Alien Chamber
t0x1kw4st3
Join Date: 2008-04-27 Member: 64167Members
Join Date: 2008-04-27 Member: 64167Members
<div class="IPBDescription">(fires Spore & Umbra)</div>There should be a chamber that can fire spore/umbra. Have you ever seen this cactus?
<a href="http://freelargephotos.com/000025_l.jpg" target="_blank">http://freelargephotos.com/000025_l.jpg</a>
Now imagine those cactus fruits being chamber "ammo". A near-by gorge can fire the "fruits", which umbra or spore the intended area.
How can the gorge do this?
The gorge presses "e" on the completed chamber (which puts him into the chamber's perspective). Then, he fires the intended effect at his reticule aimer.
The chamber would diversify lerk functionality.
OR,
completely invent a new effect that is not spore/umbra that can be fired by the gorge.
This would make gorges defensive/offensive gods of support.
<a href="http://freelargephotos.com/000025_l.jpg" target="_blank">http://freelargephotos.com/000025_l.jpg</a>
Now imagine those cactus fruits being chamber "ammo". A near-by gorge can fire the "fruits", which umbra or spore the intended area.
How can the gorge do this?
The gorge presses "e" on the completed chamber (which puts him into the chamber's perspective). Then, he fires the intended effect at his reticule aimer.
The chamber would diversify lerk functionality.
OR,
completely invent a new effect that is not spore/umbra that can be fired by the gorge.
This would make gorges defensive/offensive gods of support.
Comments
But this is how I think it should work...
The chamber should cost about 20 res. When it is shot, it releases the umbra cloud to protect it and and aliens near it. It won't shoot the umbra at a specified location, but release the umbra around it.
When a Marine gets near the chamber, it releases the spore cloud to slowly kill them like usual.
The Marine could set off the chamber's spore cloud simply by going near it. An example of this happening would be when the chamber is cloaked and the Marines are going down a hall and happen to set it off.
Well, it would be pretty hard to kill the chamber by using bullets, so Marines would have to use their knife, grenades, or a flamethrower.
The chamber could only be used when the 2nd hive is built. The reason being for this is because the Lerk can only use both Umbra and Spores when there are 2 hives.
And I would expect the Marines to have an Advanced Armory by then to drop Flamethrowers and such.
Good call. Spore / Umbra Chamber.
I agree, spore/umbra chamber would be a nice thing by second hive, now, we need a name?<img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" /> Spore Chamber?
I think the flame thrower should get rid of the spore and umbra, like burn it away, instead of shoot through it, making the flamethrower an ultimat anti-alien structure gun. This, incorperated with sensory, would make nausty traps, put one on each of the four walls in a hallway, boom, mass shield. The spores will deter knifers, forcing the marines to use other weapons. Having a RoF is needed, say 2-5 seconds ofter spore and umbra disapear it re spores, so that gives the marines 2-5 seconds to run threw, or shoot it with HMG
Or, it could just be a constant spore/umbra release. Once every 10 seconds, with a 5 second effect.
So, a spore chamber would improve the life of offense chambers by like 150%, statistically (not sure about the percentage). You could make the effectiveness of the umbra (from the s(P)ore ©hamber - PC) relative to the amount of hives, and the re-spore rate relative to the amount of movement chambers (1 -> 3). This will make a 1 Hive MC spore friendly (even when lerks aren't around).
If Hive 1 Chamber is DC, the umbra-chamber becomes available -- again, it's effectiveness relative to the # of hives, and its refresh rate relative to #of DCs. This will make 1 Hive DC umbra-friendly.
So, if Marines go a high-damage strategy (shotty rush), the aliens should react to this chamber with DCs (umbra). If the Marines go high-resource strategy (res ######s), aliens could go 1 Hive MC, to protect their RTs with spore (from knives, at-least.)
Functionally, this allows one more chamber to be built (2 total) (each unlocked by either MC, or DC).
The game should adapt to strategy of the other's team, you know?
Also thinking, maybe the sensory chamber should unlock another type of chamber -- but, it seems DC & MC are fundamental to game mechanics (HP/ENERGY) where-as umbra-cloak-spore are more support.
