Onos kills power too fast

flyjumflyjum Join Date: 2012-01-07 Member: 139849Posts: 111Members
Out of the 12 or so marine loses I have had when playing and winning 6 or so times this way
Onos rushing main base power node is too powerful

I like the fact that he got a buff by this but the main base power node needs more HP
Maybe make it scale based off how many buildings are attached to it so the marine team does not die to this everytime

You cant even beacon fast enough to stop it seems
«1

Comments

  • RisingSunRisingSun Rising Join Date: 2004-04-19 Member: 28015Posts: 892Members, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow
    edited May 2012
    QUOTE (flyjum @ May 4 2012, 07:59 AM) »
    Out of the 12 or so marine loses I have had when playing and winning 6 or so times this way
    Onos rushing main base power node is too powerful

    I like the fact that he got a buff by this but the main base power node needs more HP
    Maybe make it scale based off how many buildings are attached to it so the marine team does not die to this everytime

    You cant even beacon fast enough to stop it seems


    Thank the public players for this change. If you (and by you i dont mean the op) whine about marine turtling they will do something drastic like this. A giant Hello Kitty Bandaid. Screw fixing the actual problem.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • ImbalanxdImbalanxd Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Posts: 1,803Members
    Place a power pack next to your IPs or your Observatory. You don't want to spend the res? Then suffer the consequences.
  • _Necro__Necro_ Join Date: 2011-02-15 Member: 81895Posts: 1,903Members, Reinforced - Shadow
    Yeah really. Instead of making the same mistake again and again, until you blame the game in the forums, how about using your brain to figure out, what to do against it.

    Maybe powerpacks for IPs?
    Or maybe your whole team wasn't able to kill an onos. Because no one played as a team?
    Maybe the game was already over and you lost because the skill of your team was lower than that of the enemy?
    If you play a game, you can lose it. Stop blaming the way you lose. There has to be a way to end a game. And an onos crushing your power node is not a bad way to lose.
  • TrCTrC Join Date: 2008-11-30 Member: 65612Posts: 1,024Members
    QUOTE (flyjum @ May 4 2012, 09:59 AM) »
    Out of the 12 or so marine loses I have had when playing and winning 6 or so times this way
    Onos rushing main base power node is too powerful

    I like the fact that he got a buff by this but the main base power node needs more HP
    Maybe make it scale based off how many buildings are attached to it so the marine team does not die to this everytime

    You cant even beacon fast enough to stop it seems

    Is this your limit, start thinking and prevail.
    image
    #exertus / #team.fantasy @ Quakenet
  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    Don't worry, exosuit will fix everything :D
    In Game: Champloo
    Check out my YouTube
    Steam URL: http://steamcommunity.com/id/champloomusashi/
  • cake.cake. Join Date: 2012-01-12 Member: 140165Posts: 158Members
    I love the answers in this thread. There are plenty of ways of prevent/ coming out of a situation like that. Although i have to agree that with such a buff for the onos against power nodes, it seems a bit excessive that marines have to wait so much time before they can start repairing the node.
  • ImbalanxdImbalanxd Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Posts: 1,803Members
    QUOTE (cake. @ May 4 2012, 02:34 PM) »
    I love the answers in this thread. There are plenty of ways of prevent/ coming out of a situation like that. Although i have to agree that with such a buff for the onos against power nodes, it seems a bit excessive that marines have to wait so much time before they can start repairing the node.


    I would really like to see power packs more widely used, especially in areas which are already powered, which would address this abundant dependence on a very vulnerable structure. However I understand how difficult it is to fork out substantial resources on something that might be needed.

