead by Faramir when Pippin sang to Denethor.
I wish there was more of Eowyn, though <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->By the way, what are your favorite scenes?<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
There are three that really stood out in my mind.
1) When Denethor's burning body hurls itself off Gondor's walls. The way he ran, and the way he fell, and then how the camera just zoomed out and you realized that it was probably impossible to see from outside the walls. Just the feeling I got, that in the end Denethor's demise was still really minor compared to everything happening around it.
2) When Frodo and Sam are lying on the slopes of Mount Doom, right before Sam starts carrying Frodo. The landscape, the two hobbits in that one shot. Pure. Genius.
3) The charge of the oliphaunts. Simply put, the best scene I have seen this year. The way the <i>haradrim</i> looked was brilliant. The structures atop the huge animals were only seen briefly, but I still got a feeling that they were definitely real, and very plausible.
My only question is that why didn't the White City have any Snowspeeders handy?
Saw it last night and think it is by far the most amazing film I have ever seen, this trilogy tops even the Star Wars trilogy imo it's that good! Seeing the Riders of Rohan come in the nick of time and sound their horns for the charge made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. Then as they charged to Orcs and rode them into the ground was pure class.
Anyone notice how that disfigured orc chief looked very similar to a character in one of Peter Jackson's film 'Bad Taste' ? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
My favourite sceen in the film had to be in the final battle when it was going bad with the flying Nazgul causing problems again, then that moth appears to Gandalf; the one that took a message for him when he was imprisoned by sauraman. The Merry (I think) looks up and yells 'EAGLES! the Eagles have come!' then out the sky some massive eagles come swooping down and proceed to give the flying Nazgul a royal arse kicking. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> Best bit of the film for me.
Gimli has the best line in the film, when legolas gracefully takes down the Oliphant, he replies with "that still only counts as one!" <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
The Charge of the Rohirrim was great, just awesome to watch them plow through all those Orcs.
The witch King Vs Eowyn "Fool! no man can destroy me!" Pippin stabs him in the leg, Eowyn takes off her helmet and says "I am no man" and stabs him right in the face. Taken right from the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1.) The last part back at the shire... with the... stuff...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2.) The last boat right at the end...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3.) The ball being thrown from the tower....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I didn't like the movie because frankly I think they changed the book way too much. If that makes me a jackass Tolkien fanatic, then I don't care. I just didn't really enjoy it.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1.) The last part back at the shire... with the... stuff...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2.) The last boat right at the end...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Infinitum+Dec 18 2003, 12:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Infinitum @ Dec 18 2003, 12:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> No. It was never shot. You must of seen images of them filming the small homage to it from FOTR, when Frodo looks into the little elven basin, and sees the shire burning.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->I hope Jackson will continue to make The Hobbit, which is in many aspects a lot easier to convert into a movie. Oh, and if he gets to convert some of the more interesting parts of the Silmarillion, I wouldn't be too angry, either <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh Jackson wants to do them, and heck New Line Cinemas would write a blank check for the rights. Unfortunatly, the Tolkien estate doesn't want it done; they don't like the movies and have no intention of selling the rights to the rest of Tolkien's work. Which sucks royally.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. Never shot. It was cut out of the films a long way back, because as I've previously stated, it wrecks the entire ending. I'm quite happy for Jackson to cut it; he made the right decision here.
I finally managed to track down the actual story about this now infamous scene being cut. According to Peter Jackson, in an interview done a short time ago, the scene with Wormtonge and Sauruman at Isengard was actually originally positioned at the end of The Two Towers. Obviously, it didn't really fit the movie, and it was axed early in the editing process. Jackson did like the scene however, and decided to add it into The Return of the King Extended Edition. It was never in RoTK and it was never cut.
