Let's talk about the Seatruck...

M_QM_Q Members Join Date: 2020-05-02 Member: 260603Posts: 4 Fully active user
The Seatruck. The whole modularity concept has merit, but in its current state, as an exploration vehicle, it's uglier, bulkier and slower than the Seamoth and as a mobile base, it can't even be compared with the epicness, convenience and building customization of a Cyclops.

I sure hope that the devs do add more vehicles that specialize in different activities like an improved Seamoth or Cyclops, but imo here's how it will be made more tolerable:


-Make it move like a serpent. Add joints between its modules and have each module follow the path of the main module. With 3-4 modules, It just becomes a slow inconvenient unbending stick, that is a pain to navigate.

-As I said, its modularity has merit but I don't think it's being used correctly. At the moment, due to the aforementioned reason, players will always tend to skip specific modules and just use the most useful ones for the vast majority of occasions. Imho tune the module system so each module represents more clear utility categories e.g sustenance with filtration that includes sleep, mobility, reactor, defense, mineral (low range) scanner modules and the rest (storage, fabrication, prawn) as is. Player wants to scout -- takes mobility and, optionally, defense module. Player wants to stock up on resources -- takes mobility, mineral scanner, storage modules. Player wants to dock a long-term base somewhere -- takes sustenance, reactor, fabrication and storage modules (mobility sounds always like a no-brainer but should not be meant for long-term trips, same with reactor unless it is the heaviest module and meant only for long term trips which use scanners, defense etc). And so on. With the right combo of module-specific mass/speed reduction, power consumption etc, it can become a meaningful choice.

-Last but not least, add a role for it in the land exploration gameloop, since you have decided to add it. You absolutely have to connect the sea/land loops somehow and accessing parts of land with underwater tunnels or even better, opening a path via land, to "unlock" a hypothetical "end-game" water biome gated by land. Whatever you think it's best, just interconnect them and make sea vehicles also play a role in them.

Cheers and thanks for awesome game, can't wait for the release!
mr_reaperleviathan

Comments

  • QuartetapeQuartetape GermanyMembers Join Date: 2020-05-02 Member: 260578Posts: 5 Fully active user
    Thus far, I'm pretty happy with the seatruck. I love the idea and been playing it a lot. Though scouting is not as fun as it used to be. Why not include the seamoth? It's a great vehicle, it's already been designed. Developers are stripping themselves of options without need. You can make it appear later in the game at a crucial stroy moment for example. Makes for a great reminiscence :)

    Also: Why do I have a ton of different storage lockers in the storage module with very limited space. Right now, I have to click trough so much lockers if i'm searching a specific ressource. It's been bothering me a lot already in Subnautica one, but this brings it to a whole new level.
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  • KyzarvsKyzarvs UKMembers Join Date: 2019-08-08 Member: 254142Posts: 6 Fully active user
    Personally I'd swap the Seatruck with the Cyclops. I have 300 hours in Subnautica - I rarely build the Cyclops now until just before blast off, you can get everything done without it pretty easily. The 'moth is fast and fun to explore with, the Prawn is useful for mining / the last part of the story. The 'truck instead of the Cyclops makes sense as it's marginally better to use than the Cyclops and does the same job. Why have two mobile base vehicles?

  • GimboidGimboid FranceMembers Join Date: 2016-03-28 Member: 214956Posts: 24 Advanced user
    M_Q wrote: »
    -Make it move like a serpent. Add joints between its modules and have each module follow the path of the main module. With 3-4 modules, It just becomes a slow inconvenient unbending stick, that is a pain to navigate.

    I think this is potentially the concept, but probably too much engineering to introduce
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  • RossumRossum Members Join Date: 2019-07-12 Member: 253707Posts: 11 Fully active user
    I would like a way to easily level out the seatruck, so that when I park it the rooms don't end up slanted awkwardly. That, or have it where the seatruck stays level as it travels.
    Warvis
  • CoreadorCoreador USAMembers Join Date: 2016-01-12 Member: 211310Posts: 12 Fully active user
    Level out key would be nice. It is often hard to guess where "level" is in a cave or limited visibility. Or you could have an angle of attack gauge (like a plane) that tells you your angle relative to level.

    Please don't make it only drive level! That worked for Cyclops because it was a big vehicle and was supposed to feel like one. Also, it had cameras all around so you could see what you were doing. Even so it was tricky to get through caves, which was a bit annoying but felt "right" because it was this big mobile base. Can you imagine if the Seamoth only traveled level? It would have been impossible to see around you and explore anywhere. Since the Seatruck (without any modules) is taking the place of the Seamoth, I don't think it make sense to limit it that way.