    I think it would be cool if an idea of "additional power" was introduced, where a structure was being powered by more than one source. So, for example, if marine spawn had an active power node, and the Infantry Portal had a power pack attached to it, marines would spawn in 15% faster. An observatory with two power sources would regain energy faster. An arms lab would research upgrades faster. All this in addition to providing emergency power in the event of a power node being destroyed. I don't even think the cost of the power pack would need to be changed, as 15 res is quite steep at the moment.
  • RoTTeRoTTe Join Date: 2012-03-14 Member: 148764Posts: 31Members
    QUOTE (Imbalanxd @ May 4 2012, 05:49 AM) »
    An observatory with two power sources would regain energy faster.



    plus one.
  • extolloextollo Ping Blip Join Date: 2010-07-16 Member: 72457Posts: 365Members
    on its face it seems to violate the 'no game ending tech' rule. BUT if it can be countered by smart marine play, then it is not. There will be some capabilities in this game that are overwhelming if unchecked. I want that.

    Your point though: if games always play out / end the same way, then its a problem. I wouldnt be too concerned about this particular balance problem until the game is feature complete.
  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    QUOTE (jbaker8935 @ May 4 2012, 04:58 AM) »
    on its face it seems to violate the 'no game ending tech' rule. BUT if it can be countered by smart marine play, then it is not. There will be some capabilities in this game that are overwhelming if unchecked. I want that.

    Your point though: if games always play out / end the same way, then its a problem. I wouldnt be too concerned about this particular balance problem until the game is feature complete.

    Marines do not have the capacity to kill two onos before they destroy the node, even if the commander beacons all of his marines. That being said, the new power packs can enable you to have an emergency backup to beacon, however I do not know how it functions since your comm chair would be without power; thus you may need two power packs as back ups. That's pretty redundant, however because the marine IPs will be nonfunctional, so you would also need 2 extra, bringing the total to 4 so that marines have a fail-safe. That's 60 team rez, which is pretty expensive considering it doesn't even guarantee safety from an onos rush which is the more pressing matter here.
    In Game: Champloo
    Check out my YouTube
    Steam URL: http://steamcommunity.com/id/champloomusashi/
  • matsomatso Master of Patches Join Date: 2002-11-05 Member: 7000Posts: 1,464Members, NS2 Developer, Constellation, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Silver, Reinforced - Shadow, Community Dev Team
    QUOTE (Champlo0 @ May 4 2012, 03:47 PM) »
    Marines do not have the capacity to kill two onos before they destroy the node, even if the commander beacons all of his marines. That being said, the new power packs can enable you to have an emergency backup to beacon, however I do not know how it functions since your comm chair would be without power; thus you may need two power packs as back ups. That's pretty redundant, however because the marine IPs will be nonfunctional, so you would also need 2 extra, bringing the total to 4 so that marines have a fail-safe. That's 60 team rez, which is pretty expensive considering it doesn't even guarantee safety from an onos rush which is the more pressing matter here.


    20 res worth of armories around the power node is probably more helpful.
    Did performance optimizations for UWE summer/autumn 2012. Not currently employed by UWE.
  • CorpseyCorpsey Join Date: 2011-07-02 Member: 107538Posts: 266Members
    I don't get why people complain about balance in a game that's not feature complete.
  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    QUOTE (matso @ May 4 2012, 09:19 AM) »
    20 res worth of armories around the power node is probably more helpful.

    Because marines should obviously have to wall in just to protect their power node.
    In Game: Champloo
    Check out my YouTube
    Steam URL: http://steamcommunity.com/id/champloomusashi/
  • ScardyBobScardyBob ScardyBob Join Date: 2009-11-25 Member: 69528Posts: 4,983Forum Admins, Forum Moderators, NS2 Playtester, Squad Five Blue, Reinforced - Shadow, WC 2013 - Shadow mod
    I wouldn't mind seeing the powernodes being rebuildable immediately after being destroyed again (or with a shorter delay of like 5s) since they can be killed quicker via the onos.
  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    I don't see why we can't get stronger power nodes for tech point power nodes. Or individually upgrade power nodes with like 10 tres to make them twice as durable. Something like that would be appropriate.
    In Game: Champloo
    Check out my YouTube
    Steam URL: http://steamcommunity.com/id/champloomusashi/
  • Shrike3OShrike3O Join Date: 2002-11-03 Member: 6678Posts: 718Members, Constellation
    QUOTE (Champlo0 @ May 4 2012, 12:32 PM) »
    I don't see why we can't get stronger power nodes for tech point power nodes. Or individually upgrade power nodes with like 10 tres to make them twice as durable. Something like that would be appropriate.

