You'd be willing to release an "unfinished" game to people who can afford to pay a subscription to a file site, but not to the whole community? If you feel that the mod is finished enough to release upon these people, why not just release 2.0 early and then patch it a few days later? I'm a bit doubtful of why 2.0 has the 31st date now, since it must be more or less done if Flayra was considering to release it to fileplanet/whatever early..
k well releasing it on fileplanet or gamespy, whatever paid services you can include, personally im againsted these, i mean, after buying my copy of HL, paying for $50 installation of high speed internet and then a further $30 each month, just to play online games, why would i want to pay yet more fee's just so i can get little perks like this. i say just release it all on same day, those with fileplanet accounts can download it from their subscription servers, while others among us wait in a line.
<!--QuoteBegin--Flayra+Jul 22 2003, 06:48 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Flayra @ Jul 22 2003, 06:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I'm pretty sure this isn't going to work well, so I guess we'll have to shelve this. Thanks for the feedback. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Sorry to hear it but i'll trust your decision. I still think it's a good idea however. Bin it for 2.0 but i'd bear it in mind for a future release.
I feel that open testing is rarely a good idea. As soon as a new build is released to the public, even if it is marked as beta, it will immediatly replace the previous version. All servers will switch, and anyone new to the mod will be pushed into a beta version which may give a poor impression of the mod.
Testing is fine when it is limited to either experienced testers or devoted members of the community, as these aren't people who will get bad 'first impressions' from playing a buggy release. You don't have to worry about generating a good first impression when you are only releasing a beta to devoted NS players who understand that the build is incomplete. Releasing it to *everyone* will make the beta the official current version, a bad idea if it is still in testing.
Ontop of this, you reduce the impact of the next version's launch. The PR you can generate for the launch of a large patch is very helpful for creating a playerbase, as you will flood all gaming newsites. This PR is obviously less pronounced if everyone has already been playing the beta for months.
As TeOH said. Its the anticipation that makes it all worthwhile. Keep it all secret would be my opinion, but that won't happen. The goodies we haven't seen yet in PR makes me all tingly.
Hey please release it early, i took a week off work! from the 28th! so gimme gimme gimme <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo--> else im going to be bored for 4 days!
Can your reason's for deciding against it be summarised in any way for us? A lot of this thread had persuaded me to change my "meh, whatever" response to a Gamespy (or whoever) release into a "whee! bigger community."
It strikes me really that the only thing counting against the idea is that it might annoy existing community member, and that's just selfish of them. Someone else said that this few days we'd be talking about would be nothing significant in the grand scheme of things. And really, if people want to be so piggish and selfish about things they deserve to lose out sometimes.
Though of course, it could just be for logistical reasons (leaks &c), in which case I guess nothing can be done.
I would like to see a lot of servers have it available the day before release. Cus I bet you'd see alot of dissapointed people if there were only a few servers to share
Seems a majority are thinking it's coming out on one or the other. I think Flayra left that unsaid for a good reason. He doesn't want us to know or else everyone who is able will flock to that option to get it early.
LOL, serves me right for skipping pages, ignore my previous post <!--emo&:p--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'><!--endemo-->
The gamespy release would be a temporary wound to the community. In the long run it would not really matter and probably would help get more people involved in NS.
I believe part of the reactions we are seeing here is a bit of backlash at the semi-open rather than open form of the beta. It has been said time and time again, but many NS players at best feel out of the loop. At worst many feel insignificant regarding the development of the game.
When Flayra suggested that 2.0 be released on the services it seemed to many of the players that this was yet another act seperating them from the game and community they enjoy. Many, including myself, feel that we are second class citizens of the NS community. However, I repect and understand Flayra's decision even though I disagree with it.
Though the release would be a boon for the popularity of NS. In my opinion it would damage the community that has sprung up during its development.
That's because we ARE second class citizens of the community. And there is nothing wrong with that. Flayra can't listen to each one of us and try to insert every person's ideas into NS. Instead he has to base decisions off of what he feels, what the vets and pts feel, and then the consensus of the whole general community like you and me.
