Who would use cheats in NS2?

measlesmeasles Join Date: 2007-02-26 Member: 60122Posts: 385Members, Constellation
Only pratts would
The emergence of cheats or game-hacks is already becoming an issue.
As a long standing member of the community I DEMAND to know what cheats are being made and what initiatives UWE are planning to take to discourage this!

I think it should be brought out into the open. Name and shame, etc.
A policy should be included when installing NS2 that if a person is found using game-hacks then their key is destroyed and big fat angry ###### gorrilas goes to their house and have a 'murder in the dark' party..

If UWE are going to wait till last minute to address this issue I need to know.
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Comments

  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Posts: 1,903Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited February 2012
    Beside that this would be nice to know, I want to note, that since the motion scanning update of the obs, many alien players are screaming like hell for cheaters.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • measlesmeasles Join Date: 2007-02-26 Member: 60122Posts: 385Members, Constellation

    Motion scanning doesn't give a marine the ability to cut with an axe from 10 paces..
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  • RisingSunRisingSun Rising Join Date: 2004-04-19 Member: 28015Posts: 872Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    Though i dont condone cheating leave it be. We are testing a beta and the features within. Balance should not be an issue till everything is in and fun is never a factor in a beta. It would be nice to have fun and play full rewarding games, but not mandatory.

    The game is so open and malleable for a reason. Locking it up would only hurt at this point. People are creative and will get around whatever the devs come up with. So why waste time. Servers are rare and full ones even more so. Find the cheater, ban them, and see no more issues. If they are that hardcore on their cheats they buy another game? Great. More for UWE.
  • antacidantacid Join Date: 2007-08-07 Member: 61821Posts: 483Members, NS2 Playtester
    edited February 2012
    The following are considered "Cheating" by 95% of people who cry about "cheating"

    1. Scans
    2. Lag
    3. Bad Aim
    4 Good aim (on enemy's part)
    5. People who cry about everything
    6. Obs
    7. Parasite


    If there is real cheating, then a server simply has to document it.

    it does raise the question though, are NS2 games going to be VAC secure?
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • swalkswalk Say hello to my little friend. Join Date: 2011-01-20 Member: 78384Posts: 1,864Members, Squad Five Blue
    I use lua aimbot everyday, please note me on your secret list of cheaters.

    NS2 6v6 Gathers
    QUOTE (Floodinator @ Feb 28 2012, 08:41 PM) »
    it's always a good idea to kill swalk or he will kill you.
  • BJHBnade_spammerBJHBnade_spammer Join Date: 2005-02-25 Member: 42431Posts: 464Members
    i use cheats for legitimate reasons. like testing new mods and adding bots lol people are just pulling your leg if they say they are cheating.

    i would like to see video evidence of said cheating if there really is any going on yet.
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Posts: 1,903Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (antacid @ Feb 28 2012, 02:32 PM) »
    The following are considered "Cheating" by 95% of people who cry about "cheating"

    1. Scans
    2. Lag
    3. Bad Aim
    4 Good aim (on enemy's part)
    5. People who cry about everything
    6. Obs
    7. Parasite


    If there is real cheating, then a server simply has to document it.

    it does raise the question though, are NS2 games going to be VAC secure?


    ^This!
  • swalkswalk Say hello to my little friend. Join Date: 2011-01-20 Member: 78384Posts: 1,864Members, Squad Five Blue
    QUOTE (BJHBnade_spammer @ Feb 28 2012, 03:29 PM) »
    i would like to see video evidence of said cheating if there really is any going on yet.

    Yes please.
    QUOTE (measles @ Feb 28 2012, 12:49 PM) »
    Motion scanning doesn't give a marine the ability to cut with an axe from 10 paces..

    Maybe video of this lag, that you call "cheating".
    The range of the axe is dictated by the server, client changes won't affect that, afaik.