Or, it could just be a constant spore/umbra release. Once every 10 seconds, with a 5 second effect.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
The spore/umbra should only be released when it gets shot/marine steps near it, because at some point in the game there won't be any gorges and just fades and lerks and that stuff. And I don't think a Gorge wants to sit in a hallway for a long time waiting for a Marine to walk by just to have the Marine empty a clip into the Gorge killing it while the Marine can walk away safely. However, instead of using "e" on the chamber, any alien could simply go up and attack it. The won't do damage to it, but the chamber will see itself being attacked and procede to protect itself.
And if it was constant, then that wouldn't make good cloak traps.
It should work similar to the Offence Chamber. Just wait for the Marine to get in range then set off the Spores. Or when it gets shot at, it sets off the Umbra to protect itself.
These chambers would have to be set somewhat in the way of the aliens so that if their getting shot at and need to make an escape, they can run near the chamber, have it take some damage, then shoot out the spores to protect itself, and the alien.
The umbra/spore cloud would only last a few seconds. And yeah, it would have to wait like 5 seconds after the cloud has cleared to be able to be used again.
The chamber would not be effected by Lerk's spores, Onos's stomp, Skulk's parasite, and Gorge's bilebomb.
This fruit should be very slow to regenerate (perhaps one every two resource gain 'ticks'). I like the idea that it wouldn't directly be offensive in that it wouldn't fire at enemies. Though several properties I think it should have is that it should be highly explosive. When one of these things explode, it should deal fatal damage to unequipped humans with level 2 armor or less. It should also deal damage to aliens and alien structures (which would perhaps lead to more strategic displacement rather than lumping them together near offensive structures). In addition to spreading 'umbra', the fruit would also have further use.
I think benefits should be granted to any class which 'uses' one, and I think how a class uses it should be relative as well.
For example, a gorge would consume it for the ability to spread long lasting (at least twice as long given the long regeneration of these fruit) umbra in rooms.
A skulk could consume it to be able to use its 4th slot effect (kamikaze) with the slight alteration that even if it dies before activating, it still explodes.
A lerk would hold it in its mouth and upon first use of any weapon would fire it as a projectile. Upon hitting a surface, it would explode like a grenade, damaging all humans and nearby structures.
A fade could consume it to grant a speed boost and a damage boost for 1 minute.
And an onos in posession of one of these with a marine consumed can activate a 10 second invulnerability (may not seem like much, but consider the benefits in leading a squad of aliens into the human base), though the marine inside the onos would 'die' as a result.
These chambers should be slow to regenerate the fruit though, or you'll end up with a lot of Kharaa gathered around several of these chambers waiting for them to regrow.
-The spores would release themsevles if the chamber is disturbed, meaning, an Marine OR Alien touchs it, it will spew green, now, it won't hurt the aliens, but this will make the chamber have more logic to the spore release.
-I don't like regening fruit, so just the 5-8 seconds between each 'launch' should be good enough.
-If attacked, by marine or alien, it will release an umbra cloud, spewing orange, it won't take damage from aliens though, as stated before.
-If the chamber is attacked and disturbed, meaning if a marine goes up to it and shoots it, it will release both clouds, now, the umbra, with shorter lasting span(like a lerks), would disapate, then reativate if shot again 5-8 seconds after the cloud disapears. The spore cloud will recloud if it's touched 5-8 seconds after the cloud goes.
-No upgrades to aliens >_> .
-Should be called Spore Chamber.
-Requires a 2nd Hive.
?-Make it also require DC?
?-Make it Instead require 3rd hive?
i orginized my thoughts, ty for the others for giving some others that i agree to, and the other ones i didnt really like. srry
If you're going to do that, at least make them explosive. There'd be some decent strategy in that case, as you'd want to defend your offense chambers, but you wouldn't want to take'em out if the chamber ever got destroyed. The umbra would make it difficult to take'em out with bullets, however, so you'd either have to have several marines focus fire on it (as opposed to the offensive chambers themselves) or you'd have to use grenade launchers (which this would most certainly encourage).
One thing is for sure, and that's that it should have some sort of duality. I don't think it should serve only one purpose.
Yep. We're talking about the new chamber idea, aren't we?
What will kill stratagy?