When you think about it, you can easily see why the scene was axed from TTT and not added onto the theatrical release of RoTK. Put it at the end of TTT, and you make the ending far too long, detracting from the climax of Helms Deep and the destruction of Isenguard. Put it in RoTK, and you draw emphasis away from Sauron. Sauruman is the villian of TTT; Sauron is a side-show at best. RoTK though is all about Mordor and Sauron, and as such the attention should be firmly upon the Dark Lord, not Sauruman. The ending of TTT makes it pretty clear that Sauruman has been defeated; his army is vanquished and his fortress taken. There's just no need to drag it out more.
Bigwig, I can understand your sentiments, but when you try and convert some books into film, things have to be changed. If the movies had been exactly the same as the books, the movies would have bombed big time. The Two Towers probably would never have even been made. I say this with absolute certainty. I think that Jackson's work is simply amazing, and though others may not agree with me, I'm delighted that millions of people across the world who would never have read the books have now seen this magnificent story.
<!--QuoteBegin--Ryo-Ohki+Dec 18 2003, 11:45 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Ryo-Ohki @ Dec 18 2003, 11:45 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. Never shot. It was cut out of the films a long way back, because as I've previously stated, it wrecks the entire ending. I'm quite happy for Jackson to cut it; he made the right decision here. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Dude, I seriously saw shots for this... it had burning mills and everything happening...
My fingers will be crossed for Extended Addition inclusion.
Infinitum...did you read what I wrote above at all? The burning mills and stuff are from Fellowship of the Ring. When Frodo looks into the basin of water he sees the shire burning. That is what you saw. Nothing more.
<!--QuoteBegin--supernorn2000+Dec 19 2003, 12:23 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (supernorn2000 @ Dec 19 2003, 12:23 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Infinitum...did you read what I wrote above at all? The burning mills and stuff are from Fellowship of the Ring. When Frodo looks into the basin of water he sees the shire burning. That is what you saw. Nothing more. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> sorry... missed it.
<!--QuoteBegin--TenSix+Dec 17 2003, 10:31 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TenSix @ Dec 17 2003, 10:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->When Aragorn said "No my friends, you bow to no one." I almost cried tears of joy.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> So true, so true. The whole "coronation scene" was moving tbh.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Oh Jackson wants to do them, and heck New Line Cinemas would write a blank check for the rights. Unfortunatly, the Tolkien estate doesn't want it done; they don't like the movies and have no intention of selling the rights to the rest of Tolkien's work. Which sucks royally.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Let me tell you a little story about how the Tolkien Estate works: When a complete translation of 'Beowulf', one of the LotRs main sources of inspiration, by Tolkien was discovered in the Oxford libary a few years ago, the Tolkien Estate blocked any advance in publishing it. Some years and a lot of shouting and checkwriting later, it hit the prints. A definite 'No.' from the Tolkien Estate means as much as 'Wait while we think it through.'. So, in short, I'm still hoping <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Come now folks, The Tolkien Estate is money-hungry.
Peter Jackson directing The Hobbit will = more money will = it will be made, just not for a while.
and I, for one, think that Peter Jackson did a brilliant job of taking a bloody boring book (it is great, but so boring at times) and turning it into one of the best film trilogies EVER. Throughout Two Towers, I was muttering, "how the hell did they get someone that ugly? What are the likeliness that Gollum is that ugly in real-life without all the makeup"...then I realized he was CG.
Actually, I can understand that the Estate is boiling over the movies - 'cause they don't see a single cent from it. Tolkien sold the movie rights in a moment of financial trouble for 40.000 Pounds to the creators of the (horrible) animation movie. New Line bought it from them.
LikuI, am the Somberlain.Join Date: 2003-01-10Member: 12128Members
<!--QuoteBegin--Javert+Dec 17 2003, 07:57 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Javert @ Dec 17 2003, 07:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Everyone leaving Middle Earth? You must mean the Elves, and they showed that. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> No... I mean Frodo and Bilbo[I think Gandalf joins too].. Legolas and Gimli, I forgot whoelse, I think that's it.
