Pistol Is A Sidearm, Not A Railgun.

saint0z · March 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MonsieurEvil @ Mar 3 2003, 10:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The pistol will definitely be changing for NS 1.1. I will leave it at that for now.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
i hope to god(flayra) that u just change it to have a slower rof

keep the pinpoint accuracy, the marines need it

b00jah · March 2003

I hope this change of the pistol isn't to counter balance cheaters. I'm an avid Kharaa player and I see no reason for a change. As stated before, the Marines need it.

coil · March 2003

(pure speculations follows)

I imagine they will do one or more of the following:
1) enforce a ROF cap, as was originally intended for 1.0
2) implement antiscripting code; I don't know if binding the mousewheel to attack would be included (but I hope so q: )
3) decreased accuracy at high ROF (first bullet is accurate, any additional bullet within 0.X seconds is Y-degrees inaccurate) - kind of cone-fire-based recoil.

TheHornet · March 2003

but that would go against the awsome story line of using the recoil energy to stabilize it and make it pin point. a rate of fire cap would be acceptable.

Tieom · March 2003

I think they should make the pistol be, instead of 10 bullets at 20 damage each, be a lower # of bullets with higher damage. Say, 5 with 40 damage each, or 4 with 50 damage each, or (overboard) 2 bullets with 100 damage apiece.
BLAM! (Skulk dies)
.....
BLAM! (Skulk dies)
(reload)
*chomp chomp chomp*

PvtLohne · March 2003

Now that might SOUND overboard, but a huge, bulky, marine looking revolver with only 3 huge bullets in it WOULD be the /fire/. Slow rate of fire, still accurate, and there's reason to use it. Lord...a one shot one skulk kill revovler. That'd be...why, it'd be the fire.

Haunted · March 2003

Maybe this will throw off the balancing, but why not nerf the pistol all together and have the shotgun as a secondary weapon. This would

a) allow the under appreciated shotty to be fully realized

b) allow skulks a chance at sinking their teeth in marine flesh, if only for a second

I think that that might actually work. Since it hasn't been play tested, I can't be sure, but I believe it would make <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/asrifle.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='asrifle.gif'> ing much more fun.

DaDDeh · March 2003

I think the pistol should stay as it is, only change I would like to see is when you place mines your pistol either stays on the floor (does not disapear after so long) or the comm can give you another, How many times have you placed mines and found yourself without a 2nd weapon. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'>

echs · March 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (MonsieurEvil @ Mar 3 2003, 05:50 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> The pistol will definitely be changing for NS 1.1. I will leave it at that for now.  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Argh, I love the pistol...I hope you only change it's appearance <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

-psygnosis-

SpceM0nkey · March 2003

The pistol is the primary marine weapon. Atleast 2/3 of kills in the first few minutes are thanks to the beloved pistol. Eveyrone i know uses it. When i am com i remind everyone to use it first.

You nerf it and alot of people are gonna be angry. Its one of the only things that keeps my marines alive.

Changing the pistol will slide the balance alot.

Please dont.

Gibby · March 2003

It still seems kinda.. foolish.

The LMG should have the "perfect accuracy" and "recoil stuff" that was said in the manual, if anynithing. Why? Because. Why would the TSA devs add such perfect things to a PISTOL when the staple marine weapon, the LMG, is lacking them? I mean come on. Pistol = sidearm. If it were something else, I wouldn't care. But its meant to be a SUPPLEMENT. Meaning, not as good as the LMG. If you were in a dark hallway that you knew was crawling with Skulks, and no matter what kind of good marksman you were, would you have the pistol out? Hell no, you'd stick with the 50 bullet LMG. I would hope the accuracy is made at least as bad as the LMG. Damage reduction wouldn't be a bad idea either.

Lindstrom · March 2003

The LMG is ment to throw a wall of lead out, not be a sniper rifle. I really hope they just fix the rof and maybe model updates, besides that LEAVE IT ALONE PLEASE!!!!!!!!!

Creepie · March 2003

I've been accused once or twice of scripting the pistol simply because I can fire it fast. For example, the vents in, er, Ventilation or the hall to Horseshoe. It would be a shame to nerf to ROF because its the marines only hope at long range, especially early game. Later on it becomes moot because it just doesn't do the damage against the fades.

Is it designed so that ranged combat (for marines at least) is difficult ?

Creep.

Speed_2_Dave · March 2003

I was going to second a "six shooter" idea, but after thinking about it more, it would make playing on pubs as aliens (little teamwork) impossible.
Imagine if a skulk dies in one hit, the only way to get through that is to have more than one skulk there.. doesn't happen much on pubs.

Alien_Bob · March 2003

Nah, the pistol is *underpowered*.

I think each pistol bullet should explode like a grenade when it hits. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif'>

Ph0enix · March 2003

Cap the rate of fire and increase the reload speed. <b>Please</b> do not change the damage or the accuracy.

It's fine as it is. A alien which stands still long enough for me to see it, draw my pistol (assuming I had my primary out) then deserves to dies in the second it takes to unload the clip.