<!--quoteo(post=1687844:date=Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM:name=Hawkeye)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hawkeye @ Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1687844"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What gorge ISN'T going to have one of these near the offensive chambers when the 2nd hive comes? It encourages having more than one hive, but when has that ever NOT been the case that you'd want a 2nd hive?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
what!?
<!--quoteo(post=1687844:date=Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM:name=Hawkeye)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hawkeye @ Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1687844"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->If you're going to do that, at least make them explosive. There'd be some decent strategy in that case, as you'd want to defend your offense chambers, but you wouldn't want to take'em out if the chamber ever got destroyed.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I got something out of that, u want the spore chamber to explode on death
<!--quoteo(post=1687844:date=Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM:name=Hawkeye)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hawkeye @ Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1687844"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->The umbra would make it difficult to take'em out with bullets, however, so you'd either have to have several marines focus fire on it (as opposed to the offensive chambers themselves) or you'd have to use grenade launchers (which this would most certainly encourage).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I completly understood that
<!--quoteo(post=1687844:date=Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM:name=Hawkeye)--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hawkeye @ Sep 11 2008, 08:44 AM) <a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=1687844"><{POST_SNAPBACK}></a></div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->One thing is for sure, and that's that it should have some sort of duality. I don't think it should serve only one purpose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
dwha?????
The 'killing of strategy' to which I was referring lies in what I write immediately after:
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->What gorge ISN'T going to have one of these near the offensive chambers when the 2nd hive comes? It encourages having more than one hive, but when has that ever NOT been the case that you'd want a 2nd hive?<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Strategy in this case means you're presented with an unclear choice which depends on your situation at the time. In this case, it's clear how to use them and offers no choice if you want to be a good player.
<!--quoteo--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE</div><div class='quotemain'><!--quotec-->One thing is for sure, and that's that it should have some sort of duality. I don't think it should serve only one purpose.<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I don't think the chamber should be good for one thing. Is that better?
Good ideas gentlemen.
Gorge would therefor need a chamber (at a cost of 5 res?) to place somewhere to get the DI spreading to drop later OCs or other chambers around it. Why not combine it with your chamber? It would make sense to me, because this "important" chamber in the middle needs protection, since all chambers around it would die when it has been destroyed (or at least DI around will degenerate like in SC)
I was thinking about:
MCs: chamber releases spore when hit or enemy is near
DCs: umbra as you stated above
SCs: enemy gets webbed when near (intervall of like 5 seconds and webbed for 3 s. or something like this)
it would cover the overall strategy of the aliens I think: MCs as offensive behavior, DCs well defensive and SCs as the "traps".
MCs: chamber releases spore when hit or enemy is near
DCs: umbra as you stated above
SCs: enemy gets webbed when near (intervall of like 5 seconds and webbed for 3 s. or something like this)
it would cover the overall strategy of the aliens I think: MCs as offensive behavior, DCs well defensive and SCs as the "traps".<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
I like the idea a lot, though it would seem that the movement chambers should be the one to 'web' as it seems related to movement advantage for the Kharaa.
The SCs would release the spores (seems like the model even encourages this idea that it should have them).
The SCs would release the spores (seems like the model even encourages this idea that it should have them).<!--QuoteEnd--></div><!--QuoteEEnd-->
good idea, spores also cooperate better with focus (reduced armor)
While we are at it, lets throw a 2nd alien team in with plasma swords and phycic powers
oo, oo, y not give the marines a tank? That can deploy into a artillery, and maybe we can give them battlecruisers!
Give the Kharaa some burrowing capability, some overlords.
Yea that'd be nice.
<b><u>NO</u></b>
I say 'chambers' because, why limit them to the same old structures. When they could really be anything. For example, as the aliens hold an area, DI spreads throughout, after the DI has been there, it evolves, and grows defensive/offensive capabilities. Such as spore shooters and stuff like that. Now that sounds cool and all, and you don't even need a gorge involved, all you have to do is get the process started and defend the DI. And honestly, how many OCs do you see in a competative game? Hardly any. Why? Costs too much res, and theyre too easily destroyed.
That alone naturally makes the alien territory really theirs, kind of like sticking a pike in the ground and saying "This is ours, stay out."