    As for general thoughts and opinion on the Seatruck: I agree the modularity is cool and I also agree with the concerns listed: not a lot of reason to change modules, some useless modules, useless for land. Some random ideas:

    A room with drones (like scanner room) that can pick up resources (maybe only one at a time) or fish. Allow them to be controlled from the pilot's station. Maybe includes scanning with limited range; even without scanning it would still be useful for exploration and grabbing something quickly.

    Having the Seatruck work on land might also be interesting... perhaps a slow hover. Maybe this requires a special module that deploys lifting drones. Maybe it only works if you have less than X modules attached. Possibly it could eat power quickly while hovering so you don't want to travel too far on land. Alternately, consider having channels through the land maps that the Seatruck can navigate, so that you can have your mobile base somewhere nearby.

    Make the aggressiveness of predatory fish higher that more modules that you add (it appears like a bigger threat to them).

    Instead of making the Seatruck slower when it has more modules, give it more inertia. Slow to speed up, slow to stop or turn. But can still reach a decent speed if you are trying to travel across the entire map.

    Upgrade item for a threat display, like how the cyclops shows dangerous creatures around you.

    More interesting damage, including damage to modules other than the first, and internal consequences, like fires or taking on water.

    Maybe some modules that must be "deployed". The Seatruck must be stopped and the module deployed by the player from the interior, but then it provides some advanced capability (scanning? recharging? etc?). It must then be stowed again before the Seatruck can resume motion. Another twist on this idea could be modules that are meant to be deployed and left; they must be the last module on the Seatruck and they are disconnected, deployed, and drop to the ground (or float where they are, depending on purpose). They remain in that spot providing some benefit but cannot be moved again. Maybe the Ion lockers should actually be like this, like little local survival pods. Possibly even a teleport network to get around quickly would be fun (late game of course).
  • SorenzorSorenzor Madrid, SpainMembers Join Date: 2020-04-04 Member: 259618Posts: 10 Fully active user
    edited May 20
    I think that the seatruck is great for starters. It's versatile and it adapts to the player. It's not the seamoth and it's not the cyclops.

    And I am ok with that. It offers different stuff. The cyclops is too clumsy to be used too often and the seamoth is too small and unpractical in many circumstances. The seatruck offers something MORE than both of them. A middle term.

    The problem is that there should be some way to keep middle size predators far away because even without any module, the seatruck is too slow to evade them. They come and bite all the time and you can do NOTHING to not get hurt. Just repair every now and then. That's tedious and in my book, a design flaw.

    And that's the only problem I find with the seatruck. I love the thing.

    EDIT: Oh, you guys have some very cool ideas. Making it work on land would be amazing for example, but I think that the land mass is too fragmented to make it worth it. It would be hard to use in a terrain that is so abrupt and full of caves and tunnels. I keep thinking that they should have made the land mass much more open.
  • CptMJCptMJ SCMembers Join Date: 2020-05-20 Member: 261205Posts: 3 Fully active user
    There are some really cool ideas here and I am happy to see other people are having similar thoughts on what could be improved on the sea truck.
    In short, I love the sea truck, but I miss the seamoth and cyclops. I think in the current state of the sea truck it's in an awkward position between the seamoth and cyclops. It's got good maneuverability and speed without modules, but with a few modules added, it becomes almost harder to navigate than the cyclops. Imo it's role should either be changed to an explorer and therefore mobility and speed need to be greatly improved (love the serpent idea!), or it should become more of a mobile base, that's slow to move, but provides the player with a docked seamoth or like prior post mentioned camera drones. For it to operate as a base, it would need to step up its defense game or even provide cloaking when stationary.
    I think the sea truck needs an auto-level feature or level indicator, cameras for maneuvering and sensors like the cyclops. And a light switch.
    Currently, when I drive the seatruck around I feel like I am constantly being attacked and chased, and just when the first creature ends it's chase, there are two more. Like previous posts mention, repair and repeat.
    I agree on the seamoth. I want it back.

    I also like the idea of small mining drones, that collect resources for you while you are off base. Now that would need to be carefully balanced, so it doesn't become a self-playing game. Maybe you limit how much they can pick up per run and in total, have them charge after returning, etc. I was recently playing and in desperate need of lead. Wouldn't it be great to return to base and go to your mining control room and pick up items the drones have gathered? Maybe occasionally you have to head out and retrieve a stranded drone.

