Development Blog Update - Friday update - Lerk reveal

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  • SykomykeSykomyke Join Date: 2003-08-28 Member: 20316Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow Posts: 17
    For Lerk Spore Secondary attack:

    -A slow releasing gas that constantly drains energy from the lerk and is dispersed behind the lerk as he flies. The gas is a slightly thicker version of the normal spores. Concentrated spores, if you will. As such they do not float in the area but rapidly fall to the ground. Once the reach a surface, they transform from a gas into a corrosive liquid that does damage over time to whatever it is touching (in the case of buildings it allows a minor DoT component). Against marines that are in it, or step in the goo they find themselves taking significant armor damage, and minor health damage per second, an escalating amount as they continue to stand in it. The goo lasts approximately 5-8 seconds.

    And yes this was an idea I took from the Spitter in L4D2.
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  • NditionNdition Join Date: 2009-07-10 Member: 68104Members Posts: 1
    Nice video and as for the secondary some nice psychosis effect would be nice.
  • Fall0utFall0ut Join Date: 2003-09-18 Member: 20988Members, Constellation Posts: 100
  • KhyrisKhyris Join Date: 2010-02-26 Member: 70728Members Posts: 5
    I'd actually like to see something to make up for the removal of primal scream... maybe an adrenaline spore cloud which lasts for ~4 seconds ... maybe is a bit hazy like umbra, and gives aliens in it a speed/damage boost that wears off ~4 seconds after exiting the cloud.... so like a maximum of ~8 seconds of adrenaline if they stay in the cloud for the entire duration.

    Another idea... Make the "sniper spike" the primary fire and the spores secondary (machine-gun spikes never seemed biologically plausible to me anyway)... then put melee as the second weapon... primary bite and secondary lerk lift, but let the lerk lift do low talon damage over time to marines you can pick up and fly off with (until they shoot your butt). Endless fun could be have grabbing unwary marines standing too close to a bottomless pitt... bubye! Latching onto JP'ers mid-air and dragging them down where skulks can reach them would be a useful ability also. You wouldn't be able to fly-off with a heavy, but you could at least latch onto him and bite-bite-bite... if a skilled player could latch onto a heavy from the back, this would force marines to cover eachother and not go "rambo" with the HA. Make some damage threshold to the lerk that would force him to drop so that marines have SOME chance of breaking free.

    I also like the high-cooldown small-sized cloud-which-disables-structures idea. Like, 3 second duration, 4 second cooldown. I don't think it would be overpowered since the lerk would have to be doing that INSTEAD of shooting spikes/spores, plus it's not a lock-out so IP's can still spawn, and armories can still dispense, sige cannons can still fire, just 1/4 as often assuming constant spamming (unless you get two lerks, in which case why are you dumb marines letting 2 lerks sit there??). But being able to disable resource income or an armory resupply from range... making an annoyance that marines HAVE to respond to, can be very useful tactically. If marines can have seige, this would be a good balance, because it allows aliens to at least temporarily disrupt marine activities in a room without having to have charge INTO the room. You get some lerks around the map keeping the RT's disabled until the skulks can chew them down would only make a small difference in resources to marines... but sometimes small short term resource differences turn into large differences in the long run. This would also discourage marines from the annoying habit of building every damn structure on top of eachother so nobody can walk through the base. Closer together they are, more likely multiple structures get disabled by one cloud.
  • remiremi remedy [blu.knight] Join Date: 2003-11-18 Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester Posts: 2,679 admin
    edited February 2010
    QUOTE (locallyunscene @ Feb 26 2010, 12:50 PM) »
    I like the idea of a bombardier lerk that increased dmg taken jarate style.

    Or to throw in some yomi layers:
    • Spore does normal damage to marines
    • Flamethrowers/explosives burn gas away
    • Alt-Spore does no(reduced?) dmg to rines
    • Alt-Spore ignites when burned doing more dmg

    That's good. I was trying to think how to add in some yomi myself :)


    I think this would work with the jarate effect too.
    Also re: your edit, I don't think spikes should interact with it.
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  • remiremi remedy [blu.knight] Join Date: 2003-11-18 Member: 23112Members, Super Administrators, Forum Admins, NS2 Developer, NS2 Playtester Posts: 2,679 admin
    QUOTE (Licho @ Feb 26 2010, 01:13 PM) »
    Sticky time-bombs sound fun, especially the twist with bomb stuck on a marine :)

    Btw., are animations from this video real in-game animations or just for video? They look nice.