Now how about how they evolve. Maybe small structures come out of the DI after a minute or so, sort of like blobs or tentacles, but at the end they have a small 'head'. Where the gorge can spend maybe 0-2 res and choose the type of blob they want for that room/corridor/whatever. Or maybe, they do it based on the chambers you have for the closest hive. Or maybe, they just do it all on their own randomly.
Either way, do we really want to have to spend more res on more useless structures? Or do we want dynamic environments?
We can give the gorges discounts
It costs XX amount to build a SC off DI, and only costs X amount to build on DI.
Now, if the structure is on the DI, it can evolve slowly, into better chamber
Like.... A gorge pays X amount to spawn a OC in a DI'd tunnel, 5 minutes into game, it's all buffed up, and the spikes do more damage, so that means, the farther the marines progress into the hive, the stronger the chambers should be. If it evolves and the DI is pushed back, it wont DEevolve, it'll just stop evolving and stay in the current form.
I think having a special 'Hive Creep' for the aliens to spawn on, should also be a place where if u put a chamber, it fully evolves in 10 seconds or so.
Each chamber can have say 5 Evolutions? Making it do a better job of its job
OC-Gets stronger and shoots deadlier, maybe more range?
DC-Heals faster, gets more armor
MC-Teleport RoF is sped up, regens adren faster
SC-by lvl 3 you can run and stay full cloak, each level expands the reach from tiny to big
?Spore Chamber?-Faster RoF, longer lasting clouds
hell, this can apply to the resource tower, except the RT will cost the same on DI or not, just, it only evolves on DI,
?RT?-IDK, more res and health?
This makes even MORE advantagew the DI gives to the aliens, making the marine commander have to pay attention to how far it's creeped near his base, so he can equip a marine with a flamey.
Creep-Hive DI
SPC-Spore Chamber
Having the chambers get tougher the more the marines come in shows how dug in the aliens are, now, if you decide to drop a OC next to a evolved 5 OC, there will be a diffrence =).
Having them cheaper on DI can be made logical by,
Instead of making the chamber from scratch with gorge spit, acid and working, he can just mold half of it with the DI, less work, more res saved.
The Hive 'creep' can be filled with nice juices that evolvw a chamber to lvl 5 quickly, this small area can be heavy guarded, making the hive room harder than ###### to STAY in, marines will have to do hit and runs on the hives.
This will deture the morning rush on the hives, the marines get to the hive with only LMGs and below the hive is wonderfuly placed Lvl 5 OCs, if the marines aren't smart enough, they'll die quick, but if those OCs were off the 'creep'.
then when you get a seconds hive, some lovely SPCs can be layed below the hives, and above them if the gorge can hookshot like a spider in real life, and will evolve almost instantly. =)
Creep will not just cover floor, but walls and ceiling, since you spawn as a glowy(I damn hope u do) and you decide in some owt seconds where to land, u can land on the ceiling and grow into a skulk, and hatch on the ceiling, making creep able to be layed anywhere.
Creep infact, starts to grow from the top of the hive, a new hive will start the creep growth at the connections, creep grows incredably fast, but once it reachs its end, it starts to make DI instead, which isnt as fast.
Obviously some aspects would have to be changed, such as adrenaline wouldn't do anything for a structure.
I was thinking along the following lines:
Defense<ul><li>Carpace - Armor proportional to total life of structure (something like 30 armor for every 100 life points)</li><li>Regeneration - Structures regenerate life twice as fast when hurt.</li><li>Redemption - When hurt beneath a certain %, there's the possibility of the resources for those structures being 'recycled' and evenly distributed across the team (or for the gorge who made it?).</li></ul>Movement<ul><li>Celerity - Performs its function at a faster rate. (Offensive structures shoot faster, defense chambers regenerate faster, etc.) Doesn't affect resource towers!</li><li>Silence - Structures don't make sounds (might be cool to hear the needles hitting but not the structures shooting them).</li><li>Adrenaline - <img src="style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/confused-fix.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="???" border="0" alt="confused-fix.gif" /></li></ul>Sensory<ul><li>Scent of Fear - Enemies near structure become visible (when applied to sensory chamber, increases range)</li><li>Focus - Performs actions slower but stronger (Offensive towers do twice as much damage and attack half as fast)</li><li>Cloaking - Cloaks structure without sensory chamber (sensory chamber with this upgrade decreases time to cloak allies in range)</li></ul>