And as the mod gets more and more popular, your individual vote for the future of NS becomes less and less. And there is NO way to avoid that.
And then there are the crybabies who voted No in the poll because it wouldn't benefit THEM. Not "would it benefit the game", but rather "do I get my cookie early".
<!--QuoteBegin--TickTock+Jul 22 2003, 02:13 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (TickTock @ Jul 22 2003, 02:13 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> That's because we ARE second class citizens of the community. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> I in no way consider myself a 'second-class' community member merely because i'm not a PT or a vet, and neither should anyone else. I don't understand the rationale behind saying that.
Edit: I don't think any PTs or Vets consider themselves above anybody else either.
<!--QuoteBegin--wizard@psu+Jul 22 2003, 09:06 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (wizard@psu @ Jul 22 2003, 09:06 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> It has been said time and time again, but many NS players at best feel out of the loop. At worst many feel insignificant regarding the development of the game. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Ahahah. Out of the loop? Flayra responds to people's posts, as do lots of other people and especially the testers. You can read anything & everything pertinent about the beta in the beta discussion forum.
If you think there is a lack of communication here, take a look over on the SWG forums. The SWG team has a total lack of communication with its player base (quite larger than NS, but still a legitimate beef).
You don't see Holocron replying in the Tech Support like this thread: <a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=18&t=38557' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...ST&f=18&t=38557</a>
Not often you see the developer of a game responding in the Tech Support forum (Not just posting the good old "We are aware of the issue and hope to have it patched soon" garbage either.. an actual answer the the question!)
If you guys feel neglected by Flayra in anyway, please take a ****-*** look around you for goodness sake. I'm paying 15/month for poor communication from SOE for Star Wars Galaxies
And I'm paying nothing for top-notch communication from Flayra&co for Natural Selection.
<!--QuoteBegin--wizard@psu+Jul 22 2003, 02:06 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (wizard@psu @ Jul 22 2003, 02:06 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I believe part of the reactions we are seeing here is a bit of backlash at the semi-open rather than open form of the beta. It has been said time and time again, but many NS players at best feel out of the loop. At worst many feel insignificant regarding the development of the game. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> At one point there wasn't a beta forum. There is now.
All the latter server side patches of 1.0x we're open beta, if be it too certain servers only.
How can you possibly feel out of the loop ? Simply because you don't get to play the beta of 2.0 ?
And to answer your last sentence I guess i'm imagining the various polls which Flayra has run regarding contentious issues, including this one I might add. Which dispite people showing they support him he has decided to can, I presume because of what damage he fears might be done to the community.
<!--QuoteBegin--coil+Jul 22 2003, 02:12 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (coil @ Jul 22 2003, 02:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <b>Disclaimer: I have not been able to speak with Flayra about whether he means Gamespy/similar or Constellation. This is my own personal opinion.</b>
Here's the truth, guys: whether or not the public beta happens, NS will release on the 31st. The beta would occur BEFORE this - i.e. probably Mon-Thurs of that week.
The rationale behind a public beta is an *excellent* one - a few days of MASSIVE testing, on a much larger scale than the PTs/Vets can produce, to see if there are any unforseen bugs that are found by sheer volume of players.
Flay's not asking you if you would pay to have it early - as I suspect many of you might. He's more asking if you'd be upset if NS 2.0 were opened up a few days early to a select group which might or might not include you. If that group is the Constellation group, then anyone who hasn't donated to Constellation is out of luck. If that group were an established service like Gamespy, anyone whe didn't have a Gamespy Complete would be out of luck.
In *both* scenarios, anyone who was willing to pony up a few bucks for a membership *would* have access to the pre-release beta. Anyone who didn't would receive 2.0 on the 31st, just as they would if the beta never happened.
Many of you dislike the idea because services like Gamespy are "evil"... well, it's time for a wake-up call: the Internet isn't free. Gamespy and services like it offer a valuable commodity to the world, and in a capitalist market they have every right to charge for that commodity.
