<!--QuoteBegin-SaltzBad+Feb 21 2005, 04:57 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (SaltzBad @ Feb 21 2005, 04:57 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-laffo+Feb 21 2005, 02:05 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (laffo @ Feb 21 2005, 02:05 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> Do you not realize that ex_interp allows the client to pass off hits at an interpolated hitbox to the server as if it were actual data recieved from the server?
<img src='http://www.virtualteachercentre.ca/Literacy/images/read_suceed.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> That would be a high, not low ex_interp value <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> (not to mention that doesn't work due to hit detection being done via the server backlog not clientside) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> i think you need to <img src='http://www.virtualteachercentre.ca/Literacy/images/read_suceed.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> also.
laffo... for once try not to act that stubborn... We already told; what you claim exploitable about ex_interp; is not related with it... One and only thing that can be considered as an exploit is what doomie told... But come on; we are playing a game that has no instagib AWPs that penetrate walls... Seeing enemy a 10th of a second before do not differ much in ns...
Try to read and understand instead of blindly defending your ideas; which infact most of them are crap... Accepting your faults is a mature act... I know you can do it... <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-tjosan+Feb 21 2005, 11:09 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tjosan @ Feb 21 2005, 11:09 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Align+Feb 21 2005, 04:37 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Align @ Feb 21 2005, 04:37 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-tjosan+Feb 20 2005, 01:31 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tjosan @ Feb 20 2005, 01:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> since he will be teleporting as bad as you are (if you have a low ex_interp value). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh, okay. So what does cl_updaterate have to do with this? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ack, you're right... I mixed it up :| <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> What? Now I'm just confused... Would I teleport around on other players' screens with a low cl_updaterate, and would that also make them teleport around on my screen? Or would the latter only happen if I set a low cl_cmdrate? Or is it the other way around? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-Align+Feb 22 2005, 07:12 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Align @ Feb 22 2005, 07:12 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-tjosan+Feb 21 2005, 11:09 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tjosan @ Feb 21 2005, 11:09 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-Align+Feb 21 2005, 04:37 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (Align @ Feb 21 2005, 04:37 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> <!--QuoteBegin-tjosan+Feb 20 2005, 01:31 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (tjosan @ Feb 20 2005, 01:31 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> since he will be teleporting as bad as you are (if you have a low ex_interp value). <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Oh, okay. So what does cl_updaterate have to do with this? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Ack, you're right... I mixed it up :| <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> What? Now I'm just confused... Would I teleport around on other players' screens with a low cl_updaterate, and would that also make them teleport around on my screen? Or would the latter only happen if I set a low cl_cmdrate? Or is it the other way around? <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> Humz, sorry for the confusion... I'm getting awfully unsure myself now.
cl_updaterate is the rate by which the client recieves updates from the server.
cl_cmdrate is the rate by which the server recieves updates from the client.
A low cmdrate would make that player teleport when other people percieve him.
I'll leave it at that, since the rest of my ramblings would be speculations >_>
cl_updaterate determines number of updates the client gonna get per second... lowering cl_updaterate increases the time between each update thus increases the so called teleporting of the models... It effects only you as you only get lesser packets from the server...
cl_cmdrate determines number of updates the client gonna send to server per second... lowering cl_cmdrate will increase the teleporting of the client in others sight... It effects all the players that has higher updaterate than your cmdrate in the server... They all see you teleporting around...
That's why cmdrate is highly exploitable... minimum cmdrate that can be set is 10; which is far too low... There is a serverside cvar for setting minimum cmdrate thus server admins can increase the limit... However it is broken and has no effect on client's settings... Ive been informed about a AMX plugin that fixes minimum cmdrate cvar...
Devs either have to lock min cmdrate to 30; or fix broken mincmdrate command...
pSyk0mAnNerdish by NatureGermanyJoin Date: 2003-08-07Member: 19166Members, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, NS2 Community Developer
A locked cmdrate wouldn't help that much, because you will still be able to change your upload-bandwith to force a lower amount of updates, the server receives. I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background.
<!--QuoteBegin-pSyk0mAn+Feb 22 2005, 05:46 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (pSyk0mAn @ Feb 22 2005, 05:46 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> A locked cmdrate wouldn't help that much, because you will still be able to change your upload-bandwith to force a lower amount of updates, the server receives. I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Anything that causes exploiting to be a huge inconvenience instead of a matter of bringing down the console is a good thing in my book... So a low cl_cmdrate has no bad effects on the user? Like, if you shoot and get bitten at almost the same time, youre not going to hit with your shot because youre registered as dead before the packet containing the shot info arrives?
<!--QuoteBegin--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> </td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin-->Or someone with high rates playing from a large distance - european playing on a west coast US server. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
When I play on US servers I get a somewhat stable 150-ish ping and hit-reg is horrible, it feels just like in the olden days when server load was a huge issue. It's a fair bet that it's more annoying for you than any one else.