Hitting a moving target is pretty skillful with a pistol. Reducing the accuracy would make this impossible. Increasing the reload speed would make it truly a last chance gun, if you don't kill your target in those 10 rounds your dead. Perhaps have to chamber the first round, which incidentally would look cool <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/tounge.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='tounge.gif'>

Talesin · March 2003

Considering those who usually fell into the sniper role in other mods can reliably pick off a running Skulk from across the room with a pistol? That you only NEED half a clip to kill one initially?
Cap the ROF. Either drop the damage or the clip size... I mean, it /does/ the same amount of damage as an HMG, bullet for bullet.. and currently can be fired insta-fast. Don't allow it to be bound to mousewheel (use the hotkey system as well to keep it from being scripted on) and you've got a winner. It /does/ feel unfair when you're playing a Marine, if you can track and shoot, to ping off a pair of Skulks in one clip. Usually, you have the ability to kill off a full rush with just the 40 bullets you can carry for it. Not to mention the fright value of pegging a Skulk down to half health from all the way down a long corridor. I usually let 'em run away to go heal, if they try to break off before they get halfway down. Takes longer for them to travel than it does to respawn, with a decent Alien team.

Alien side, it REALLY ticks me off to round a corner, be face to face with a Marine, wearing my Carapace 3... and *BAM*. Dead, thanks to a pistolscript. C'mon, 1.1... we need this thing fixed. Weren't supposed to be any insta-kill weapons, right? <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'>

Aminal · March 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Talesin @ Mar 4 2003, 05:35 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Alien side, it REALLY ticks me off to round a corner, be face to face with a Marine, wearing my Carapace 3... and *BAM*. Dead, thanks to a pistolscript. C'mon, 1.1... we need this thing fixed. Weren't supposed to be any insta-kill weapons, right? <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif'>  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
This is my only problem with it.

The pistol works fine if it is used as is - with its current rof and reload time, and damage per hit. But you simply shouldn't be able to fire a 200 damage hitscan. Its not intended to work this way, you're not supposed to be able to do that sort of damage at unlimited face with deadly accuracy, and no possibility of dodging it.

Unfortunatly you can only lower the rof or bind to a hotkey, both would be unfortunate changes. Its a shame people dont just stop using hte scripts

Superfly · March 2003

Personally I can fire the pistol as fast as anyone has it scripted. I trust in the devs to make the changes they see fit. But as is, the pistol is like the number one line of defense against early skulk rushes. I dont see a need to change anything seeing as how usually 10 min. into a game almost everybody has welders.

Besides this, the pistol (no matter how fast you can fire it) is pretty much useless against anything with lvl 3 armor.

Ahh well, to each thier own.

ainfect · March 2003

i like the pistol. leave it alone.

Kadreallost · March 2003

Here's an idea, Ditch the pistol to make room for a REAL Gun =P

smokingwreckage · March 2003

A heavy pistol has a better feel than a "shotgun" scaled down til it's just a ...... heavy pistol.

tbZBeAst · March 2003

How about removing the pistol for a diplomacy option, you know, talk it out instead.
Sure its a huge drooling xenomorph with fangs as big as your head, but maybe its a huge drooling xenomorph that needs a *hug*

/me runs away cackling again

<img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

Link · March 2003

</span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Mazdek @ Mar 3 2003, 10:48 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Their CS aiming skills  </td></tr></table><span class='postcolor'> 
Read: Aimbot

Beetlejuice · March 2003

Only problem with pistol is a lack of a rof cap. It is meant to be the accurate weapon of the marines (though you could argue about if a sidearm should do this job). So without a cap there are lots of possibilities to make it an accurate higher punch hmg with lower clip. Scripting is only one of them. Using an autofire mouse, the mousewheel or just hammering the fire button are others. And since i allready hear ppl crying that hammering the mouse button like mad is a skill, yes you are right, it is a skill like bunnyhopping is as well. But, at least in my oppinion, not a skill belonging to a fps (or any modern game at all). If you want to hammer your mouse then get yourself a c64 and summergames. Or just open notepad and take a stopwatch.

Now back to the pistol, all that needs to be done is give it a rof cap of 0,5 to 1 sec. And if it should turn out to be to crappy then up the dmg with possibly reducing clipsize a bit. 40 dmg, 6 clipsize would sound good to me. This way you would need 2 (aimed, you can't spray, or better rail, anymore) shots for a skulk (one would be overpowered for a spawn weapon).

coil · March 2003

For those of you with fast fingers (who DON'T use the scroll wheel), trust me that you can't fire as fast as a pistol-dump script. Scripts like this are one of the things that will not survive 1.1.

Shockeh · March 2003

The anti-pistol peeps are right, and I'm one of the peeps that USE it loads.

And no, I don't script, but I (& a lot of the players on Warservers, for example) can easy pop a skulk trying for a cheeky parasite or two before he ducks back. And it gives them a fair bit of a shock.

I'm the one doing it, and I think it's unfair. <img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif'>

Milagre · March 2003

I read that the high rate of fire for the pistol was a mistake, not a feature, and that it would be changed in 1.1

coil · March 2003

Correction: the lack of a cap is a mistake. The pistol is supposed to be capped at 6 rounds/second.

Slycaster · March 2003

I think all of you fail to realise that when changes are being made to the pistol, numerous changes are being made to the game itself. The balance in no way will be shifted, as everything is going to be altered in a way to balance it entirely. It's not like 1.1 is ONLY changing the pistol. The counters and advantages will still be there, but in a different way.

Pistol Is A Sidearm, Not A Railgun.

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