    NS2 6v6 Gathers
    QUOTE (Floodinator @ Feb 28 2012, 08:41 PM) »
    it's always a good idea to kill swalk or he will kill you.
  • YuukiYuuki Join Date: 2010-11-20 Member: 75079Posts: 1,731Members
    Mod download and lua file check was on the progress page at some point, wasn't it ?
  • FloodinatorFloodinator [HBZ] Member Join Date: 2005-02-22 Member: 42087Posts: 1,301Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (BJHBnade_spammer @ Feb 28 2012, 03:29 PM) »
    i use cheats for legitimate reasons. like testing new mods and adding bots lol people are just pulling your leg if they say they are cheating.

    i would like to see video evidence of said cheating if there really is any going on yet.


    When we have 1. Person spectate we can start with videos, now in 3. Person you can't see anything.
    image
  • derWalterderWalter Join Date: 2008-10-29 Member: 65323Posts: 634Members
    QUOTE (antacid @ Feb 28 2012, 02:32 PM) »
    The following are considered "Cheating" by 95% of people who cry about "cheating"

    1. Scans
    2. Lag
    3. Bad Aim
    4 Good aim (on enemy's part)
    5. People who cry about everything
    6. Obs
    7. Parasite


    If there is real cheating, then a server simply has to document it.

    it does raise the question though, are NS2 games going to be VAC secure?



    vac and secure without a NOT in the same sentence? :D

    vac is a joke!

    cheatcoders are so freaking good and hacking this deep into the OS
    that you have to be some kind of god in coding to prevent 90% of them.
    all the good hacks are rootkits and some of them download the code
    live over the net directly into ram...

    stuff like that was happening when i was playing online 2-3 years ago,
    do not know how far they evolved in the meantime, but i bet they did.


    cancel vac, vac always was a big joke, the only advantage and it IS the ONLY
    advantage is, that they can ban permanently from the whole system.


    find some one else doing it, do it on your own (you will need 1-3 coders just for that)
    but do not use vac and tell ppl it is safe... what a joke. all big leagues have their
    own anticheatsystems - think about WHY!
  • Chris0132Chris0132 Join Date: 2009-07-25 Member: 68262Posts: 3,854Members
    QUOTE (derWalter @ Feb 28 2012, 03:58 PM) »
    find some one else doing it, do it on your own (you will need 1-3 coders just for that)
    but do not use vac and tell ppl it is safe... what a joke. all big leagues have their
    own anticheatsystems - think about WHY!


    Possibly the same reason everyone uses their own (ineffectual) drm systems that enitrely fail to prevent people from pirating software?

    I don't know what that reason actually is, but it might be the same reason as making your own ineffectual anti cheat system.

    VAC does what it does quite well, it makes it harder to cheat, it's also widely available so developers can use it without having to spend too much time solving the problem themselves.

    Essentially, it's like locking your door. It won't stop people from breaking into your house if they really want to, but it does make it a little harder and requires minimal effort from you. Perfect solution fallacy.

    The only real way to prevent cheating is to admin the server constantly, and generally having a large playerbase also helps. Which is why most games work fine with off the shelf anti cheat solutions. It isn't because the anti cheats work, it's because most people don't put the effort in to get past them, and popular servers tend to have quite a lot of admins.

    You will always have some people cheating, deal with it, go play something else or join another server if it annoys you.
  • AsranielAsraniel Join Date: 2002-06-03 Member: 724Posts: 2,228Members, NS2 Playtester, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow, Subnautica Playtester
    I really only heard about the alien dark vision cheat where you see much more than you are supposed to see (flames etc). Except for that i woudln't know of any cheat.
    Ollj: "ns_napo, the first good custom map ever" ns_napo
  • playerplayer Join Date: 2010-09-12 Member: 73982Posts: 1,677Members
    Well there are also the marine-flashlight settings you could modify (to make them very easily spotted by aliens), and a couple of other aesthetics-settings I probably should not mention.

