K/D in competition leaderboards suggestion
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Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177320Members
Join Date: 2013-01-03 Member: 177320Members
On this site:http://www.ensl.org/contests/current
Would it be possible to also have a column that shows the aggregate K/D's? I know K/D doesn't tell the whole story but I'd be interested to see its correlation coefficient with win/draw/losses.
Would it be possible to also have a column that shows the aggregate K/D's? I know K/D doesn't tell the whole story but I'd be interested to see its correlation coefficient with win/draw/losses.
Comments
Moral of the story is that most of the time you can tell whose going to win solely based on the teams aggregated KDR.
I actually find it's the people who are not that good at getting high K/D's say it "means nothing", when clearly it does.
But I certainly agree with your nuanced point.
-Kill res collectors with little regard to my own life
-Sit building a phase till the last possible second
-I would happily throw myself at the exo as a skulk if it means the onos had a chance of escaping.
Unless I'm an exo. Then you will see just how good I am at base defence. :P
And my K/d is mostly still positive. I really don't think it matters.
i believe there's a point between public and competitive play where it's more important to focus on improving "game sense" because it's not readily apparent to people who are starting out on competitive ns2, thus my comment on the thread of some guy who tried an ENSL gather for the first time and complained about his kdr being bad.
it's only after they get how games are played out in competitive that their kdr will improve as a whole and benefit not just them but the team they're playing in, as well as appreciate the true purpose of having a high aggregate kdr in the first place.
mah 4 cents.
i think you misunderstood my definition of game sense. game sense is more of field positioning, knowing what to do (recap when res are low on marines, protect your rts as aliens, what structure to hit first), where to go, holding good locations, don't stand on infestation if possible, moving and starting engagements as a team, reporting field information accurately, stuff like that. stuff competitive players deem as common sense.
this is also why despite most competitive players knowing how to comm if needed, only a select few excel in that role, even if they are not highly skilled at shooting/playing alien lifeforms, because they have the highest game sense. if the comm doesn't know what to do (or not up to par with his opponent) the entire team loses direction or strategic advantage. you can compensate that with high kdr aggregates, but it still might not win you the game.
imagine a 50 0 fade swiping some random armory (specifically armory, not even obs, arms lab or power node) while his hive is going to get attacked by jp sgs in 15 seconds. exaggerated and will almost always never happen in competitive, but that's my point. think chess on a lower level.
this sounds trivial to a lot of us because we're already past that stage of learning and we know what to do and how to react to different situations. but if you tried bringing a pubber into comp play, you'll understand where i'm coming from.
in my region where competitive players are few (barely enough to run a gather unless it's peak time during weekends, much less form a team) and my pubbers are joining servers all over the world instead of local servers, i have to constantly try to introduce whatever local pubbers i can get my hands on to competitive to keep things alive (and to improve myself).
my previous post is a summation of my experience bringing them pubbers into competitive and what i feel is most important to them as a new competitive player. i agree that high kdr aggregate wins you games most of the time and i'm not trying to disprove it, but the other side of the coin is that new players almost always take that information the wrong way (this is why we have pubstars and people who worship pubstars).
that's 12 cents.
Game sense, strategy, coordination, etc are all important comp skills that pub players looking to get into competitive NS2 need to learn. But the ability to achieve a high KDR is an absolutely critical component if you want to beat more than the worst comp teams.
That's exactly what I've been talking to my team, but they still believe in "strategy > skill". Unfortunately, strategy doesn't work if the team can't hold the necessary positions on the map.
in competitive play the typical engagements are focused around RTs, obviously if those engagements are won then it will be pretty much the deciding factor in games so it's not that hard to believe really
What do you think about a KDR per time scatterplot average with one scatterplot/line for winners and one scatterplot/line for losers. I'd be curious to see how the first half of a game's KDR influences win or loss. Also maybe some plot of KDR per time for winners/losers of marines. And a third for KDR per time for winners/losers of Aliens.
I think much of the KDR/win/loss can be attributed to the compounding effect of NS2's gameplay. It's a chicken and the egg kind of thing. Is the higher KDR causing the win or is the win causing the higher KDR? I think it's both, but unsure as to which situation is more responsible for the graphs in this thread.
Unfortunately, getting the kills per time from the ns2stats website is a tedious process, as I don't have direct access to the data. I'm thinking of just counting either how the first 10-20 kills or the number of kills within the first 2-3 min is distributed, as I suspect that is the most critical time when having a high KDR can affect the outcome of a game.