If NS released early on Gamespy or something like it, the following would happen: 1) Any gamespy members would get early access to bugtest NS 2.0 <b>2) Any non-members would get access to 2.0 on the 31st, as promised.</b> 3) The final version of 2.0, released on the 31st, would be a more stable and balanced version than would have otherwise been possible without a beta test. 4) NS would get a huge amount of publicity, generating a much larger fanbase - not even only among service subscribers, but among free service users who see "NS 2.0 available to Gamespy Complete members!" or something like that.
The life of any mod/game is its player base. A pre-release beta to a specific service generates additional interest. Furthermore, it serves to create a more stable, more balanced, more PLAYABLE final release which will better appeal to players and keep them playing it.
Final analysis:<b> You, as NS players, have NOTHING to lose from a pre-release beta, whether or not you are involved. You will get NS 2.0 as promised on the 31st, and you will get a more stable, more balanced build to boot. So please put aside your "me-first" and "Corporations are evil" attitudes, and help Flayra do what's best for Natural Selection.</b> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> atleast someone can look at this objectively.
Oh well, for some reason the idea of a "semi-open" beta ticks me off a little, though not to the point that I would "leave the community forever". The problem is that we've waited and waited and waited for 2.0, so it would somehow hurt that some people get to play the finished product sooner. It just doesn't feel right in my sense of equality. I can see that vets and pts get to play the game earlier, put those are not positions that money can buy. I'm fine with paying customers getting to skip the lines on Fileplanet, but it somehow disturbs me that they get preferential treatment to exclusive files and demos too. I'm also somewhat fine with Constellation members getting preferrential treatment, after all they paid to support NS. This is quite much of a "gut feeling" question, and this is what my gut tells me. I don't buy it that this results in a better product technically (I think it will be too late to change much), at best it generates more PR. CS made it to fame without much commercial assistance (the commercial offers kicked in <b>after</b> CS had become a success), and so could NS. Oh well. The matter seems to be decided (and so is the poll). It hurts a little, but as my vote says, I will get over it. Whether I can get over my bitterness at all the newcomers that are playing 2.0 before me and are spamming the forums with inane questions about things I haven't even tried yet (YES, an instance of old-fashioned ENVY) is another case. I'll try.
The Vets and PTs are not "better" than us, but their opinion counts for more in the long run because they are regarded as those with more experience, in one form or another. That may not actually be true for all of the general members of course, as I'm sure many have intimate knowledge of the subtleties of NS, but at the same time those people are less publicly known.
<!--QuoteBegin--Maus+Jul 21 2003, 11:57 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Maus @ Jul 21 2003, 11:57 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin--X_Stickman+Jul 22 2003, 12:50 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (X_Stickman @ Jul 22 2003, 12:50 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> (plus, if NS had anything to do with Gamespy or Fileplanet, i would be ticked off to say the least. I really don't like the whole ideals of those particular companies) <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> ... in which case the poll is misleading. The "paid members of a certain service" is vague as all hell. Since there are good "certain services" (ie constellation) and bad services (gamespy/fileplanet) then peoples' answers are gompletely dependant on their interpretation of the question, and not at all consistent/objective, really. To put it more clearly - not everyone is answering the same question. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Exactly!
If the NS team makes money off it from gamespy or whoever, it is a good thing. It is always annoying for it to be out and not to be able to play it, but if it will help the game (funding) then i'm sure everybody would be for it.
if you don't have the money to join the service, you can just deal with waiting a few days. patience is a virtue.
I think an open beta is a good idea *IF* you restrict the number of servers through some means. (otherwise you may have a pile of beta servers that no one can play on.)
In my beta testing at MS, one of the things I have noticed that they do on a regular basis is use open-beta testing for large scale multiplayer games. As good as the closed beta testers are, they can't replace large scale testing. As it goes now we usually only have one server active with people and even then it isn't all the time. So I'd love to see how the build fares when populated with 'average joes'. This is just the kind of testing NS needs.