    Needless to say there will never be a 100% cheat-proof system as long as we play these games on our own machines, which are entirely under our control (and therefor can be considered compromised). Though of course as much as possible needs to be done to frustrate cheaters in their ways. Hask-checks for Lua-scripts is supposed to be implemented at some point, after that some kind of protection for the engine-DLLs would be needed (VAC could do that).
  • WheeeeWheeee Join Date: 2003-02-18 Member: 13713Posts: 4,160Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    hell turning up your gamma has always been 'cheating'
    QUOTE (EEK)
    Don't assume that because I said something it means I actually was thinking that the core of the sun was going to be replaced with hot dogs.
  • DghelneshiDghelneshi Aims to surpass Fana in post edits. Join Date: 2011-11-01 Member: 130634Posts: 941Members, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (measles @ Feb 28 2012, 11:34 AM) »
    As a long standing member of the community I DEMAND to know what cheats are being made

    Err... what?

    QUOTE (Asraniel @ Feb 28 2012, 05:37 PM) »
    I really only heard about the alien dark vision cheat where you see much more than you are supposed to see (flames etc). Except for that i woudln't know of any cheat.
    QUOTE (Wheeee @ Feb 28 2012, 07:01 PM) »
    hell turning up your gamma has always been 'cheating'

    Same as disabling atmospherics could count as a "cheat" since you see a lot more without them, especially due to the atrocious marine flashlight.


    I'd like the hash-checking to be made so you can add a list of hashes for every file to the server, making it possible to allow some simple mods. We'd need an administrated place to store the hashes and for servers to automatically download them.
  • HemiHemi Join Date: 2012-02-13 Member: 145362Posts: 25Members
    QUOTE
    As a long standing member of the community I DEMAND to know what cheats are being made


    amazing...
  • TechercizerTechercizer 7th Player Join Date: 2011-06-11 Member: 103832Posts: 1,850Members
    edited February 2012
    Hell, you can DEMAND anything you want, but if you don't have solid justifications and a moral high-ground, you'll just come across as childish.

    Now if you happen to record some footage of somebody using a jetpack as onos or shooting grenades instead of lerk spikes, you're perfectly justified in asking them what they're doing and why. Heck, talk to the server owners and grab some logs so we can see what files are being modified. Getting lag and the complaining about it on the forums to random people won't solve anything, though.
    Post edited by Unknown User on

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  • thefonzthefonz Join Date: 2011-06-22 Member: 105847Posts: 491Members
    QUOTE (swalk @ Feb 28 2012, 09:10 AM) »
    I use lua aimbot everyday, please note me on your secret list of cheaters.


    You have been noted. From this day forth if I encounter you in a game, I will make a concerted effort to specifically target you above all other players and priorities so long as I am not being detrimental to my team. There may be some sarcasm in this statement.

    I really don't like 3rd party ('outside') stuff that enhances the play of whoever uses it. If the devs add an aimbot option to the game that can be used by everyone if the so desire, sweet. If you are going outside the game to gain the edge, well, friggin jerk. In these cases punishment should be decided on a server to server basis. Some may like and allow it or dislike and punish it. Ok fine. maybe I will/won't play that server.

    That said, there are 'outside' advantages than are just part of life. i.e. ping, PC-A > PC-B, ect.

    As for 'true' cheats (wallhacks, noclip, 10 foot long axes hacks, ect.)......Find the ###### and let fly the

    BANHAMMER
  • FloodinatorFloodinator [HBZ] Member Join Date: 2005-02-22 Member: 42087Posts: 1,301Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    QUOTE (thefonz @ Feb 28 2012, 08:33 PM) »
    You have been noted. From this day forth if I encounter you in a game, I will make a concerted effort to specifically target you above all other players and priorities so long as I am not being detrimental to my team. There may be some sarcasm in this statement.


    Even if it's sarcastic, it's always a good idea to kill swalk or he will kill you.