    I like this too. It could have usability beyond flying in, but to really make good use of the sticky party, you'd have to.
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  • GurrgGurrg Join Date: 2010-02-16 Member: 70594Members Posts: 1
    i love the spike gun
  • CXZmanCXZman Join Date: 2010-02-26 Member: 70730Members Posts: 40
    edited February 2010
    QUOTE (Xiphias @ Feb 26 2010, 10:02 PM) »
    It would release the toxin into the bloodstream instead, forcing the marine to continiously loose health until he dies or recieves a medpack, the rate would be subject to balancing.

    This would be useful against jetpacks, because they'd have to land or otherwise seek out a medpack, reducing their mobility.



    I was thinking something like that, but with more impact on gameplay :

    LERK PLAGUE : a single shot, with a pretty high cost (maybe only two shots a row), with a distinctive sound on impact. It only have effect if it hits on a marine's head (headshot, that is). The marine is now "infected" and starts losing health at a small rate that slowly increases until it's unbearable (and deadly). While infected, the marine emits a distinctive sound of coughing, all the time. That sound could go even worse and louder along with health going down faster and faster.

    The trick is, it's not only a poison, it's a plague that spreads on other marines if they stay near an infected one for too long.


    The aim is to spread panic over a marine team that suddenly have to work quite differently. Commander has to think a way around, choosing between several strategies :
    - reforming teams so the infested one stick with a limited number of guys that stick together, and send the other ones elsewhere. That is fighting the plague with suicidal missions, but without risking doing something that ends suxxing. But if they survive together, there are now all plagued. So there's still a problem.
    - banning the infected marine and sending him on a dangerous mission that can help a bit, but mostly ends on a respawn spot.
    - giving out medpack so marines camping at a crucial point of the map can sustain the disease a little more at the expense of resources.
    - spending time in a research of a vaccine (that would be a new technology) that can lower toxic spores effect and completely cures/prevents from the lerk plague.


    I'm not sure that would be a tough one to implement, but I'm convinced this could shake the game in a nice way.
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  • SekerSeker Join Date: 2007-03-06 Member: 60259Members Posts: 369
    DPS infection like which jumps over onto other marines would be a bit too hard or ? :P
  • eoyeoy Join Date: 2004-11-18 Member: 32860Members Posts: 80
    edited February 2010
    I know this isn't really on topic, but I saw the lerk video and I just thought

    can we please have smoke in the engine? All those shots would look incredible with a little smoke coming from pipes on the walls or some creepy alieny fog. Just think about how smoke would look with lightning and everything omg!

    And yeah, the lerk looks and sounds amazing.
  • 0dy0dy Join Date: 2004-01-31 Member: 25788Members Posts: 36
    what about an alt fire that does the following:

    it does 0 damage to the marines as long as they dont shoot a gun. if they fire a gun the cloud becomes agitated and does damage to the marine. the damage does not depend on the amount of gun damage the marine is doing, rather the duration he is using the gun/how many bullets he is firing.

    they can use melee in this cloud and they receive no damage. the idea that the cloud damage does not increase as the marine weapon damage increases is so that in late game this is not very effective (but very effective early game). idk, just a thought.
  • noncomposmentisnoncomposmentis Join Date: 2004-11-13 Member: 32773Members Posts: 342
    edited February 2010
    PLZ WALLPAPER THE FIRST CONCEPT ART (16:10 widescreen)

    I like the Spore alt-fire suggestions people have about slowing down marines. I think it would be nice if the lerk had some utility against HA, so making alt-fire a "grease spot" or something floor-based would still enable JP to fly over it, giving some distinction to the lerk and the marine classes. It's no fun being lerk in NS against a team of HA. That may be different already though, with spikes.

    QUOTE
    can we please have smoke in the engine?

    They haven't added particle effects yet, which they plan to do, so I would assume that yes, smoke and jets of steam will be in NS2.
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  • SlycasterSlycaster Limited Edition Join Date: 2002-01-24 Member: 24Members, NS1 Playtester Posts: 2,301 Auto Verified
    QUOTE (eoy @ Feb 26 2010, 03:44 PM) »
    I know this isn't really on topic, but I saw the lerk video and I just thought

    can we please have smoke in the engine? All those shots would look incredible with a little smoke coming from pipes on the walls or some creepy alieny fog. Just think about how smoke would look with lightning and everything omg!

    And yeah, the lerk looks and sounds amazing.