Will it cause some some people to feel a little 'left out'? Perhaps. The same could be said for the current batch of testers. I'm sure many people wish they had 'VET' status so they could test. However they know you can't do a full open beta because you lose control too easily.
So my thoughts would be to go with the open beta, but limit the servers that can support it. That way if things need to be changed you can work with a small group of server ops instead of trying to get all the server ops to upgrade voluntarily.
How did you learn about NS? (Rhetorical) Every good member of the comunity was originally a noob who just heard just heard of NS from somewhere/someone. (dev team excluded) And so if releasing NS in a semi-open beta a few <i>days</i> early will buy the publicity necessary to bring in more noobs who will eventually become great members of our comunity.
So I say release the semi-open beta and bring in the new blood.
So when I get 2.0 on the 31st <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin--Flayra+Jul 22 2003, 12:48 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Flayra @ Jul 22 2003, 12:48 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> I'm pretty sure this isn't going to work well, so I guess we'll have to shelve this. Thanks for the feedback. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Aw, well don't get discouraged.
You'd be willing to release an "unfinished" game to people who can afford to pay a subscription to a file site, but not to the whole community? If you feel that the mod is finished enough to release upon these people, why not just release 2.0 early and then patch it a few days later? I'm a bit doubtful of why 2.0 has the 31st date now, since it must be more or less done if Flayra was considering to release it to fileplanet/whatever early.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Must... not... flame
This may or may not be a good move on the development team imo. If they let to many people in the semi-beta the forum/if he makes a new one is going to get flooded with so much repeated/useless information with maybe a few good apples in the bunch. If you pick to few canadates then there wont be enough to figure out anything usefull in the three days. I'm sure bringing in some 1.04 kiddys will find new things that the current playtesting teams have no found but with a time limit of three days there is going to be great skill needed in picking how many and where.
<!--QuoteBegin--Maus+Jul 22 2003, 07:47 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Maus @ Jul 22 2003, 07:47 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Can your reason's for deciding against it be summarised in any way for us? A lot of this thread had persuaded me to change my "meh, whatever" response to a Gamespy (or whoever) release into a "whee! bigger community."
It strikes me really that the only thing counting against the idea is that it might annoy existing community member, and that's just selfish of them. Someone else said that this few days we'd be talking about would be nothing significant in the grand scheme of things. And really, if people want to be so piggish and selfish about things they deserve to lose out sometimes.
Though of course, it could just be for logistical reasons (leaks &c), in which case I guess nothing can be done. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Very true, this thread changed my mind to.
Comments
You'd be willing to release an "unfinished" game to people who can afford to pay a subscription to a file site, but not to the whole community? If you feel that the mod is finished enough to release upon these people, why not just release 2.0 early and then patch it a few days later? I'm a bit doubtful of why 2.0 has the 31st date now, since it must be more or less done if Flayra was considering to release it to fileplanet/whatever early..
Sorry to hear it but i'll trust your decision. I still think it's a good idea however. Bin it for 2.0 but i'd bear it in mind for a future release.
/me hugs Flay as well
Testing is fine when it is limited to either experienced testers or devoted members of the community, as these aren't people who will get bad 'first impressions' from playing a buggy release. You don't have to worry about generating a good first impression when you are only releasing a beta to devoted NS players who understand that the build is incomplete. Releasing it to *everyone* will make the beta the official current version, a bad idea if it is still in testing.
Ontop of this, you reduce the impact of the next version's launch. The PR you can generate for the launch of a large patch is very helpful for creating a playerbase, as you will flood all gaming newsites. This PR is obviously less pronounced if everyone has already been playing the beta for months.
p.s. if its ready why not just get it out NOW!
It strikes me really that the only thing counting against the idea is that it might annoy existing community member, and that's just selfish of them. Someone else said that this few days we'd be talking about would be nothing significant in the grand scheme of things. And really, if people want to be so piggish and selfish about things they deserve to lose out sometimes.