    Next point, I have to agree with a previous post again, storage in your base. I love setting up my base with a MPR for crafting and then adjacent rooms with storage lockers, I go through the hassle of labeling them, sometimes even color coding. But it gets tedious to sort your items away after a supply run and to go through several lockers to gather the ingredients you need to craft a certain item. What I think would be good here if there was a way to have a sorter sort your items and stow them in the appropriate lockers, maybe an upgrade for the moonpool that transfers items from the docked vehicle to the base storage.
    Maybe there could even be an upgrade to the fabricator so it automatically pulls items from wherever they're stored in your base, without the need of you picking them up and putting them into your inventory first.
    Again, I wouldn't want that to be too easy so maybe that fabricator uses more energy or only pulls from directly adjacent rooms. And I know, we have quantum lockers now, which I honestly have not used yet, because I don't like the idea of having access to items across the map like this.

    Now I am going to end this post and think about some insanity to through out there. I don't expect anything to be read or used by the developers, I can only imagine how much input they get or how busy they are.

    But it feels good to vent. Venting? Hmm... maybe the sea truck can release some oxygen to scare of attackers. No, no. That would be too ...
    breath-taking.
  • SorenzorSorenzor Madrid, SpainMembers Join Date: 2020-04-04 Member: 259618Posts: 10 Fully active user
    edited May 22
    CptMJ wrote: »
    There are some really cool ideas here and I am happy to see other people are having similar thoughts on what could be improved on the sea truck.
    In short, I love the sea truck, but I miss the seamoth and cyclops. I think in the current state of the sea truck it's in an awkward position between the seamoth and cyclops. It's got good maneuverability and speed without modules, but with a few modules added, it becomes almost harder to navigate than the cyclops. Imo it's role should either be changed to an explorer and therefore mobility and speed need to be greatly improved (love the serpent idea!), or it should become more of a mobile base, that's slow to move, but provides the player with a docked seamoth or like prior post mentioned camera drones. For it to operate as a base, it would need to step up its defense game or even provide cloaking when stationary.
    I think the sea truck needs an auto-level feature or level indicator, cameras for maneuvering and sensors like the cyclops. And a light switch.
    Currently, when I drive the seatruck around I feel like I am constantly being attacked and chased, and just when the first creature ends it's chase, there are two more. Like previous posts mention, repair and repeat.
    I agree on the seamoth. I want it back.

    I also like the idea of small mining drones, that collect resources for you while you are off base. Now that would need to be carefully balanced, so it doesn't become a self-playing game. Maybe you limit how much they can pick up per run and in total, have them charge after returning, etc. I was recently playing and in desperate need of lead. Wouldn't it be great to return to base and go to your mining control room and pick up items the drones have gathered? Maybe occasionally you have to head out and retrieve a stranded drone.

    Next point, I have to agree with a previous post again, storage in your base. I love setting up my base with a MPR for crafting and then adjacent rooms with storage lockers, I go through the hassle of labeling them, sometimes even color coding. But it gets tedious to sort your items away after a supply run and to go through several lockers to gather the ingredients you need to craft a certain item. What I think would be good here if there was a way to have a sorter sort your items and stow them in the appropriate lockers, maybe an upgrade for the moonpool that transfers items from the docked vehicle to the base storage.
    Maybe there could even be an upgrade to the fabricator so it automatically pulls items from wherever they're stored in your base, without the need of you picking them up and putting them into your inventory first.
    Again, I wouldn't want that to be too easy so maybe that fabricator uses more energy or only pulls from directly adjacent rooms. And I know, we have quantum lockers now, which I honestly have not used yet, because I don't like the idea of having access to items across the map like this.

    Now I am going to end this post and think about some insanity to through out there. I don't expect anything to be read or used by the developers, I can only imagine how much input they get or how busy they are.

    But it feels good to vent. Venting? Hmm... maybe the sea truck can release some oxygen to scare of attackers. No, no. That would be too ...
    breath-taking.

    The problem is that you are trying to make the seatruck either better than the cyclops or better than the seamoth, or a replacement and it's not any of those. And it shouldn't be. The seatruck is its own thing. With two modules it keeps being easier to maneuver than the cyclops and it can be driven into relatively small caves. I think that's the best way to use it once you already have the seamoth and the cyclops.

    I think that not having your seamoth or cyclops available make you think this way. But don't worry, the developers said some where that they were adding the other vehicles, right? Then it should be ok. Pick the one that you prefer, but I really don't think that they should change the seatruck to make it more like the others. That would be a sad mistake.
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