    Don't worry man, I don't believe the editor has the full particle engine in yet so naturally those additions will be made later. The teaser trailer does demonstrate a bit of it though, and it looks gorgeous.
    Cyanide
  • derWalterderWalter Join Date: 2008-10-29 Member: 65323Members Posts: 634 Auto Verified
    i played a lot of sc2 beta now and i am absolutely not pleased.

    SO I'm waiting for the ns2 alpha! :P



    this creature seems to be perfect.




    spore alt. fire: since there is no melee attack, he could spit a high toxic bubble or something like that.
    it would take some time to switch to the other slot and press alt fire, so it would require a little bit of skill and training




    greetings from austria :)
  • Gnu3nGnu3n Join Date: 2007-09-03 Member: 62150Members Posts: 5
    For secondary attack, how about a healing cloud wich uses all the adrenaline and "dazes" the lerk for some seconds, renders it unable to regen adrenaline for that amount of time
  • -Diesel--Diesel- Join Date: 2009-09-13 Member: 68769Members Posts: 278
    QUOTE (Gnu3n @ Feb 26 2010, 05:13 PM) »
    For secondary attack, how about a healing cloud wich uses all the adrenaline and "dazes" the lerk for some seconds, renders it unable to regen adrenaline for that amount of time


    I really hated those clouds..


    How about healing juice that it spits out ontop of other aliens.

    Clouds were just... lame.
  • BadMouthBadMouth It ceases to be exclusive when you can have a custom member titl Join Date: 2004-05-21 Member: 28815Members Posts: 1,018
    I really liked the lerk video. The lerk looks much meaner now, very much like a vulture. The animation to that had the spikes come out from the wings when weapon change was pretty neat.

    And I couldn't help buy notice the marine idle animations. Very neat.

    Alt fire to spore could be spore trail. Leave a line of spore behind when flying.

    One thing I'm wondering about is the death animation for the lerk. And how much physics will impact it when it dies. Would it tumble on the floor when it is killed while flying at a fast speed?
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  • smallfrysmallfry Join Date: 2009-04-10 Member: 67132Members Posts: 6
    I like the more support-orientated abilities rather than straight damage. My preference would be something like, shooting out concentrated goo that limits the visibility of one marine. Think of it like being boomer-biled in Left 4 Dead- it's not frustrating at all, it just makes things more tense and encourages teamwork. With it, the lerk will at least have 1 ability against heavies.

    Umbra of course would be great, too. I hope one of the aliens gets something like it!
  • TriggermanTriggerman Graphic Artist Join Date: 2004-11-10 Member: 32724Members, WC 2013 - Supporter Posts: 553 Auto Verified
    edited February 2010
    First off, really great design. Wouldn't mind seeing some eye-movement on it but it looks crazy enough as it is I guess!

    My suggestions for secondary fire:

    UMBRA

    Honestly, it's a good ability. If it feels lacklustre, you could make it block motion sensors so marine players can only see them in person, but Commander as well as other players won't be able to track or see them.
    Or it could have an adrenaline increase while teammates stand inside it.
    But it's still awesome since I think the Lerk works best as a support class.

    SPORE GRENADE
    It takes more adrenaline to use, but the Lerk shoots away a spore-sack that can bounce off walls before finally detonating. This way they can lob and bounce it against walls while staying protected. Otherwise the effect is exactly the same as the primary fire.
    Possible adjustment would be to right-click again to detonate it, making it possible to create an ambush or an escape route by planting one of these "mines", but that would require a heavy cost in adrenaline.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • TheGivingTreeTheGivingTree Join Date: 2003-01-09 Member: 12070Members Posts: 511
    edited February 2010
    Looks great, although it's not very different from how the Lerk was in NS, there just isn't that much you can really do with the Lerk. And for alt. fire suggestion, well actually after reading the previous post,
    Machinaster already covered what I was going to say.
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  • PipiPipi Join Date: 2009-12-09 Member: 69550Members Posts: 743
    This concept better.

    image
  • JAmazonJAmazon Join Date: 2009-02-21 Member: 66503Members Posts: 712
    Someone suggested some kind of trailing powder type alt-fire. I really like the idea of a carpet bombing ability. Perhaps acid or something that DPS's whatever is unfortunate enough to be underneath his flight path.