Though of course, it could just be for logistical reasons (leaks &c), in which case I guess nothing can be done.
I believe part of the reactions we are seeing here is a bit of backlash at the semi-open rather than open form of the beta. It has been said time and time again, but many NS players at best feel out of the loop. At worst many feel insignificant regarding the development of the game.
When Flayra suggested that 2.0 be released on the services it seemed to many of the players that this was yet another act seperating them from the game and community they enjoy. Many, including myself, feel that we are second class citizens of the NS community. However, I repect and understand Flayra's decision even though I disagree with it.
Though the release would be a boon for the popularity of NS. In my opinion it would damage the community that has sprung up during its development.
And as the mod gets more and more popular, your individual vote for the future of NS becomes less and less. And there is NO way to avoid that.
And then there are the crybabies who voted No in the poll because it wouldn't benefit THEM. Not "would it benefit the game", but rather "do I get my cookie early".
I in no way consider myself a 'second-class' community member merely because i'm not a PT or a vet, and neither should anyone else. I don't understand the rationale behind saying that.
Edit: I don't think any PTs or Vets consider themselves above anybody else either.
Ahahah. Out of the loop? Flayra responds to people's posts, as do lots of other people and especially the testers. You can read anything & everything pertinent about the beta in the beta discussion forum.
If you think there is a lack of communication here, take a look over on the SWG forums. The SWG team has a total lack of communication with its player base (quite larger than NS, but still a legitimate beef).
You don't see Holocron replying in the Tech Support like this thread:
<a href='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=18&t=38557' target='_blank'>http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/in...ST&f=18&t=38557</a>
Not often you see the developer of a game responding in the Tech Support forum (Not just posting the good old "We are aware of the issue and hope to have it patched soon" garbage either.. an actual answer the the question!)
If you guys feel neglected by Flayra in anyway, please take a ****-*** look around you for goodness sake. I'm paying 15/month for poor communication from SOE for Star Wars Galaxies
And I'm paying nothing for top-notch communication from Flayra&co for Natural Selection.
gg lame *** whiners.
<!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
At one point there wasn't a beta forum. There is now.
All the latter server side patches of 1.0x we're open beta, if be it too certain servers only.
How can you possibly feel out of the loop ? Simply because you don't get to play the beta of 2.0 ?
And to answer your last sentence I guess i'm imagining the various polls which Flayra has run regarding contentious issues, including this one I might add. Which dispite people showing they support him he has decided to can, I presume because of what damage he fears might be done to the community.
I do. Praise me you fools
Here's the truth, guys: whether or not the public beta happens, NS will release on the 31st. The beta would occur BEFORE this - i.e. probably Mon-Thurs of that week.
The rationale behind a public beta is an *excellent* one - a few days of MASSIVE testing, on a much larger scale than the PTs/Vets can produce, to see if there are any unforseen bugs that are found by sheer volume of players.
Flay's not asking you if you would pay to have it early - as I suspect many of you might. He's more asking if you'd be upset if NS 2.0 were opened up a few days early to a select group which might or might not include you. If that group is the Constellation group, then anyone who hasn't donated to Constellation is out of luck. If that group were an established service like Gamespy, anyone whe didn't have a Gamespy Complete would be out of luck.
In *both* scenarios, anyone who was willing to pony up a few bucks for a membership *would* have access to the pre-release beta. Anyone who didn't would receive 2.0 on the 31st, just as they would if the beta never happened.
Many of you dislike the idea because services like Gamespy are "evil"... well, it's time for a wake-up call: the Internet isn't free. Gamespy and services like it offer a valuable commodity to the world, and in a capitalist market they have every right to charge for that commodity.
If NS released early on Gamespy or something like it, the following would happen:
1) Any gamespy members would get early access to bugtest NS 2.0
<b>2) Any non-members would get access to 2.0 on the 31st, as promised.</b>
3) The final version of 2.0, released on the 31st, would be a more stable and balanced version than would have otherwise been possible without a beta test.