Comments
you like DX2, too? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
"FOR *****!!!!! (put * because it might be a spoiler) i managed to hold my self back ^^ i thought the ending was a little carried out...i was wanting to get out of there. AWESOME MOVIE GO SEE IT NOW!!
Well Jackson knew that the Scouring of the Shire was an important part of the storyline, but when you try and make books into a screenplay, you can see that some things just don't work. The Shire is one of those parts. The natural climax of the movie is the destruction of the Ring and the downfall of Sauron; putting in a tiny battle scene and a bunch of hobbit-stuff after that leaves the audience saying "Why?". After seeing the sheer scale of the Battle of Pellanor Fields, the Scouring would just seem weak, or worse, make people laugh. I am glad though that apparently the Grey Havens are in the movie.
Personally I think Jackson has done a superb job. I havn't seen the 3rd movie yet, but if it's anything like the first two it will be awesome. Translating Tolkien's work into the medium of film is a daunting task to say the very least, but Jackson managed it, and in the process captivated audiences all the way around the world.
You're a man of taste, have a cool point.
I'm waiting for Maddox to p!ss all over it. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Oh dear god. Not Maddox <!--emo&:angry:--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/mad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='mad.gif'><!--endemo--> Damn Teenangsters. Where's MonsE when you need him? <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I forgot when 20+ is teen... Hmm... ~_^
SPOILER!
The Shire becoming taken over was taken out!? What about everyone leaving Middle Earth?
SPOILER!
My goodness, the battle scenes (two of them) were awesome! Think Braveheart, now multiply be three. But there's one other CG creation that steals the show: Shelob. The first time you see her, you're saying to yourself: "She is NOT CG". Maybe she isn't. Regardless, it's probably the trilogy's most scariest monster, swift and deadly.
I also like how close to the book this film is. It's nice that Shelob is now in RotK, because that's how things are timeline-wise. But there are more exact plot points and dialogue that seemed to be ripped right out of the pages, especially the final shot with Samwise.
Music was, of course, great with two new themes: the Gondor them (played with splendour as Gandalf rides up the seven levels of Minas Tirith) and a new Hero theme that is sung in the credits. Minas Tirith is beautiful. If I ever want a vacation home, that'll be it. It's all about SCALE!
All the actors are very good, nobody ruins it (not even Elijah). I'm afraid Legolas and Gimli are pushed a bit in the back (though Gimli delivers some excellent lines, and you get to see Legolas do some "cool shizzle" again).
Any gripes? Well, Arwen seems to pop in and out, in and out. The film is long (3hrs 20min., not including credits); although I didn't mind, some might. The ending is tier-ed. There are copious amounts of fade-to-blacks, and you're just about to give a standing ovation when it continues. I've never seen this before, so it was awkward for me. But I guess a trilogy of this scope deserves "multiple endings" (as Yahoo! has coined it). And the fact that it has ended: what is bound to be one of the greatest trilogies of all time, saddens me. Peter Jackson has truly delivered something magnificent that will no doubt stand the test of time. It will join Star Wars and Indiana Jones as some of the best and unforgettable cinema we have seen or have come to imagine.
Props to the Cast and Crew.
Ok, here's my logic: If this film does not get at the very least a best director Oscar, I shall forever condemn the event! With that out of the way, here are the Oscars it should deserve.
<b>Best Picture
Best Director: Peter Jackson
Best Cinematography: Andrew Lesnie
Best Art Direction
Best Production Design
Bets Special Effects: WETA
Best Musical Score: Howard Shore
Best Supporting Actor: Sean Astin as Samwise Gamgee
Ah heck, just sweep the darn thing already!
</b>
Some responses to fellow forum mates (SPOILERS):
I believe that the theatrical release is the one to be judged. Peter Jackson does not have a Director's Cut, the Extended Editions are purely for the true fans who just want more. Jackson is at heart a film-maker, he knows when he needs to cut.
Aragorn's "army" has a part in the Battle of the Pelennor Fields in the novel as well.