    Also the large head crest has me excited that mabe there will be some kind of divebomb/headbutt type ability? ;)
  • Kouji_SanKouji_San Sr. Hινε Uρкεερεг - EUPT Deputy The Netherlands, Hoogezand Join Date: 2003-05-13 Member: 16271Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue Posts: 13,166 Auto Verified
    I expected a Lork on Clorf video, but this will do :P

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  • NeoSniperNeoSniper Join Date: 2005-06-02 Member: 52976Members Posts: 423
    edited February 2010
    Spore Alt-fire

    Shoots out just like spore, but instead of bursting into a gas cloud, it covers a small area with damaging-goo (walls, floor,ceiling). Lower DPS than spore but takes longer to fizzle out and does global damage (including armor). If you hit marines directly then they will receive the same DPS as if stepping on it but for a shorter duration.

    Lot's of other good ideas.

    EDIT: Also really great work on the reveal video and lol'd at the "Matt the Lerk" concept art.
  • Squeal_Like_A_PigSqueal_Like_A_Pig Janitor Join Date: 2002-01-25 Member: 66Members, Super Administrators, NS1 Playtester, NS2 Developer, Reinforced - Supporter, WC 2013 - Silver, Subnautica Developer Posts: 2,796 admin
    QUOTE (Licho @ Feb 26 2010, 09:13 PM) »
    Btw., are animations from this video real in-game animations or just for video? They look nice.


    Yes, the video only used actual in game animations.

    --Cory
  • perfectheatperfectheat Join Date: 2007-06-28 Member: 61405Members Posts: 79
    Really like the Lerk. I don't really have a killer alt-fire idea. But would really like to see some kind of hallucinating spray that makes the marines see things. Like incoming Kharaa that aren't there and so on. This cloud could be dropped more like a bomb/on the spot. Is it possible to do camera/view changes so that it would look like the walls are coming in, or the distance becomes much closer? Meaning a bit harder to navigate. A bit like when drunk and seeing double Skulks.

    Is the spore cloud flammable? Would be cool to be able to bomb marines that are flaming infestation with it.

    Is the 0:24 - 0:26 a placeholder sound? I don't know why it stuck out for me as I really like all the other sounds so far.

    Cheers.
  • SCIBOTICSCIBOTIC Join Date: 2010-02-26 Member: 70737Members Posts: 1
    QUOTE (JAmazon @ Feb 27 2010, 09:47 AM) »
    Someone suggested some kind of trailing powder type alt-fire. I really like the idea of a carpet bombing ability. Perhaps acid or something that DPS's whatever is unfortunate enough to be underneath his flight path.

    Also the large head crest has me excited that mabe there will be some kind of divebomb/headbutt type ability? ;)


    I like this idea, how about a fast swoop with a trail of spores? They could use it to escape or harass enemies.
  • juicejuice Join Date: 2003-01-28 Member: 12886Members, Constellation Posts: 1,044
    I like everything about the new lerk, except he seems a little slow and clunky. Even though he looks bigger than NS1 lerk, he should still be fast.
  • schkorpioschkorpio I can mspaint Join Date: 2003-05-23 Member: 16635Members Posts: 3,542 Auto Verified
    edited February 2010
    wow the lerk is awesome - the game has such a nice atmosphere :)
    really glad the spikes are back!


    I don't really like the trail idea, it seems a little redundant if you can just shoot a spore cloud anyway.



    What about gorge lift - or picking up marines and dropping them to their dooM!
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  • JirikiJiriki retired ns1 player Join Date: 2003-01-04 Member: 11780Members, NS1 Playtester, Squad Five Silver Posts: 611 Auto Verified
    edited February 2010
    Nice lerk model but.

    QUOTE
    The biggest change for the Lerk in NS2 is the switch back to spikes instead of bite (as in NS v1.0). We wanted to keep him as differentiated as possible and this seemed the easiest way to do it. It also doesn't seem very Lerk-like to have him fly up to a structure and then sit on the ground and bite it. He should be hiding in the rafters and in vents and attacking from range.


    I completely disagree. I used to play back in 1.04 days and I still do competitively. Lerk v1.0 is dead boring compared to the 3.0 lerk which requires vertical aerial movement skills and ability to dodge bullets while trying to hit target. This is skillwise a lot more interesting than sitting in a vent and shooting from range. I could get you probably top 10 lerks to agree on this. Anyone can spore or spike from a vent but it takes talent to be effective in close combat with the bite.

    And also you are not keeping it "differentiated". Bite made lerk very different from all other lifeforms, it brought the "mini-airplane" into NS. There're already lots of ranged weapons but nothing that requires kind of flight skills.
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