4) NS would get a huge amount of publicity, generating a much larger fanbase - not even only among service subscribers, but among free service users who see "NS 2.0 available to Gamespy Complete members!" or something like that.
The life of any mod/game is its player base. A pre-release beta to a specific service generates additional interest. Furthermore, it serves to create a more stable, more balanced, more PLAYABLE final release which will better appeal to players and keep them playing it.
Final analysis:<b>
You, as NS players, have NOTHING to lose from a pre-release beta, whether or not you are involved. You will get NS 2.0 as promised on the 31st, and you will get a more stable, more balanced build to boot. So please put aside your "me-first" and "Corporations are evil" attitudes, and help Flayra do what's best for Natural Selection.</b> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
atleast someone can look at this objectively.
This is quite much of a "gut feeling" question, and this is what my gut tells me. I don't buy it that this results in a better product technically (I think it will be too late to change much), at best it generates more PR. CS made it to fame without much commercial assistance (the commercial offers kicked in <b>after</b> CS had become a success), and so could NS. Oh well. The matter seems to be decided (and so is the poll). It hurts a little, but as my vote says, I will get over it. Whether I can get over my bitterness at all the newcomers that are playing 2.0 before me and are spamming the forums with inane questions about things I haven't even tried yet (YES, an instance of old-fashioned ENVY) is another case. I'll try.
... in which case the poll is misleading. The "paid members of a certain service" is vague as all hell. Since there are good "certain services" (ie constellation) and bad services (gamespy/fileplanet) then peoples' answers are gompletely dependant on their interpretation of the question, and not at all consistent/objective, really. To put it more clearly - not everyone is answering the same question. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly!
if you don't have the money to join the service, you can just deal with waiting a few days. patience is a virtue.
I think an open beta is a good idea *IF* you restrict the number of servers through some means. (otherwise you may have a pile of beta servers that no one can play on.)
In my beta testing at MS, one of the things I have noticed that they do on a regular basis is use open-beta testing for large scale multiplayer games. As good as the closed beta testers are, they can't replace large scale testing. As it goes now we usually only have one server active with people and even then it isn't all the time. So I'd love to see how the build fares when populated with 'average joes'. This is just the kind of testing NS needs.
Will it cause some some people to feel a little 'left out'? Perhaps. The same could be said for the current batch of testers. I'm sure many people wish they had 'VET' status so they could test. However they know you can't do a full open beta because you lose control too easily.
So my thoughts would be to go with the open beta, but limit the servers that can support it. That way if things need to be changed you can work with a small group of server ops instead of trying to get all the server ops to upgrade voluntarily.
Regards,
Savant
Every good member of the comunity was originally a noob who just heard just heard of NS from somewhere/someone. (dev team excluded)
And so if releasing NS in a semi-open beta a few <i>days</i> early will buy the publicity necessary to bring in more noobs who will eventually become great members of our comunity.
So I say release the semi-open beta and bring in the new blood.
So when I get 2.0 on the 31st <!--emo&::skulk::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/skulk.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='skulk.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&::nerdy::--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/nerd.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='nerd.gif'><!--endemo--> <!--emo&:D--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'><!--endemo-->
Aw, well don't get discouraged.
You'd be willing to release an "unfinished" game to people who can afford to pay a subscription to a file site, but not to the whole community? If you feel that the mod is finished enough to release upon these people, why not just release 2.0 early and then patch it a few days later? I'm a bit doubtful of why 2.0 has the 31st date now, since it must be more or less done if Flayra was considering to release it to fileplanet/whatever early.. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Must... not... flame
It strikes me really that the only thing counting against the idea is that it might annoy existing community member, and that's just selfish of them. Someone else said that this few days we'd be talking about would be nothing significant in the grand scheme of things. And really, if people want to be so piggish and selfish about things they deserve to lose out sometimes.
Though of course, it could just be for logistical reasons (leaks &c), in which case I guess nothing can be done. <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Very true, this thread changed my mind to.