    As long as we are in beta and commands like r_mode unlit work it usless to talk about cheaters.
    image
  • playerplayer Join Date: 2010-09-12 Member: 73982Posts: 1,677Members
    I do believe the r_modes are locked behind cheat-mode now.
  • DrDopehatDrDopehat Join Date: 2009-09-04 Member: 68696Posts: 39Members
    I cheat - my ingame name is: DrHat

    also, I'm an atheist and I support evolution...oh and I eat children
  • Soul_RiderSoul_Rider Mod Bean Join Date: 2004-06-19 Member: 29388Posts: 2,973Members, Constellation
    I'm not the kind of person to cry cheat in a game, but I do think they exist in NS2.

    When I was Alien comm we had a solo marine with a JP come into our 2nd hive, we had 2 gorges, a lerk and a fade attacking him. It took him 7 seconds to take down the fade, a gorge and the hive. That is not possible without cheats.
  • Andrew_e1Andrew_e1 Join Date: 2005-01-07 Member: 33331Posts: 77Members, Constellation
    As of now im really not worried about cheats, but ever since they announced the "openness" of the game then I started to wonder if cheats would become an issue when the game finally comes out.

    People are modding every single aspect of the game....which while has its PROs, I wonder what CONs will it have.

    Lets take the flash lights for example... Are people gonna be able to easily mod them and have some sort of super flashlight or something like that? Or modify the alien vision so you can see through walls etc.

    I do think its something to think about...
  • playerplayer Join Date: 2010-09-12 Member: 73982Posts: 1,677Members
    The server should recieve a checksum of the script-file to be loaded by the client (upon connecting), and evaluate it against a known set of checksums. If so much as a comma has been changed (in for example the flashlight script you mentioned), the checksum will be wholly different and as such denied.

    You can mod a client as much as you like, if the server doesn't accept the changes you made, you won't be able to use it simply. This means that any modding (such as crosshairs, HUD or whichever) will be at the discretion of individual server(-operators). It will not be like it was in NS1, where the only discriminatory was mp_consistency.
  • JuCCiJuCCi Join Date: 2011-08-08 Member: 114961Posts: 524Members, NS2 Map Tester
    Alot of people cheat in this game (mod stuff to get more fps or crosshairs etc.). That all gives them a edge. No as for aim bots or wall hacks i dunno, i hope not. I wish you had to play vanilla and that was it.
  • That_Annoying_KidThat_Annoying_Kid Sire of Titles Join Date: 2003-03-01 Member: 14175Posts: 5,578Members, Constellation
    QUOTE (Hemi @ Feb 28 2012, 12:12 PM) »
    amazing...



    yes it really is



    Also I've seen cheats discussed for NS2 as a way of motivating the dev team
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Posts: 4,983Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow mod
    QUOTE (JuCCi-PuCCi @ Feb 28 2012, 02:47 PM) »
    Alot of people cheat in this game (mod stuff to get more fps or crosshairs etc.). That all gives them a edge. No as for aim bots or wall hacks i dunno, i hope not. I wish you had to play vanilla and that was it.

    I play vanilla, but I've been sorely tempted to use a crosshair mod because I'm not a fan of the melee attacks having no crosshair. I'd love for server owners to be able to whitelist certain mods they find acceptable so players can use them if they choose.
  • ÒŗăNģёÒŗăNģё Join Date: 2012-02-09 Member: 144437Posts: 133Members, Constellation, Squad Five Blue
    A simple crosshair mod could give a huge gameplay advantage, this is why I think they should bring back the crosshair selection like NS had.

    At times I find myself lost using the pistol because the dot is so small or using the rifle and not seeing things because the triangle blocks things that are faraway and cant properly set aim on a vent or somethin, but thats just me.. I can see why people want to mod this game but I strongly suggest Server side checks. There should be servers that want vanilla gameplay and others that allow certain mods or all mods.
  • NSbadassNSbadass Join Date: 2012-02-28 Member: 147695Posts: 3Members
    edited February 2012
    --Accusing inv.Dusk of hacking--

    Please do NOT accuse people of hacking on this forum, take it up with the admin of the server you were playing on. --Zaggy
    Post edited by Unknown User on
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