Everyone leaving Middle Earth? You must mean the Elves, and they showed that. As for the Scouring being left out, it was anti-climatic, a BIG no-no in film. Once again, as much as Jackson would like to please fans, he is still a film-maker by heart and by profession.
The Shire becoming taken over was taken out!? What about everyone leaving Middle Earth?
SPOILER! <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
SPOi..... frick that, if you haven't seen the movie, why are you posting in "reflections on rotk" anyway?
anyways, no, that's there. just the shire part was takin out.
Great reviews guys, I feel I can always trust any review given in this forum more then any other, there are just less Matrix fanboys I guess... or maybe alot more LoTR fanboys. <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused.gif'><!--endemo--> Whatever, thanks for taking your time to post your review, especially those of you who did it right after you saw the midnight screening. My hat off to you. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<b>Best Picture
Best Director: Peter Jackson
Best Cinematography: Andrew Lesnie
Best Art Direction
Best Production Design
Bets Special Effects: WETA
Best Musical Score: Howard Shore
Best Supporting Actor: Sean Astin as Samwise Gamgee
Ah heck, just sweep the darn thing already!
</b> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
I know how you feel. I still haven't forgiven them for giving the Oscar to Adrian Brody instead of Daniel Day Lewis.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
This is actually something I've been thinking of for a fair share of time by now: What'll be this 'generations' (horribly overused term, I know) Star Wars?
Star Wars disqualified itself early on (no 3rd part, no matter how good, will make me forgive the Midichlorians), Matrix started strong, but then turned into this generations 'Highlander' (one great movie, two so-so sequels); LotR stands alone.
I hope Jackson will continue to make The Hobbit, which is in many aspects a lot easier to convert into a movie. Oh, and if he gets to convert some of the more interesting parts of the Silmarillion, I wouldn't be too angry, either <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->When Aragorn said "No my friends, you bow to no one." I almost cried tears of joy.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Absolutely. The scene is built up making your realize that Aragorn is now pretty much sovereign of the whole of Middle Earth, and then this. Just beautiful.
By the way, what are your favorite scenes?
To me, it was Aragorns "For Frodo." - line for reasons I think are obvious.
I wish there was more of Eowyn, though <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
There are three that really stood out in my mind.
1) When Denethor's burning body hurls itself off Gondor's walls. The way he ran, and the way he fell, and then how the camera just zoomed out and you realized that it was probably impossible to see from outside the walls. Just the feeling I got, that in the end Denethor's demise was still really minor compared to everything happening around it.
2) When Frodo and Sam are lying on the slopes of Mount Doom, right before Sam starts carrying Frodo. The landscape, the two hobbits in that one shot. Pure. Genius.
3) The charge of the oliphaunts. Simply put, the best scene I have seen this year. The way the <i>haradrim</i> looked was brilliant. The structures atop the huge animals were only seen briefly, but I still got a feeling that they were definitely real, and very plausible.
My only question is that why didn't the White City have any Snowspeeders handy?
Anyone notice how that disfigured orc chief looked very similar to a character in one of Peter Jackson's film 'Bad Taste' ? <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
My favourite sceen in the film had to be in the final battle when it was going bad with the flying Nazgul causing problems again, then that moth appears to Gandalf; the one that took a message for him when he was imprisoned by sauraman. The Merry (I think) looks up and yells 'EAGLES! the Eagles have come!' then out the sky some massive eagles come swooping down and proceed to give the flying Nazgul a royal arse kicking. <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> Best bit of the film for me.
Gimli has the best line in the film, when legolas gracefully takes down the Oliphant, he replies with "that still only counts as one!" <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
The Charge of the Rohirrim was great, just awesome to watch them plow through all those Orcs.
The witch King Vs Eowyn "Fool! no man can destroy me!" Pippin stabs him in the leg, Eowyn takes off her helmet and says "I am no man" and stabs him right in the face. Taken right from the book <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
1.) The last part back at the shire... with the... stuff...
2.) The last boat right at the end...
3.) The ball being thrown from the tower....