    I'm a big fan of this idea.
  • peregrinusperegrinus Join Date: 2010-07-16 Member: 72445Posts: 2,426Members
    edited May 2012
    I think the idea of powernodes is complex enough...plus we have power packs...so I dunno if adding more options to powernodes is a good idea and it's pretty dull right? I mean, you don't see anything or do anything you would just spend res and the powernode would get more health.

    I prefer if marines can do things creatively like placing mines on powernodes, or aiming sentries at them, or beaconing when the power is threatened.

    What about electrify - would people like to see that brought back from NS1?
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • Champlo0Champlo0 Join Date: 2012-04-17 Member: 150617Posts: 465Members
    QUOTE (peregrinus @ May 4 2012, 02:14 PM) »
    I think the idea of powernodes is complex enough...plus we have power packs...so I dunno if adding more options to powernodes is a good idea and it's pretty dull right? I mean, you don't see anything or do anything you would just spend res and the powernode would get more health.

    I prefer if marines can do things creatively like placing mines on powernodes, or aiming sentries at them, or beaconing when the power is threatened.

    What about electrify - would people like to see that brought back from NS1?

    What is that, damaging aliens for attacking it? Sounds like it would be an interesting function as a commander support ability.

    Also, thinking about it a flamethrower might be able to stop an onos from attacking it for a bit, though I never play in games with flamethrowers cause they're so bloody expensive. Maybe we could have electrify zap an aliens energy from attacking a structure for a certain time frame?
    In Game: Champloo
    Check out my YouTube
    Steam URL: http://steamcommunity.com/id/champloomusashi/
  • ZekZek Join Date: 2002-11-10 Member: 7962Posts: 4,596Members, NS1 Playtester, Constellation, Reinforced - Shadow
    edited May 2012
    I cringed when I saw in the video summary that the power node dying faster was the solution to base stalemates. In my opinion, bumrushing the power node to kill the base in one shot is the least fun way for the game to end, both for aliens and for marines. It's much more entertaining for everybody when aliens actually break down the front door, and if they're having a hard time doing that then that's what should be fixed.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
  • flyjumflyjum Join Date: 2012-01-07 Member: 139849Posts: 111Members
    3 of the games I lost I asked the Commander 4 times to place IPs at the 2nd base(which had a CC) even waited around for a full min for them

    He said they are a waste of money or just ignored it.
  • Core DumpCore Dump Join Date: 2011-07-11 Member: 109768Posts: 24Members
    It's really tough right now, I guess you could use powerpacks or try to wall in but that shouldn't be a necessity, it pretty much is now.
  • Master BlasterMaster Blaster Join Date: 2012-03-17 Member: 148908Posts: 264Banned
    QUOTE (RisingSun @ May 4 2012, 01:07 AM) »
    Thank the public players for this change. If you (and by you i dont mean the op) whine about marine turtling they will do something drastic like this. A giant Hello Kitty Bandaid. Screw fixing the actual problem.


    I only play on public servers and am not part of a clan.

    Does this mean I am the cause of all the bad things in the world?
  • TweadleTweadle Join Date: 2005-02-03 Member: 39686Posts: 855Members, NS2 Map Tester
    QUOTE (Zek @ May 5 2012, 01:06 AM) »
    bumrushing the power node to kill the base in one shot is the least fun way for the game to end, both for aliens and for marines.

    Yup. Also, did you know that people actually think that adds to strategy?
  • ImbalanxdImbalanxd Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Posts: 1,803Members
    QUOTE (Tweadle @ May 6 2012, 11:04 PM) »
    Yup. Also, did you know that people actually think that adds to strategy?