<!--QuoteBegin-pSyk0mAn+Feb 22 2005, 11:46 AM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (pSyk0mAn @ Feb 22 2005, 11:46 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> A locked cmdrate wouldn't help that much, because you will still be able to change your upload-bandwith to force a lower amount of updates, the server receives. I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd--> Exactly. If you are seeding a torrent in the background, close to your upload speed cap, then you will teleport around, regardless of what's going on in your NS settings, or a server's NS settings. If someone really wants to exploit like that, they will always be able to do so, but the holes in NS itself should be blocked.
If you think someone is exploiting lag, then tell the server admins. If they think that it is a problem, then they will deal with it.
Guys, dont forget there is a huge difference between losing packets and sending less packets... As soon as you fill your upload bandwith; you will start losing or choking packets... If someone wanna exploit it, let him come; I know he wont be registering hits as much as before... <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
<!--QuoteBegin-gazOzz+Feb 22 2005, 04:15 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td><b>QUOTE</b> (gazOzz @ Feb 22 2005, 04:15 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'><!--QuoteEBegin--> That's why cmdrate is highly exploitable... minimum cmdrate that can be set is 10; which is far too low... There is a serverside cvar for setting minimum cmdrate thus server admins can increase the limit... However it is broken and has no effect on client's settings... Ive been informed about a AMX plugin that fixes minimum cmdrate cvar...
Devs either have to lock min cmdrate to 30; or fix broken mincmdrate command... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd--> there is no plugin which fixes it. Ive searched everywhere for it, and I have asked plugin creators to code it, but the devs need to fix the cvar first.
Comments
<img src='http://www.virtualteachercentre.ca/Literacy/images/read_suceed.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
That would be a high, not low ex_interp value <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> (not to mention that doesn't work due to hit detection being done via the server backlog not clientside) <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
i think you need to <img src='http://www.virtualteachercentre.ca/Literacy/images/read_suceed.jpg' border='0' alt='user posted image' /> also.
Try to read and understand instead of blindly defending your ideas; which infact most of them are crap... Accepting your faults is a mature act... I know you can do it... <!--emo&:)--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/smile-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Oh, okay. So what does cl_updaterate have to do with this? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ack, you're right... I mixed it up :| <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
What? Now I'm just confused... Would I teleport around on other players' screens with a low cl_updaterate, and would that also make them teleport around on my screen? Or would the latter only happen if I set a low cl_cmdrate? Or is it the other way around?
<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo-->
Oh, okay. So what does cl_updaterate have to do with this? <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Ack, you're right... I mixed it up :| <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
What? Now I'm just confused... Would I teleport around on other players' screens with a low cl_updaterate, and would that also make them teleport around on my screen? Or would the latter only happen if I set a low cl_cmdrate? Or is it the other way around?
<!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--emo&???--><img src='http://www.unknownworlds.com/forums/html/emoticons/confused-fix.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='confused-fix.gif' /><!--endemo--> <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
Humz, sorry for the confusion... I'm getting awfully unsure myself now.
cl_updaterate is the rate by which the client recieves updates from the server.
cl_cmdrate is the rate by which the server recieves updates from the client.
A low cmdrate would make that player teleport when other people percieve him.
I'll leave it at that, since the rest of my ramblings would be speculations >_>
cl_cmdrate determines number of updates the client gonna send to server per second... lowering cl_cmdrate will increase the teleporting of the client in others sight... It effects all the players that has higher updaterate than your cmdrate in the server... They all see you teleporting around...
That's why cmdrate is highly exploitable... minimum cmdrate that can be set is 10; which is far too low... There is a serverside cvar for setting minimum cmdrate thus server admins can increase the limit... However it is broken and has no effect on client's settings... Ive been informed about a AMX plugin that fixes minimum cmdrate cvar...
Devs either have to lock min cmdrate to 30; or fix broken mincmdrate command...
I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background.
I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Anything that causes exploiting to be a huge inconvenience instead of a matter of bringing down the console is a good thing in my book...
So a low cl_cmdrate has no bad effects on the user? Like, if you shoot and get bitten at almost the same time, youre not going to hit with your shot because youre registered as dead before the packet containing the shot info arrives?
When I play on US servers I get a somewhat stable 150-ish ping and hit-reg is horrible, it feels just like in the olden days when server load was a huge issue. It's a fair bet that it's more annoying for you than any one else.
I use cmdrate 51 and i even "warp" ingame with a low upload-stream in background. <!--QuoteEnd--></td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Exactly. If you are seeding a torrent in the background, close to your upload speed cap, then you will teleport around, regardless of what's going on in your NS settings, or a server's NS settings. If someone really wants to exploit like that, they will always be able to do so, but the holes in NS itself should be blocked.
If you think someone is exploiting lag, then tell the server admins. If they think that it is a problem, then they will deal with it.
Devs either have to lock min cmdrate to 30; or fix broken mincmdrate command... <!--QuoteEnd--> </td></tr></table><div class='postcolor'> <!--QuoteEEnd-->
there is no plugin which fixes it. Ive searched everywhere for it, and I have asked plugin creators to code it, but the devs need to fix the cvar first.
<b>PLEASE DEVS, TAKE NOTICE OF THIS</b>