No.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2.) The last boat right at the end...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3.) The ball being thrown from the tower....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The ball's there, but no throwing.
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->1.) The last part back at the shire... with the... stuff...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
No.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->2.) The last boat right at the end...<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Yes.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
YAY!
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--><!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->3.) The ball being thrown from the tower....<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The ball's there, but no throwing.<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Bah, needs more wormtongue!
<!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
No. It was never shot. You must of seen images of them filming the small homage to it from FOTR, when Frodo looks into the little elven basin, and sees the shire burning.
Oh Jackson wants to do them, and heck New Line Cinemas would write a blank check for the rights. Unfortunatly, the Tolkien estate doesn't want it done; they don't like the movies and have no intention of selling the rights to the rest of Tolkien's work. Which sucks royally.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->
CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition!
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. Never shot. It was cut out of the films a long way back, because as I've previously stated, it wrecks the entire ending. I'm quite happy for Jackson to cut it; he made the right decision here.
<!--QuoteBegin--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Bah, needs more wormtongue! <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I finally managed to track down the actual story about this now infamous scene being cut. According to Peter Jackson, in an interview done a short time ago, the scene with Wormtonge and Sauruman at Isengard was actually originally positioned at the end of The Two Towers. Obviously, it didn't really fit the movie, and it was axed early in the editing process. Jackson did like the scene however, and decided to add it into The Return of the King Extended Edition. It was never in RoTK and it was never cut.
When you think about it, you can easily see why the scene was axed from TTT and not added onto the theatrical release of RoTK. Put it at the end of TTT, and you make the ending far too long, detracting from the climax of Helms Deep and the destruction of Isenguard. Put it in RoTK, and you draw emphasis away from Sauron. Sauruman is the villian of TTT; Sauron is a side-show at best. RoTK though is all about Mordor and Sauron, and as such the attention should be firmly upon the Dark Lord, not Sauruman. The ending of TTT makes it pretty clear that Sauruman has been defeated; his army is vanquished and his fortress taken. There's just no need to drag it out more.
Bigwig, I can understand your sentiments, but when you try and convert some books into film, things have to be changed. If the movies had been exactly the same as the books, the movies would have bombed big time. The Two Towers probably would never have even been made. I say this with absolute certainty. I think that Jackson's work is simply amazing, and though others may not agree with me, I'm delighted that millions of people across the world who would never have read the books have now seen this magnificent story.
CRAP. Though I know I did see some 'making of' pictures somewhere and they were filming this scene... so fingers crossed for Extended Edition!
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Nope. Never shot. It was cut out of the films a long way back, because as I've previously stated, it wrecks the entire ending. I'm quite happy for Jackson to cut it; he made the right decision here. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Dude, I seriously saw shots for this... it had burning mills and everything happening...
My fingers will be crossed for Extended Addition inclusion.
sorry... missed it.
So true, so true.
The whole "coronation scene" was moving tbh.
Let me tell you a little story about how the Tolkien Estate works: When a complete translation of 'Beowulf', one of the LotRs main sources of inspiration, by Tolkien was discovered in the Oxford libary a few years ago, the Tolkien Estate blocked any advance in publishing it. Some years and a lot of shouting and checkwriting later, it hit the prints. A definite 'No.' from the Tolkien Estate means as much as 'Wait while we think it through.'.
So, in short, I'm still hoping <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'><!--endemo-->
Peter Jackson directing The Hobbit will = more money will = it will be made, just not for a while.
and I, for one, think that Peter Jackson did a brilliant job of taking a bloody boring book (it is great, but so boring at times) and turning it into one of the best film trilogies EVER. Throughout Two Towers, I was muttering, "how the hell did they get someone that ugly? What are the likeliness that Gollum is that ugly in real-life without all the makeup"...then I realized he was CG.
Brilliant work.
No... I mean Frodo and Bilbo[I think Gandalf joins too].. Legolas and Gimli, I forgot whoelse, I think that's it.