    Giving weak opponents vulnerability massively deducts from the strategy required to beat them.

    Giving strong opponents vulnerability massively increases the strategy they implement to survive.
  • TweadleTweadle Join Date: 2005-02-03 Member: 39686Posts: 855Members, NS2 Map Tester
    I literally laughed out loud at that logic.
  • KrackKrack Join Date: 2008-01-16 Member: 63424Posts: 2Members
    QUOTE (Champlo0 @ May 4 2012, 11:32 AM) »
    I don't see why we can't get stronger power nodes for tech point power nodes. Or individually upgrade power nodes with like 10 tres to make them twice as durable. Something like that would be appropriate.



    QUOTE (Shrike3O @ May 4 2012, 12:05 PM) »
    I'm a big fan of this idea.




    I am also a big fan of this idea,
    however for 20 tres. and maybe not double durability.

    Also am a fan of the electrify idea. additional 15-20 tres.

    Also am a fan of the optional adrenaline-draining electricity. In place of just outright damage (which helps in case of multiple onos attacking the power node, since just electricity damage will not really hurt onos but will effectively deter skulks).


    Also, how about
    Power packs : support a circular radius of buildings (maybe at lower effectiveness with more buildings it powers).
    This way it can be used to power cc+ip+obs maybe. under-powered buildings will work slower.



    Or,,,,,
    how about an onos trap that falls from the ceiling.
  • XariusXarius Join Date: 2003-12-21 Member: 24630Posts: 2,186Members
    You should be able to 'fortify' your powernode in base, making it harder to be taken down by an onos rush. It's an annoying mechanic for sure.
    Steamname: Unkn0wn
  • ogzogz Join Date: 2002-11-24 Member: 9765Posts: 646Members
    By fortify, did you mean nanoshield?
  • ImbalanxdImbalanxd Join Date: 2011-06-15 Member: 104581Posts: 1,803Members
    QUOTE (ogz @ May 8 2012, 03:06 PM) »
    By fortify, did you mean nanoshield?


    Ye, a power node with nano-shield on takes a single Onos 30 seconds to destroy. I think that's perfectly acceptable given that an Onos costs 75 res. Not to mention the fact that 2 MACs (10 res investment) can fully repair a power node from 1% to 100% in a little under 10 seconds. Sure, they're easy to kill (2 Onos hits), but they are a nuisance and will slow the attackers down. Even if, after all that, the power node somehow manages to go down, auxiliary power packs will keep the important parts of your base working as normal. And EVEN THEN, the loss of power in a main base does not insure defeat.

    I think its pretty much fine to be honest.
  • Master BlasterMaster Blaster Join Date: 2012-03-17 Member: 148908Posts: 264Banned
    edited May 2012
    QUOTE (Imbalanxd @ May 8 2012, 06:12 AM) »
    Ye, a power node with nano-shield on takes a single Onos 30 seconds to destroy. I think that's perfectly acceptable given that an Onos costs 75 res. Not to mention the fact that 2 MACs (10 res investment) can fully repair a power node from 1% to 100% in a little under 10 seconds. Sure, they're easy to kill (2 Onos hits), but they are a nuisance and will slow the attackers down. Even if, after all that, the power node somehow manages to go down, auxiliary power packs will keep the important parts of your base working as normal. And EVEN THEN, the loss of power in a main base does not insure defeat.

    I think its pretty much fine to be honest.


    I know you are trolling the forum but:

    You must not command much.

    Power packs cost 15 resources each and power one structure. If you have resources for that, then you already won the game anyway.

    Macs die in 2 seconds.

    It is very easy for one onos to kill the power to any base now.

    This is MASSIVE overkill compared to the power of onos in NS1.

    ALSO IT's "ENSURE" not "INSURE" get back in school.
    Post edited by Unknown User on
«1
Sign In or Register to comment.